Son Goku
04-14-03, 06:20 PM
I found this tale most qute this morning, in a rather ironic sort of way. First for a little background.
Down here in New Mexico there are various different universities/colleges. I'm going to 2 of them, and this so happens to involve both. However in the case of UNM, it has more to do with the workforce development branch, not the university branch which I attend.
In any case, both places can teach Oracle cert classes, but have very different arrangements with Oracle.
- UNM workforce development works in a for-profit capacity and charges each student $1,600 per class. Note that in the university I pay about $150 per credit hour, and most classes are 3 credit hours. The classes I take carry college credit, workforce development classes don't, are also different colleges with different deans, etc...
A portion of this money goes back to Oracle, but they keep most of it...and as part of the agreement for workforce development they have to purchase paper copies of the books/manuals from Oracle...part of the money Oracle gets back) as part of the agreement.
The other place, is part of the Oracle Educational Initiative, and teaches this in a not-for-profit capacity. They charge $20 to register for the semester, nothing additional for the course, and so don't make a profit off of it. As part of this different program, they get the PDF files for the manuals and can print them off, with a copyright release granted directly from Oracle which each student receives a copy of (to take to Kinkos or wherever else).
- Anyhow, the people at UNM workforce development were complaining about "how dare those people down there offer classes without charging the $1,600 we do" (different group of people, those rellocating jobs and getting government benefits to help them find a new job, vs college students who are paying their own way, etc...OK yes there is financial aid for those who can need assistance with going to college) and started blowing a stink about "them stealing money from us".
They also made issue with the other place (where I'm actually taking Oracle DBA1 currently) giving us PDFs to print off, and started sending out false information to try to scare people away from taking it there, reporting to the business office the only reason they aren't successful is because "those scounderals are taking our students" and printing off PDF files, etc.
- Only thing is, the printing off of PDF files is per the instructions of a different program and permission granted by an Oracle copyright release form which comes with this different program...
- So when things got a bit heated, my teacher in this class, who was a former Oracle employee and knew just who to contact called them up, explained the situation to them and the waves being made, and inquired.
- The Oracle rep he spoke with had indicated
1. "No you people are doing an excellent job, and there is absolutely nothing wrong in what you are doing. Yes, all you are doing and everything the people in workforce development are complaining about is in fact part of your contract and approved by us."
2. "If they are really charging $1,600 per course, then they are charging way in excess of what other people under their own current contract charge. Thing is, you take it from us, you pay $2,000...however in this agreement, most people only charge a reduced rate of $800 of which they get to keep a portion, and a portion comes back to us.
What is being charged here is 2x what most everyone else working under their particular contract and program are charging."
3. "So are you serious? Have they been teaching these courses on site at companies directly? This is most directly a breach of their own contractual agreement, and is taking money away from Oracle University. We aren't exactly pleased to here this."
The person said she'd give the guy an email after she looks into it...and yet hasn't gotten back yet. It sounds like, from what he was guessing that something is going on inside Oracle, and they might in fact be closely investigating those who first complained/tried to make trouble for the other people.
This was the same place where (when he used to work there) and got people in his classes who for instance would have to do a backup and recovery of a database by command line (but had never seen a command line interface in their life before), he inquired about it, mentioning that in no way could such students get anything from this $1,600 class they were being charged for (at tax payer expense mind you).
He was promptly told to "shut up and sit down, we need the money". And though the dean might be on a government council deciding these things, and able to prevent a government review of these practices, there is nothing he can do if Oracle decides to take action for their own breech of contract, exposed only after they tried to create trouble/make waves for another institution first.
I find this irronically funny... Perhaps if someone is doing something wrong, they shouldn't be so quick to point the finger of accusation at other people, hoping something will be done about the other person, place, institution, etc...
Down here in New Mexico there are various different universities/colleges. I'm going to 2 of them, and this so happens to involve both. However in the case of UNM, it has more to do with the workforce development branch, not the university branch which I attend.
In any case, both places can teach Oracle cert classes, but have very different arrangements with Oracle.
- UNM workforce development works in a for-profit capacity and charges each student $1,600 per class. Note that in the university I pay about $150 per credit hour, and most classes are 3 credit hours. The classes I take carry college credit, workforce development classes don't, are also different colleges with different deans, etc...
A portion of this money goes back to Oracle, but they keep most of it...and as part of the agreement for workforce development they have to purchase paper copies of the books/manuals from Oracle...part of the money Oracle gets back) as part of the agreement.
The other place, is part of the Oracle Educational Initiative, and teaches this in a not-for-profit capacity. They charge $20 to register for the semester, nothing additional for the course, and so don't make a profit off of it. As part of this different program, they get the PDF files for the manuals and can print them off, with a copyright release granted directly from Oracle which each student receives a copy of (to take to Kinkos or wherever else).
- Anyhow, the people at UNM workforce development were complaining about "how dare those people down there offer classes without charging the $1,600 we do" (different group of people, those rellocating jobs and getting government benefits to help them find a new job, vs college students who are paying their own way, etc...OK yes there is financial aid for those who can need assistance with going to college) and started blowing a stink about "them stealing money from us".
They also made issue with the other place (where I'm actually taking Oracle DBA1 currently) giving us PDFs to print off, and started sending out false information to try to scare people away from taking it there, reporting to the business office the only reason they aren't successful is because "those scounderals are taking our students" and printing off PDF files, etc.
- Only thing is, the printing off of PDF files is per the instructions of a different program and permission granted by an Oracle copyright release form which comes with this different program...
- So when things got a bit heated, my teacher in this class, who was a former Oracle employee and knew just who to contact called them up, explained the situation to them and the waves being made, and inquired.
- The Oracle rep he spoke with had indicated
1. "No you people are doing an excellent job, and there is absolutely nothing wrong in what you are doing. Yes, all you are doing and everything the people in workforce development are complaining about is in fact part of your contract and approved by us."
2. "If they are really charging $1,600 per course, then they are charging way in excess of what other people under their own current contract charge. Thing is, you take it from us, you pay $2,000...however in this agreement, most people only charge a reduced rate of $800 of which they get to keep a portion, and a portion comes back to us.
What is being charged here is 2x what most everyone else working under their particular contract and program are charging."
3. "So are you serious? Have they been teaching these courses on site at companies directly? This is most directly a breach of their own contractual agreement, and is taking money away from Oracle University. We aren't exactly pleased to here this."
The person said she'd give the guy an email after she looks into it...and yet hasn't gotten back yet. It sounds like, from what he was guessing that something is going on inside Oracle, and they might in fact be closely investigating those who first complained/tried to make trouble for the other people.
This was the same place where (when he used to work there) and got people in his classes who for instance would have to do a backup and recovery of a database by command line (but had never seen a command line interface in their life before), he inquired about it, mentioning that in no way could such students get anything from this $1,600 class they were being charged for (at tax payer expense mind you).
He was promptly told to "shut up and sit down, we need the money". And though the dean might be on a government council deciding these things, and able to prevent a government review of these practices, there is nothing he can do if Oracle decides to take action for their own breech of contract, exposed only after they tried to create trouble/make waves for another institution first.
I find this irronically funny... Perhaps if someone is doing something wrong, they shouldn't be so quick to point the finger of accusation at other people, hoping something will be done about the other person, place, institution, etc...