Long time nV user gets a 9500Pro

[Matthyahuw]

I hate it...

[StealthHawk]

care to elaborate on why you hate it? and what you upgraded from?

[Matthyahuw]

well, if you MUST know...

had a Ti4200

It's slower (when I don't use AA/AF, which I rarely use cuz my CPU is older, can't afford the hit)

Can't overclock it w/o hacking the BIOS (not gonna)

Can't run Dungeon siege

getting odd results in some benchies

get BSODs cuz of ati2dvag.dll

and YES, before you asked, It's a clean drive, reformatted.
Latest drivers of everything, installed in the right order.
I tried tricks like disabling FW, dropping back to AGP 4x, upped the volts...still crappy...

[otheipion]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
well, if you MUST know...

had a Ti4200

It's slower (when I don't use AA/AF, which I rarely use cuz my CPU is older, can't afford the hit)

Can't overclock it w/o hacking the BIOS (not gonna)

Can't run Dungeon siege

getting odd results in some benchies

get BSODs cuz of ati2dvag.dll

and YES, before you asked, It's a clean drive, reformatted.
Latest drivers of everything, installed in the right order.
I tried tricks like disabling FW, dropping back to AGP 4x, upped the volts...still crappy...
Sounds like you've found what you were looking for. :rolleyes:

[GlowStick]

If you really are dissatafied can you return it? From a 4200 to a 9500pro id just hold out for a NV35 or so!

[Matthyahuw]

Originally posted by otheipion
Sounds like you've found what you were looking for. :rolleyes: ummmmmmm........................ya................

[Gator]

can you tell us your other system specs? Maybe your PC isn't up to par for R9500. I think the GF4TI is a little more forgiving in hardware requirements

as for dungeon seige, try posting at rage3d pc gaming section, maybe there is patch available?

[Dazz]

Yeah what board are you running? I know the R300 cards don't like the SIS648 & KT400 boards.

[StealthHawk]

sorry to hear about all those problems Matthy :(

[DaveBaumann]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
[B]It's slower (when I don't use AA/AF, which I rarely use cuz my CPU is older, can't afford the hit)

Ummm, AF/AA are not in any way CPU dependant, so if you have an older CPU then it should essentially be 'for free' because you are probably wasting the potential of the graphics board.

Can't run Dungeon siege

Odd. I've run Numerous R3x0 reviews with many revisions of drivers all using DS as a benchmark - no issues.

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by DaveBaumann
Ummm, AF/AA are not in any way CPU dependant, so if you have an older CPU then it should essentially be 'for free' because you are probably wasting the potential of the graphics board.

I think his complaint is that his CPU is pretty old so that his raw benchmark scores aren't nearly as high as they could be, but it is fast enough that FSAA/AF still takes a hit.

[jbirney]

Originally posted by StealthHawk
I think his complaint is that his CPU is pretty old so that his raw benchmark scores aren't nearly as high as they could be, but it is fast enough that FSAA/AF still takes a hit.

That still does not make much sense. If his CPU is slow but fast enough to take a hit? AF/AA are all video card related I dont see how it CPU can be slow enough to effect these? I have installed and tested a bunch of 9500pro on CPUs from 2 ghz+ down to 1 ghz. Each time you could run with AA/AF at decent frame rates. I know that a slower CPU will lower the non AA/AF scores. But still does not make sense as dave pointed out...

I am not saying he does not have an issues and he could have a bad card. I am just saying from my past experince I have not seen these types of issues yet...

[ATI LoVeR 9700]

This thread should be called "Long time nV user still nVidiot"

How the hell can your Geforce4 TI 4200 be faster?! You need to have AA and AF on to bench the card. If you don't like AA or AF or your CPU sucks don't use a R3XX or NV3X card.

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by ATI LoVeR 9700
You need to have AA and AF on to bench the card.

That has to be one of the single most assinine statements I've ever come across on this forum. No one needs to have AA and AF to do anything, from benchmarking to gaming. And notice how this wasn't his only complaint. Maybe you should try giving him some suggestions on how he might be able to get his card to work.

Have you tried any of the modified Radeon sets (Omega, et al)? Have you tried using the Catalyst 3.0 or 3.1 drivers? The 3.2 set gave me all kinds of problems. I don't have DS myself, but all my other games, from NFS to UT2003 work fine on the 3.1s.

[ATI LoVeR 9700]

Originally posted by saturnotaku
That has to be one of the single most assinine statements I've ever come across on this forum. No one needs to have AA and AF to do anything, from benchmarking to gaming. And notice how this wasn't his only complaint. Maybe you should try giving him some suggestions on how he might be able to get his card to work.

Have you tried any of the modified Radeon sets (Omega, et al)? Have you tried using the Catalyst 3.0 or 3.1 drivers? The 3.2 set gave me all kinds of problems. I don't have DS myself, but all my other games, from NFS to UT2003 work fine on the 3.1s.

My theory is who the hell buys a card when they don't use it's features and then say it sucks. He didn't give us any details. He walks in "I hate it."

If you don't use AF and AA don't buy a highend card! Just don't! If he doesn't use AF and AA how can he say the Geforce4 is a better performing card...

Matt, what CPU and motherboard do you have. The Radeon 9500 is a way better card than any Geforce4 in every aspect. It should be solid as a rock. It won't outperform a Geforce4 when you have nothing running, but it has free perfmance AF and cheap AA.

[Matthyahuw]

Originally posted by ATI LoVeR 9700
Matt, what CPU and motherboard do you have. The Radeon 9500 is a way better card than any Geforce4 in every aspect. It should be solid as a rock. It won't outperform a Geforce4 when you have nothing running, but it has free perfmance AF and cheap AA. Soltek nF2 2.03 drivers (no IDE drivers installed)
768MB RAM
AXP 1800+
BRAND NEW Antec 380 True power
DX9.0a
Cat 3.2 drivers

And yes it's for a review as well...and yes I know what I'm doing, I've installed more hardware and software than most here w/o issue.

Yes, it IS faster with AA/AF on than a Ti4200...still not 60fps in the games I like cuz on my CPU limit...

RTCW @ 1280x1024
4200 61.1 w/ 2x/2x 39.6
9500 56.2 w/ 2x2x 50.4

UT2003 1280x960
4200 47 w/ 2x2x 26
9500 36.8 w/ 2x2x 36.8 (CPU limit, but CPU limit for 4200 is higher, bad drivers maybe?)

You ever bench a 9500Pro with Vulpine? getting the oddest results.

Vupine 1280x960
4200 66.8 w/ 2x2x 38.7
9500 35.1 w/ 2x2x 51.4

yes, that's real, I've tried it 20 times, and with a clean system...

The only thing the 9500Pro wins overall is 3DM03...

[Matthyahuw]

I walked in and said "I hate it" to parody the other posts of , LOOK AT ME, I MOVED TO ATI, AND I'M NOT GOING BACK!

well, I'm going back...there still are driver issues apparently.

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
I walked in and said "I hate it" to parody the other posts of , LOOK AT ME, I MOVED TO ATI, AND I'M NOT GOING BACK!

well, I'm going back...there still are driver issues apparently.

Yeah, i agree their are driver issues, they still use the same installer as they did with the orginal Radeon, when i saw it, it truthfully did scare me. Such bad memories of that strected and pixleated red background hehe!

I am hopeing 3.3 will fix everything.

[jbirney]

Vupine 1280x960

Stop right there. Vupine uses custom NV calls to use to make use of the Hardware Programmable TnL on the GF3/4/FX cards. These calls don't work on any card but GF3/4/fx thus your force to run these cards in software. Note the 8500/9xxxx cards has this function just they use the standard ARB calls not not the NV ones. Its one of the reason HardOCP dropped it from their Review list. If you lower the res the score will not change for any of the ATI cards on your system.

What level/settings are you using on UT2k3? I get that score for the non-AA/AF on my 1800 xp R8500 system so something is not quite right.

[Matthyahuw]

Not according to Vulpine...

I'm using the "Advanced Features", not "GeForce3 Features"

Advanced features: Requires support for Cube Mapping. Runs on nVidia Geforce and up, and on ATI Radeon and up.

If you show me something, I'll take it off the review list and call it biased...

UT2003 everything on "High" (not maxed), and Physics on Low
As it looks to the chart to me, it's CPU limited, hence the same score for a 9500 and an 8500...

It's a Gigabyte 9500Pro btw...even Gigabyte's own overclocking proggie doesn't work! (I'm guessing it's cuz it used older drivers, but I thought using the Cat 3.2 would put the card in a better light)

I really wanted this card to destroy the nV scores, cuz I really want to get "in" with Gigabyte, but I'm not gonna lie to do it...

[Rogozhin]

It's just fine if you gave it your best shot and don't like the card. That is totally valid and whoever tries to call you an nvidiot is only questioning your "best shot".

I myself could care less whether you keep it or not.

Rogo

[ChrisW]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
I hate it...
Just take it back if you are not satisfied with it. If the 4200 makes you happy then keep it. You can upgrade to a better card later after you upgrade your cpu.

[jbirney]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
Not according to Vulpine...

I'm using the "Advanced Features", not "GeForce3 Features"

If you show me something, I'll take it off the review list and call it biased...

I would not trust a guy posting either. So dont listen to me, but listen Brent over at HardOCP:

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MjY5LDM=
Vulpine's GLMark is an OpenGL benchmark we use to show the advantages of T&L based cards. I used the following settings - Compatibility: Advanced Features; Detail: High; No VSync; Additional Compatibility: Use OpenGL Lighting, Use Texture Compression; Textures: 32bit; Screen Resolution: 32bit Fullscreen

.....

The 8500LE cards don't do well in this benchmark when compared to the GF3 Ti 500. Keep in mind, though, that this benchmark was written with GeForce3 programmability in mind using specific OpenGL instructions for the GF3 so the cross-chipset comparison is not apples to apples. The JoyTech is trailing the ATI 8500LE, showing that memory bandwidth does make a difference.


http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MjY5LDU=

Vulpine's GL Mark showed that if a program is tweaked for certain video cards, it tends to make other video cards not compare well at all.

The reason why I point out this reveiw is that he is using the SAME CPU that you did and the pro was only slighlty faster when in theory it should have been much faster. I aslo can dig up some reviews using a R9700 pro and you will find that they scores about the same no matter the res on Vulpine. I had but lost and email reply from the makers of Vulpine saying in fact that even with out using GF3 features they still use custom NV calls.

BTW the DroneZ benchmark does the same thing (uses custom nV OpenGL calls).

What map did you try that fly by UTk2 bench on and I will try that on mine.

Personally I think there are some issue with the card. I have yet to see a case were the R9500pro did not out prefrom a GFti4200. Not saying your baised, just saying it does not add up nor match to the other reviews out there on the R9500pro

[Hellbinder]

I walked in and said "I hate it" to parody the other posts of , LOOK AT ME, I MOVED TO ATI, AND I'M NOT GOING BACK!

well, I'm going back...there still are driver issues apparently.

This pretty much discredits everything you have posted so far. Driver issues ??? :rolleyes:

I am Quite certain you had no intention whatsoever of giving the 9500pro a fair shake. If you even really own one. There are countless threads at Rage3d and other places of people who even upgraded from a GF4 TI 4600 to a 9500pro and are more than satisfied. With better performance using AA and AF than they ever had. Your own numbers (if they are to be believed) show the same thing.

I do not believe that you correctly installed it. I do not beleive that you used fair benchmark settings on both cards. Its that simple. I would bet 100$ right now that If i were at your house We would see and entirely different set of results and you would be sputtering all over yourself about how.. "yersterday it was messed up" blah blah blah.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Damn are you CPU limited :rolleyes:

I run a 1.5 GHz P4 Willy with a 9700P and run all games fine with AA&AF...