Nvidia Gets a Brutal A$$ Whipping.

[Hellbinder]

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDU2

What more can you say then that? At 450/360 The 9800pro totally Anihilates the FX ultra. Thats with stock cooling. What about water coolers or Seriously huge HSF with great case cooling? im thinking 500 core is going to happen for many people with the means to do it.

When you look at the overclocked scores and how FAR above the Nv30 they are.. It makes you wonder wether the NV35 with AA+AF is really going to be faster? Or pretty much even..

Go Visiontek.

[digitalwanderer]

Hmmm, d'ya think that maybe ATI should have released the 9600 & 9800 at slightly higher clockspeeds than? Y'know, and REALLY trashed nVidia rather than just barely beating them..... ;)

[Hellbinder]

geee ummm... oh... I dont know...

Where on earth would you get such a notion.. ;)

[ragejg]

you are something else, HellBinder...:|

[digitalwanderer]

OMG, I'm loving Brent's review! It spares no punches and is really putting all cards thru what I want to see them do!

One other thing though that I REALLY liked from their "apples & oranges" bit (http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDU2LDI=) :

Editors Note on IQ & Performance
We have spent time with NVIDIA discussing this image quality issue in-depth in the past week. They have explained to us that "Application" mode in the current driver initializes some "debugging" tools that cause the NVIDIA GPU to operate under stress due to the other behind-the-scenes operations it is doing. This of course would suggest that the benchmark scores using NVIDIA's Application mode is returning benchmark scores that are not "on the level" and possibly misrepresenting the card's true abilities. On the other hand, we have found it impossible to truly "match" ATI's base Quality image quality any other way. It is our wish that NVIDIA would step up to the plate and deliver image quality easily comparable to ATI's as we think that ATI is now currently setting the IQ watermark in the industry as it pertains to desktop gaming cards.

Until NVIDIA offers a better driver for a publicly available product, we will continue to use what is posted at NVIDIA.com and we will continue to do our best to deliver benchmarks that show equivalent and acceptable IQ.



(The Dig hugs [H]!)

[Hellbinder]

you are something else, HellBinder...

You are right...

I'm really Bigfoot.... no really... the one from the Patterson film even...

[dohcmark8]

[H]ardOCP forever! Go Sean P.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :D :D

[ragejg]

HB: "I'm really Bigfoot.... no really... the one from the Patterson film even..."

so I've heard...

;)

yeh, you do really gotta stomp on those cardz and poke em with a fork to get the same iq... stinky. Too bad... I'm sure glad I've only *watched* the IQ battle, and learned from those who brought forward true facts the right way... Twas funny, and still is... Helped inflate a lotta post counts and egos... Hence my lowly 500... heh heh ;)...

[ragejg]

and it would have been nice to see the tests with 4XAF... not "instead", but "as well" as 8x...

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by ragejg
I'm sure glad I've only *watched* the IQ battle, and learned from those who brought forward true facts the right way... Twas funny, and still is... Helped inflate a lotta post counts and egos


(The Dig pats his 1K+ post count and over-inflated ego muttering and cackling gleefully, "Good evil nVidia, sweeeeeet evil nVidia...") :p

EDITED BITS: Formatting fix. ;)

[Sazar]

Originally posted by dohcmark8
[H]ardOCP forever! Go Sean P.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :D :D

brent justice wrote that article FYi...

sean has written other stuff :)

credit where credit is due :D

[ATI LoVeR 9700]

Isn't Sean an nVidiot anyways. He's not a bad one, but he's an nV fan. He doesn't like when people elaborate on things. He use to flame me when I typed too much.

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by Hellbinder
http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDU2

What more can you say then that? At 450/360 The 9800pro totally Anihilates the FX ultra. Thats with stock cooling. What about water coolers or Seriously huge HSF with great case cooling? im thinking 500 core is going to happen for many people with the means to do it.

When you look at the overclocked scores and how FAR above the Nv30 they are.. It makes you wonder wether the NV35 with AA+AF is really going to be faster? Or pretty much even..

Go Visiontek.

HellBinder i have 2 questions.

Is there any possibility that HardOCP got cherrypicked board with a heatsink that had more thermal compound applied to it?

I cannot get anyware CLOSE to that wiht my VisionTek board. I hope to break 450mhz core with a aftermarket cooling solution(problay zalman).

Second question!

Did you recently purchase a large quanity of ATi Stock?

[ragejg]

dig you've earned your 1k, man... :)

u make sense to me. ;)

[StealthHawk]

Editors Note on IQ & Performance
We have spent time with NVIDIA discussing this image quality issue in-depth in the past week. They have explained to us that "Application" mode in the current driver initializes some "debugging" tools that cause the NVIDIA GPU to operate under stress due to the other behind-the-scenes operations it is doing. This of course would suggest that the benchmark scores using NVIDIA's Application mode is returning benchmark scores that are not "on the level" and possibly misrepresenting the card's true abilities. On the other hand, we have found it impossible to truly "match" ATI's base Quality image quality any other way. It is our wish that NVIDIA would step up to the plate and deliver image quality easily comparable to ATI's as we think that ATI is now currently setting the IQ watermark in the industry as it pertains to desktop gaming cards.

Until NVIDIA offers a better driver for a publicly available product, we will continue to use what is posted at NVIDIA.com and we will continue to do our best to deliver benchmarks that show equivalent and acceptable IQ.

I can toast to that. :beer:

nvidia shouldn't stoop to using Xabre tricks :mad:

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by ragejg
dig you've earned your 1k, man... :)

u make sense to me. ;)


"Uhm gee, well thanks.", says the Dig digging a small ditch in the dirt with his toe that he studies rather intently...almost TOO intently, like he's trying to ignore his blushing cheeks....

;) :p

[Hellbinder]

HellBinder i have 2 questions.

Is there any possibility that HardOCP got cherrypicked board with a heatsink that had more thermal compound applied to it?

I cannot get anyware CLOSE to that wiht my VisionTek board. I hope to break 450mhz core with a aftermarket cooling solution(problay zalman).

Second question!

Did you recently purchase a large quanity of ATi Stock?

Well of the majority of overclocking examples 440 seems about average. But those were on the initial shipment of cards that had kind of a lame thermal Paste and fan attachment. 440 stock cooling of course. The ones shipping now have a better Thermal Compound etc. So.. Im guessing close to 450 is going to be average for Stock cooling. I am wagering that many a soul with more serious cooling methods will push that by quite a bit.

Why yes.. Not only am i Bigfoot... but I am also the CEO of ATi.. posing as a fanboy on all these forums.. ;)

[GlowStick]

Best i can get is 410 and thats with some speckels

But oviously me buying the card dose not demonstrate what people will get, but the Reviewsites are the non cherry picked cards. CLEARLY

[mreman4k]

[i]-r-a-g-e-j-g-

Pieces/Parts: GA-7VTXE+ & KR7A-133RAID, XP1700JUICB, XP2000AGOIA, *SOLD* my 4200, waitin fer my Geforce FX5200Ultra 128mb, ... anyway... 8500DV, an Audigy and an SBLive!, Samsung & Buffalo DDR, Maxtor & WD 40gb 7.2k HD's, LG DVD, TDK VeloCD... Cybertron and PowerMagic cases, PowerMagic and X-Case PSU's[/B]

WTF??? Why did u sell ur ti 4200 for a fx 5200 Ultra..."magical DX 9 support"...not unless thats a typo I wouldve stayed with the ti 4200.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by ATI LoVeR 9700
Isn't Sean an nVidiot anyways. He's not a bad one, but he's an nV fan. He doesn't like when people elaborate on things. He use to flame me when I typed too much.

Sean is cool, don't know what he likes or not. Heh, I guess everyone gets tired of having people constantly point out things and telling him why he sucks or why he is wrong. I think the guy is excellent at what he does, and I enjoy readin' up on what a friend puts out on any website:D

[ragejg]

Originally posted by mreman4k
WTF??? Why did u sell ur ti 4200 for a fx 5200 Ultra..."magical DX 9 support"...not unless thats a typo I wouldve stayed with the ti 4200.

I'm going on a hunch, a fairly well educated hunch that I'm sure will benifit me a little now, a lot later...

I didn't buy this card for it's dx9 support... I bought it because:

1. I found one for $91 shipped.

2. I got $130 for my Jaton GF4

3. I'm confident that bjorn3d's results on the 5200U after the OC they did ARE NOT skewed... (@16x12, 4xaa/af, score went from 2k to 5k, by far surpassing anything the 4600 could do, even...

4. I'm confident that there will at least be SOME driver improvements over the next few months... I said "some"... remember that...

5. This card is a stopgap card till X-mas... when I'll actually throw $350 into a vidcard...


... It may not seem that way yet, but the 5200U might just be a logical step up *in features* from the ti4200... See, I was very satisfied with my GF4's fillrate... I had one of the cheapest mfg's of the card and I still always surpassed stock 4600 figures when it was @ 310/580... The single and multitexturing scores were great... I think this 5200U will really benifit from an OC, and it *might* like a non-standard agp freq. as well... If not, I'll be one of the first to volt mod mine...

:)

[mreman4k]

Originally posted by ragejg
I'm going on a hunch, a fairly well educated hunch that I'm sure will benifit me a little now, a lot later...

I didn't buy this card for it's dx9 support... I bought it because:

1. I found one for $91 shipped.

2. I got $130 for my Jaton GF4

3. I'm confident that bjorn3d's results on the 5200U after the OC they did ARE NOT skewed... (@16x12, 4xaa/af, score went from 2k to 5k, by far surpassing anything the 4600 could do, even...

4. I'm confident that there will at least be SOME driver improvements over the next few months... I said "some"... remember that...

5. This card is a stopgap card till X-mas... when I'll actually throw $350 into a vidcard...


... It may not seem that way yet, but the 5200U might just be a logical step up *in features* from the ti4200... See, I was very satisfied with my GF4's fillrate... I had one of the cheapest mfg's of the card and I still always surpassed stock 4600 figures when it was @ 310/580... The single and multitexturing scores were great... I think this 5200U will really benifit from an OC, and it *might* like a non-standard agp freq. as well... If not, I'll be one of the first to volt mod mine...

:)

Oh ok :afro:

[Kruno]

Originally posted by ATI LoVeR 9700
Isn't Sean an nVidiot anyways. He's not a bad one, but he's an nV fan. He doesn't like when people elaborate on things. He use to flame me when I typed too much.

Post more than 1 paragraph and I will flame you too. :lol:

You talking about Sean Pelletier?
or
Brian Raffel?
or
John Carmack?

:lol:

[John Reynolds]

Originally posted by GlowStick
Best i can get is 410 and thats with some speckels

But oviously me buying the card dose not demonstrate what people will get, but the Reviewsites are the non cherry picked cards. CLEARLY

Buy 20 boards and then average the results. It's luck of the draw on these things.

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by John Reynolds
Buy 20 boards and then average the results. It's luck of the draw on these things.

There will be less 'high o/c's' than low ones, but the revewsites will get ones that will go very high, so i woudlnt take their results worth anything, just post on a forum and see what everon else got.