View Full Version : 8800GTX and 3870x2 - Shootout at the OK Corral
YES. The main reason I am interested is to run 2 x2's, its a wait and see for now.
slaWter
01-30-08, 11:41 AM
That's true, if you have a GTX or Ultra, there is no need to rush and buy a new card now. Crysis is the only game with performance problems and the big wave of PC games is already behind us.
That's why I'm also waiting to see performance numbers from a single GX2 and Crossfire X, both currently scheduled for March AFAIK.
Out of the only two reviews with testing methods that are actually useful, the X2 doesnt exactly shine. All the other reviewers are using flybys, cutscenes, timedemos and dodgy built in benchmarks. :thumbdwn:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ1NCwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?type=expert&aid=512
Out of the only two reviews with testing methods that are actually useful, the X2 doesnt exactly shine. All the other reviewers are using flybys, cutscenes, timedemos and dodgy built in benchmarks. :thumbdwn:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ1NCwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?type=expert&aid=512
I did not include PCper because this was a GTX versus 3870x2 comparison/compilation and they compared to Ultra. But I like thier format too. And hardware canucks are a good group of reviewers as well. But for the sake of comparison...
I don't really want to look at HardOCP again. I am not into thier style sorry. You can use them though. That's cool.
PCPER... Ultra ($600) versus 3870x2 ($450)
As you can see, if they had used a GTX in the mix, the 3870x2 would have won many of these tests. Thier results mostly mirror, IMO anyway, those of the other sites.
Only sore spot I can see is the poor "WiC DX10 with AA enabled" which they always do poorly in.
BIOSHOCK 1600x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 62 fps
8800Ultra - 73 fps
BIOSHOCK 1920x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 61 fps
8800Ultra - 65 fps
COD4 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 77 fps
8800Ultra - 84 fps
COH 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 42 fps
8800Ultra - 52 fps
COJ 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 33 fps
8800Ultra - 23 fps
Lost Planet 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 37 fps
8800Ultra - 39 fps
UT3 1600x1200 0xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 51 fps
8800Ultra - 57 fps
WiC 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA DX10
3870x2 - 21 fps
8800Ultra - 32 fps
Crysis 1280x1024 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 25 fps
8800Ultra - 25 fps
"""Final Thoughts
The new $450 AMD Radeon HD 3870 X2 is a breath of fresh air for us - competition in the enthusiast level of the marketplace is well overdue and will lead to better prices and performance for everyone in the long run. AMD's Radeon HD 3870 X2 is an elegant design that shows performance meeting or beating that of NVIDIA's current flagship 8800 Ultra graphics board in today's most demanding DX9 and DX10 titles. Its dual-GPU design has its strengths and its weaknesses as we have dissected above but the end result is truly what matters: performance. Put the Radeon HD 3870 X2 on your short list of ultimate performance graphics boards and buckle up: the race is truly heating up for 2008. """
I think they liked it. But mainly for the higher than 1600x1200 resses where it was winning against the Ultra? But I never thought of it as an Ultra killer. AMD should not have either IMO. It's priced to compete with GTX at the moment. Price is where products compete. I would still give the speed crown to nVidia with the Ultra.
C.
I did not include PCper because this was a GTX versus 3870x2 comparison/compilation and they compared to Ultra. But I like thier format too. And hardware canucks are a good group of reviewers as well. But for the sake of comparison...
I don't really want to look at HardOCP again. I am not into thier style sorry. You can use them though. That's cool.
PCPER... Ultra ($600) versus 3870x2 ($450)
As you can see, if they had used a GTX in the mix, the 3870x2 would have won many of these tests. Thier results mostly mirror, IMO anyway, those of the other sites.
Only sore spot I can see is the poor "WiC DX10 with AA enabled" which they always do poorly in.
BIOSHOCK 1600x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 62 fps
8800Ultra - 73 fps
BIOSHOCK 1920x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 61 fps
8800Ultra - 65 fps
COD4 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 77 fps
8800Ultra - 84 fps
COH 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 42 fps
8800Ultra - 52 fps
COJ 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 33 fps
8800Ultra - 23 fps
Lost Planet 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 37 fps
8800Ultra - 39 fps
UT3 1600x1200 0xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 51 fps
8800Ultra - 57 fps
WiC 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA DX10
3870x2 - 21 fps
8800Ultra - 32 fps
Crysis 1280x1024 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 25 fps
8800Ultra - 25 fps
"""Final Thoughts
The new $450 AMD Radeon HD 3870 X2 is a breath of fresh air for us - competition in the enthusiast level of the marketplace is well overdue and will lead to better prices and performance for everyone in the long run. AMD's Radeon HD 3870 X2 is an elegant design that shows performance meeting or beating that of NVIDIA's current flagship 8800 Ultra graphics board in today's most demanding DX9 and DX10 titles. Its dual-GPU design has its strengths and its weaknesses as we have dissected above but the end result is truly what matters: performance. Put the Radeon HD 3870 X2 on your short list of ultimate performance graphics boards and buckle up: the race is truly heating up for 2008. """
I think they liked it. But mainly for the higher than 1600x1200 resses where it was winning against the Ultra? But I never thought of it as an Ultra killer. AMD should not have either IMO. It's priced to compete with GTX at the moment. Price is where products compete. I would still give the speed crown to nVidia with the Ultra.
C.
They probably liked it because they were comparing to an 8800ultra which is overpriced, if there were comparing to a 8800GTX and 8800GTS which cost simalar or less then I doubt the conclusion would have been so positive.
Worse thing about the X2 in that review is the minimum framerate, it's consistantly lower.
XMAN52373
01-30-08, 03:07 PM
I did not include PCper because this was a GTX versus 3870x2 comparison/compilation and they compared to Ultra. But I like thier format too. And hardware canucks are a good group of reviewers as well. But for the sake of comparison...
I don't really want to look at HardOCP again. I am not into thier style sorry. You can use them though. That's cool.
PCPER... Ultra ($600) versus 3870x2 ($450)
As you can see, if they had used a GTX in the mix, the 3870x2 would have won many of these tests. Thier results mostly mirror, IMO anyway, those of the other sites.
Only sore spot I can see is the poor "WiC DX10 with AA enabled" which they always do poorly in.
BIOSHOCK 1600x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 62 fps
8800Ultra - 73 fps
BIOSHOCK 1920x1200 0xAA 8xAF HIGH mode
3870x2 - 61 fps
8800Ultra - 65 fps
COD4 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 77 fps
8800Ultra - 84 fps
COH 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF
3870x2 - 42 fps
8800Ultra - 52 fps
COJ 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 33 fps
8800Ultra - 23 fps
Lost Planet 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 37 fps
8800Ultra - 39 fps
UT3 1600x1200 0xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 51 fps
8800Ultra - 57 fps
WiC 1600x1200 4xAA 8xA DX10
3870x2 - 21 fps
8800Ultra - 32 fps
Crysis 1280x1024 4xAA 8xA
3870x2 - 25 fps
8800Ultra - 25 fps
"""Final Thoughts
The new $450 AMD Radeon HD 3870 X2 is a breath of fresh air for us - competition in the enthusiast level of the marketplace is well overdue and will lead to better prices and performance for everyone in the long run. AMD's Radeon HD 3870 X2 is an elegant design that shows performance meeting or beating that of NVIDIA's current flagship 8800 Ultra graphics board in today's most demanding DX9 and DX10 titles. Its dual-GPU design has its strengths and its weaknesses as we have dissected above but the end result is truly what matters: performance. Put the Radeon HD 3870 X2 on your short list of ultimate performance graphics boards and buckle up: the race is truly heating up for 2008. """
I think they liked it. But mainly for the higher than 1600x1200 resses where it was winning against the Ultra? But I never thought of it as an Ultra killer. AMD should not have either IMO. It's priced to compete with GTX at the moment. Price is where products compete. I would still give the speed crown to nVidia with the Ultra.
C.
The problem with the others thou is that in game play for crysis is different that the bench would have you believe. BIOSHOCK run(AAT) on empty maps does tell how how it plays the game very well. Flyby are heavily tweaked for(both camps) and cut scenes DO NOT tell you how the game play will actually be.
Eliminator
01-30-08, 04:20 PM
meh ill never make the mistake of going SLI ever again... single card FTW
Look. It is what it is. All I did was present 25 games across half a dozen or so respected reviews and compiled them together. They won in 14 and tied in 4. Held thier own in 6 and 1 was borked.
I know this is an nVidia fan site. People here will favor the nVidia products so to that end, this thread is getting exactly the response I expected.
That's cool.
Thought the numbers were interresting is all.
C.
Thanks for putting this together, great job. Now if AMDTI would get their linux drivers up to NV quality I'll have a real choice again.
tornadog
01-30-08, 04:51 PM
My "Ati" senses are tingling...I have been feeling distraught that I cant support the company that I like and root for....everything is pointing to a 3870 x2 upgrade but still cannot help but wonder what NV will do with their 9800 x2. Also if I switch cards I will also be switching the forums I frequent. If I go ATI, it will be goodbye nvnews :(
My "Ati" senses are tingling...I have been feeling distraught that I cant support the company that I like and root for....everything is pointing to a 3870 x2 upgrade but still cannot help but wonder what NV will do with their 9800 x2. Also if I switch cards I will also be switching the forums I frequent. If I go ATI, it will be goodbye nvnews :(
Lot's of nVidia owners talk at Rage all the time. Me being one of em. What's wrong with that.
Since when was a membership "card" required. :p
People that piss on others for not owning this card or that are :thumbdwn: :thumbdwn: :thumbdwn: :thumbdwn: in my books.
We all have the same hobby after all. :) Rage has some great people there. nVnews I am sure does as well.
Blacklash frequents both and people in both forums seem to like him.
If people want to own a 3870x2 for this round, what's wrong with that. Maybe it would be fun and provide alot of gaming joy. I would love to be able to get one and test it but not until after my holidays. :(
$489 CDN is kinda expensive after I just paid for a Mehiko treep for 4 adults. /sigh It will be fun too though senior. ;)
C.
My "Ati" senses are tingling...I have been feeling distraught that I cant support the company that I like and root for....everything is pointing to a 3870 x2 upgrade but still cannot help but wonder what NV will do with their 9800 x2. Also if I switch cards I will also be switching the forums I frequent. If I go ATI, it will be goodbye nvnews :(
Why??? There are quite a few ATI owners here, and quite a few more interested in the performance and IQ comparisons.
Post at both forums, but leaving is kind of silly imho.
john19055
01-30-08, 06:30 PM
IMO the HD3870x2 looks like a great deal ,it is priced the same a 8800GTX and sometimes you can find it as low as $389,and the 3870x2 beats the 8800GXT more then it loses.I know the 8800GTX is over a year old and the 3870x2 has two GPU's,but it is nice to see ATI/AMD come out with something that is just as fast and the price is the same as a 8800GTX ,sometimes lower if you find a good deal.
tornadog
01-30-08, 06:33 PM
Its just my nature...I used to post actively on DH for the 3 years that I owned ATI cards, switch to Nvidia and I discovered nvnews. Now I dont go to DH except to read the news/reviews on their mainpage, never the forums.
FastRedPonyCar
02-08-08, 10:27 AM
Eh.... I have a feeling this won't be the top card very long.
Eh.... I have a feeling this won't be the top card very long.
Anyone that thought it would be is a retard. Ok. That was harsh. I guess at the very least I would call them "new to the scene".
These companies leapfrog alot in my experience with nVidia winning in the current gen quite clearly.
This card was not a 2008 overall fastest card contender. At least most people I know never expected it to be. It's just a great value that has caused nVidia to implement drastic price reductions and nVidia fans have alot to thank AMD for right now. ATI fans have a card that competes in the GTX market for a reasonable price.
Of course nVidia will come out with a faster card. DUH.
And then AMD will have to drop the price of the X2. And then AMD will come out with a faster card.
It has been that way forever.
C.
sammy sung
02-09-08, 05:13 PM
Anyone that thought it would be is a retard. Ok. That was harsh. I guess at the very least I would call them "new to the scene".
These companies leapfrog alot in my experience with nVidia winning in the current gen quite clearly.
This card was not a 2008 overall fastest card contender. At least most people I know never expected it to be. It's just a great value that has caused nVidia to implement drastic price reductions and nVidia fans have alot to thank AMD for right now. ATI fans have a card that competes in the GTX market for a reasonable price.
Of course nVidia will come out with a faster card. DUH.
And then AMD will have to drop the price of the X2. And then AMD will come out with a faster card.
It has been that way forever.
C.
Not quite,this time it took them a LOT longer,nvidia has reigned supreme in top performance for more than a year .This time i think ATI's lead will be shortlived but the competition is great,good for all of us.
The minimums on the 3870x2 are poor in many cases.
from Extremetech
Other high-end single cards like the G92-based GeForce 8800 GTS is a better overall value that will give you more consistent and predictable performance.
As for the 3870x2: This is a very interesting, and not at all bad, graphics card. But the numbers just don't all add up, so we recommend taking a "wait and see" approach.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,2253573,00.asp
Not much of a lead really. Many sites have shown it to have problems stemming from the same inferior architecture as the 2900xt.
Xion X2
02-09-08, 11:31 PM
The minimums on the 3870x2 are poor in many cases.
from Extremetech
Other high-end single cards like the G92-based GeForce 8800 GTS is a better overall value that will give you more consistent and predictable performance.
As for the 3870x2: This is a very interesting, and not at all bad, graphics card. But the numbers just don't all add up, so we recommend taking a "wait and see" approach.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,2253573,00.asp
Not much of a lead really. Many sites have shown it to have problems stemming from the same inferior architecture as the 2900xt.
Do you work for Nvidia or something? The only time I ever see you come out of the woodwork is to slam an ATi product.
PlayerZen14
02-10-08, 12:01 AM
The minimums on the 3870x2 are poor in many cases.
from Extremetech
Other high-end single cards like the G92-based GeForce 8800 GTS is a better overall value that will give you more consistent and predictable performance.
As for the 3870x2: This is a very interesting, and not at all bad, graphics card. But the numbers just don't all add up, so we recommend taking a "wait and see" approach.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/...2253573,00.asp
Not much of a lead really. Many sites have shown it to have problems stemming from the same inferior architecture as the 2900xt.
i've seen that post SO many times! Sure the 3870x2 performance isnt as predictable, but i dont see why you would buy every game the day it comes out! I could wait a few weeks for the game drivers to mature, and then buy them when i know the drivers for that game have been created.
Do you work for Nvidia or something? The only time I ever see you come out of the woodwork is to slam an ATi product.
+1
All yall gotta remember... This CARD is still the bastard tech it was PRIOR to the ATI AMD merger. It was already out the door. Now it's been shrunk and then they put 2 on a stick.
Given what the 2900XT was, you have to hand it to AMD. They really maximized the damn thing. Salvaged the HELL out of it and thanks to that motion we got the 8800GT and DRASTICALLY reduced pricing across the board.
AMD did AWESOME considering what they had to work with.
X2 = Great concept for a great price that needs a touch of polish. Matching and often beating GTX for $449. Phookin sweet. 3870 was a fantastic 8800GTS 320MB and 640MB killer that came out at under $250.
Get over it. Sheesh. ROFLMAO.
If they survive long enough to actually FATHER a card (cause the 3800 family is not theirs), we might all be in for a shock.
C.
fivefeet8
02-10-08, 05:30 AM
3870 was a fantastic 8800GTS 320MB and 640MB killer that came out at under $250.
More like Nvidia released their 8800gt making those cards EOL. You can't kill something already dead.
I call em like I see em. When ATI stops trying to put lipstick on a pig and comes out with a superior product I'll be happy to applaud. They have done great(9800 pro) in the past so I hope they do it again.
Given what the 2900XT was, you have to hand it to AMD. They really maximized the damn thing. Salvaged the HELL out of it and thanks to that motion we got the 8800GT and DRASTICALLY reduced pricing across the board.
Amen. How true! +1 :)
I call em like I see em. When ATI stops trying to put lipstick on a pig and comes out with a superior product I'll be happy to applaud. They have done great(9800 pro) in the past so I hope they do it again.
9800Pro was a great card, true. But I think you are forgetting a few others that ATI/AMD made that were equal to or better then thier nVidia counter parts -
800XTX
1900XT/1900XTX/1950XT/1950XTX
Thank God for competition between ATI/AMD and nVidia as it only keeps prices down and simulates R&D.
My 2Cents
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