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Dvahlish
01-29-08, 10:27 PM
Lvl 65 Rogue
Subtley specced with 10 points in assas.

Considering swapping from swords to maces...

Anyone tried this combo?
Pros....cons?

WeReWoLf
01-29-08, 11:05 PM
Pro's, you get the random stun, which is very good for a rogue. Con's, You lose the chance of extra hits. If you're DW with 2 swords, and have sword spec, you have a far greater chance of doing more damage due to 10% extra hit chance, compared to 10% chance to stun where you get hit less. (It's still only 5% for each, but with DW 2 of each, it's effectively doubled)

Dvahlish
01-29-08, 11:11 PM
Pro's, you get the random stun, which is very good for a rogue. Con's, You lose the chance of extra hits. If you're DW with 2 swords, and have sword spec, you have a far greater chance of doing more damage due to 10% extra hit chance, compared to 10% chance to stun where you get hit less. (It's still only 5% for each, but with DW 2 of each, it's effectively doubled)

Yes you are right.
I have respecced her a few times...Levelled with combat swords which worked nicely, then changed to sub swords...which also worked nicely.
I changed to maces for the stun.....Im starting to think a mace combat build will suit me better.

Noone can say I havent tried everything poss with my rogue :)
Oh..shes mainly pvp as well.

Tr1cK
01-30-08, 09:23 AM
I've never played one past 30 or so, but how bout a dual spec?

Carry a mace in the offhand and sword in the main?


Also, I know on warriors, the stun proc rate is reduced when dual wielding compared to 2h/

WeReWoLf
01-30-08, 02:51 PM
On warriors, yes, because apparently it's overpowered.

Dvahlish
01-30-08, 04:43 PM
Respecced last night, went and killed low lvl beats for about an hour to get my mace skill up.
Seems to be working well.
I went for a combat mace spec in the end and Im finding it to be quite powerful.
Of course adrenaline rush, riposte and blade fury help a lot!
I am finding that stun does proc quite a bit, which is nice.

I do miss my sub spec though.

nVJoe
01-30-08, 05:12 PM
Lvl 65 Rogue
Subtley specced with 10 points in assas.

Considering swapping from swords to maces...

Anyone tried this combo?
Pros....cons?
The only people who go mace are PVPers because of the nice maces you can get with honor points. That being said no one goes maces because there are better swords and daggers out there.

That being said stay combat for leveling. If you go into PVP then I prefer Cold Blood and Prep combo. I haven't been a rouge for over a year so I don't know how much different the talent trees are.

nVJoe
01-30-08, 05:14 PM
Pro's, you get the random stun, which is very good for a rogue. Con's, You lose the chance of extra hits. If you're DW with 2 swords, and have sword spec, you have a far greater chance of doing more damage due to 10% extra hit chance, compared to 10% chance to stun where you get hit less. (It's still only 5% for each, but with DW 2 of each, it's effectively doubled)
True dat. Rogues need to get in and get out quickly. This is why I prefer cold blood and prep.

Ninjaman09
01-31-08, 12:59 PM
The only people who go mace are PVPers because of the nice maces you can get with honor points. That being said no one goes maces because there are better swords and daggers out there.

That being said stay combat for leveling. If you go into PVP then I prefer Cold Blood and Prep combo. I haven't been a rouge for over a year so I don't know how much different the talent trees are.
People go maces because of the stun proc in PVP, not because the maces are nice (all the PVP one hander types have the same stats). The current favored Rogue arena build is a combat mace / Hemo build. But yeah, combat swords for leveling definitely.

lIqUID
01-31-08, 08:14 PM
I went combat maces for all of an hour and completely hated it. My hit is a bit too low for any full combat spec, so I went back to my current hemo ar/prep build. I don't care what the crybabies in forums babble about HARP is a very good spec, and I easily kill well geared combat rogues.

armory Liq on the realm Lethon, and try that spec out. I haven't played much on my rogue since I leveled my lock to 70 but if my alts get ganked thats who I'd use.

Dvahlish
01-31-08, 09:07 PM
I went combat maces for all of an hour and completely hated it. My hit is a bit too low for any full combat spec, so I went back to my current hemo ar/prep build. I don't care what the crybabies in forums babble about HARP is a very good spec, and I easily kill well geared combat rogues.

armory Liq on the realm Lethon, and try that spec out. I haven't played much on my rogue since I leveled my lock to 70 but if my alts get ganked thats who I'd use.

I agree HARP is fine, I was geared that way before going back to combat mace and I may go that way again after 70, but right now Im loving combat mace.
Harp owned in the BG's and cloth wearers hated me.
Im sure Ill grow tired of it eventually and change, but right now Im pretty happy.

Rakeesh
02-01-08, 04:31 AM
True dat. Rogues need to get in and get out quickly. This is why I prefer cold blood and prep.

Rogues suck IMO.

Not long ago I had this 40 rogue come and ambush me while I was fighting a mob, had like half of my health gone, fighting inside of a bush, and by the time I realized somebody else was there it was too late. I nearly got away but he did me in.

So I come back and res, then find him fighting a mob, only he has most of his health (like 97%) unlike me when he tried this same stunt. So here I come, 37 druid, 3 levels lower than him, pounce from stealth, claw the **** out of him, stun then moonfire dot, retreat and heal, then come back and finish the job.

Apparently he was doing the same stunt to other people in the area (stranglethorn vale) only just before he lost he would vanish and run off each time. Little hit n' run f*cker didn't count on my faerie fire to squash that little plan. :D

nVJoe
02-01-08, 04:59 PM
Rogues suck IMO.

Not long ago I had this 40 rogue come and ambush me while I was fighting a mob, had like half of my health gone, fighting inside of a bush, and by the time I realized somebody else was there it was too late. I nearly got away but he did me in.

So I come back and res, then find him fighting a mob, only he has most of his health (like 97%) unlike me when he tried this same stunt. So here I come, 37 druid, 3 levels lower than him, pounce from stealth, claw the **** out of him, stun then moonfire dot, retreat and heal, then come back and finish the job.

Apparently he was doing the same stunt to other people in the area (stranglethorn vale) only just before he lost he would vanish and run off each time. Little hit n' run f*cker didn't count on my faerie fire to squash that little plan. :D
Yeah that is the nature of rogues. They will NEVER pick a straight one on one fight.

Phyre
02-01-08, 05:35 PM
These days it's more or less mace spec for pvp. For raiding it's generally combat swords that win out at the end of the day.

I'm currently mutilate specced for pvp. I'm not playing the game as seriously as when I was raiding. Now, I'm just having some fun in the battlegrounds and arenas.

jolle
02-01-08, 07:14 PM
Im using a PVP mutilate aswell (Was using Combat Daggers for raiding before), its pretty nice in PVP, good combo point buildup and envenom hits pretty hard aswell (critted around 4k I think), and is pretty good on armored targets.
Trouble is that its largely Crit based, and with all the resiliance out there now that makes it less viable.
There is a combat mutilate version that is prolly better in that regard, and also better for raiding, but you get gimped stealth and some other downsides on that.

I got no resiliance at all, so I really got to pick my fights in BGs (naturally I dont, I jump on the closest target like a maddened ferret, but I SHOULD), as far as PVP gear goes I only got 2 of the main hand daggers (slow 90ish dps, for mutilate obviously) so far.

lIqUID
02-03-08, 12:42 PM
high resilience armor has killed mut daggers spec. I used mut for months until people started getting 400+ res, and now its all but useless. The combo point generation is insane with mut but on my warlock I usually let the dagger rogues get a couple hits in before I kill them simply because they cant dish out high enough damage.

Dvahlish
02-03-08, 04:48 PM
Rogues suck IMO.

Not long ago I had this 40 rogue come and ambush me while I was fighting a mob, had like half of my health gone, fighting inside of a bush, and by the time I realized somebody else was there it was too late. I nearly got away but he did me in.

So I come back and res, then find him fighting a mob, only he has most of his health (like 97%) unlike me when he tried this same stunt. So here I come, 37 druid, 3 levels lower than him, pounce from stealth, claw the **** out of him, stun then moonfire dot, retreat and heal, then come back and finish the job.

Apparently he was doing the same stunt to other people in the area (stranglethorn vale) only just before he lost he would vanish and run off each time. Little hit n' run f*cker didn't count on my faerie fire to squash that little plan. :D

No...Rogues dont suck...you just had a problem with a guy that was a bit of a dickhead.

But so what...he was PVP'ing!
Wasnt it you that posted not long ago that you went out ally hunting?
Same diff really isnt it?

Ill admit Rogues are tricky to get away from.
I myself get ganked by other rogues in BG's and Outland questing often.....I know the tricks they use and I still cant get away from them :)

Personally, I prefer rogues to locks anyday.
fear, dot, minion annoys the crap outta me.
Although, now I have cloak of shadows and that stops them in thier tracks :)

Dvahlish
02-03-08, 04:50 PM
Rogues suck IMO.

Not long ago I had this 40 rogue come and ambush me while I was fighting a mob, had like half of my health gone, fighting inside of a bush, and by the time I realized somebody else was there it was too late. I nearly got away but he did me in.

So I come back and res, then find him fighting a mob, only he has most of his health (like 97%) unlike me when he tried this same stunt. So here I come, 37 druid, 3 levels lower than him, pounce from stealth, claw the **** out of him, stun then moonfire dot, retreat and heal, then come back and finish the job.

Apparently he was doing the same stunt to other people in the area (stranglethorn vale) only just before he lost he would vanish and run off each time. Little hit n' run f*cker didn't count on my faerie fire to squash that little plan. :D

Oh and.....
Wecome to STV.
By far the worst ganking place I have ver quested.
I love that place though.

Dvahlish
02-03-08, 05:01 PM
Yeah that is the nature of rogues. They will NEVER pick a straight one on one fight.
I think what you are all forgetting is that is what a rogue does!
They are assassins!
They may be quick and stealthed but they also wear leather, so if a rogue doesnt get the first hit in...he has a strong likelyhood of getting owned.
They are tricky to fight against...but not impossible :)

Lets have a look at some other classes shakl we.
Pallys...plate wearers, bubble heal...bubble heal........etc etc etc

Warlocks! A fair fight? They dot the hell out of you and then make you run away....a lot....of and if that doesnt work they will shadowburn and deathcoil you all the while thier little minion is chasing you about!

Ahaha...and you complain about rogues!
I think there are just as many annoying traits on a lot of other classes...what makes a good players, is learning how to counteract these classes :)

Son Goku
02-03-08, 11:12 PM
I've never played one past 30 or so, but how bout a dual spec?

Carry a mace in the offhand and sword in the main?


Also, I know on warriors, the stun proc rate is reduced when dual wielding compared to 2h/

Prob is talent point limits.... It's an extra 5 points one takes from elsewhere. As is one can be a fair bit limited in point placement. For instance, look at my rogue who is kara currently:

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Aman%27Thul&n=Picolo

I could use 3 more points in lethiality; but if I put them there, I'd probably have to dispense with the improved sap. Not such an issue in kara, as there aren't humanoids to sap there, but other instances.... If I were to do it again, perhaps one point out of weapon expertise could be placed there. Otherwise, I'd lose surprise attacks. Not exactly a lot of spare points to go around, in general.

Son Goku
02-03-08, 11:19 PM
No...Rogues dont suck...you just had a problem with a guy that was a bit of a dickhead.

But so what...he was PVP'ing!
Wasnt it you that posted not long ago that you went out ally hunting?
Same diff really isnt it?

Ill admit Rogues are tricky to get away from.
I myself get ganked by other rogues in BG's and Outland questing often.....I know the tricks they use and I still cant get away from them :)

Personally, I prefer rogues to locks anyday.
fear, dot, minion annoys the crap outta me.
Although, now I have cloak of shadows and that stops them in thier tracks :)

About one of the few I know that doesn't mind locks as much as most of us; is this mage in guild who's raided up through SSC or so. Just foils their lil plan, with the pain called ice block :rofl Rogues can use cloak of shadows once to remove all DoTs (if not in fear though); but long arse CD.

Rakeesh
02-04-08, 09:47 AM
No...Rogues dont suck...you just had a problem with a guy that was a bit of a dickhead.

They suck when you kick their ass and they are 3 levels above you, even though your gear sucks :D

I just did it again too, but this time with a different rogue. Him 43 me 40. He was harassing some of my level 30 guildies out in 1k, so I came out there and pounded the crap out of him. Boy did he try to run when he realized he was outmatched, but you can't outrun a druid no matter how fast you sprint. He probably tried to vanish too I'll bet, any smart druid won't allow this tho.

Oh and.....
Wecome to STV.
By far the worst ganking place I have ver quested.
I love that place though.

I refer to that place as the nam all the time in game :D Charlie everywhere. Over there, allies and mobs are basically the same thing and nearly every bit as plentiful, and we treat em the same way: don't ask questions, kill on sight.

I have to admit though, rogues and druids make an excellent random player kill team. They can both attack sight unseen, do awesome burst damage, the druid can track down players quickly and the rogue can sap somebody if there is too much entourage. One of the most successful runs through STV I've had was done this way; I think I had something like 94 kills in about 2 hours.

Warlocks! A fair fight? They dot the hell out of you and then make you run away....a lot....of and if that doesnt work they will shadowburn and deathcoil you all the while thier little minion is chasing you about!

Meh locks don't bother me as much as they used to. Just dispell curse and double HoT yourself. Once they run out of mana they're screwed.

You know what does bother me tho? Priests. They can heal themselves much faster than I can take em down and their mana regen is able to keep this up for a while.

thor1182
02-04-08, 11:16 AM
druids scale the best in the game in greens compared to any other class. One one One naked, most of the time a druid would win.

One you hit 70, and people start getting geared, come back and tell me warlocks are push overs as a feral druid.

Tr1cK
02-04-08, 12:44 PM
druids scale the best in the game in greens compared to any other class. One one One naked, most of the time a druid would win.

One you hit 70, and people start getting geared, come back and tell me warlocks are push overs as a feral druid.
+1

It all starts at 70. Multiple fears and the strongest DOTs in the game tend to take out any class. As a druid, you may stand a chance as Resto.


I refer to that place as the nam all the time in game :D Charlie everywhere. Over there, allies and mobs are basically the same thing and nearly every bit as plentiful, and we treat em the same way: don't ask questions, kill on sight.
:rofl

I love that! Charlie everywhere!

Rakeesh
02-04-08, 04:42 PM
druids scale the best in the game in greens compared to any other class. One one One naked, most of the time a druid would win.

One you hit 70, and people start getting geared, come back and tell me warlocks are push overs as a feral druid.

I am not saying they are pushovers, not in any sense. Just I've had harder battles with other classes, especially shadow spec priests. In fact I've been killed by a few one or two levels below me. Things may change in my favor more once I get lifebloom and cyclone though. Especially once I get furor which I haven't put any talent points into yet.

I love that! Charlie everywhere!

Also Ashenvale is the west bank. It's really flat compared to the nam, and much more widespread, so fewer surprises, but skeletons everywhere along the paths between astranar and splintertree - at least in PVP servers anyways.

The only place in this game that actually pisses me off is booty bay. It's just full of asses that suck everywhere else in PVP so they go around one shotting the lowest levels they can find.