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nekrosoft13
09-23-08, 09:11 PM
In fact, at least one Microsoftie, speaking off the record during my trip to Redmond last week, explained that Windows 7, in many ways, would simply be Vista SP2. From a compatibility standpoint, all the work Microsoft is doing will show up in Vista first and will work identically in Windows 7. It's not changing the underlying platform at all, so if a hardware device or software application works on Vista, it will work fine on 7 as well.

http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/win7_toosoon.asp

DRen72
09-23-08, 09:49 PM
Seems that would send a message that upgrading to Windows 7 isn't really essential.

ViN86
09-23-08, 11:34 PM
Seems that would send a message that upgrading to Windows 7 isn't really essential.

i think it's supposed to send the message that we wont have the XP to Vista compatibility problems we had at first.

this transition should be similar to the windows 2000 to windows XP transition.

wolfgar
09-29-08, 04:09 PM
Win7 == Vista SP2??

mostly yes.

the core is Vista, with some tweaks. MS admits that.
same core, same driver model, same security model (mostly),, same, same ,same

Adding multi-touch support. (maybe in 2-4 years I'll care)
Direct-x 11??

The most obvious difference is MS is removing a lot of their little used bloatware.
Outlook express, movie maker, and other seldom used stuff will be removed.
IE8? probably, as IE8 is scheduled for end of 08, W7 for mid/late Q2-09 (maybe)

Similar to any removed apps, will have updates available on MS-Live. (I'll use alternatives personally)


There are many questions outstanding.
Will Win7 now require a MS-Live account? (Is this a new anti-piracy tactic?)

There are indications that MS will release a beta to the MS developer conference in late October.

The boards will be lit up with reviews in a month, or so.

2 major questions remain unanswered.

1) Will any major dropped Vista features be included (the rumored new file system, ...)?
2) Will the licensing/packaging be easier to understand. (didn't Vista originally have 11-13 packages for the US alone?) Will the pricing be easier to swallow?

six_storm
09-29-08, 04:19 PM
MS is getting more and more retarded.

crainger
09-29-08, 04:24 PM
Retarded like a fox!

breathemetal
09-29-08, 04:32 PM
Yet another reason i love OSX :)

nekrosoft13
09-29-08, 05:13 PM
Yet another reason i love OSX :)

just like all the rest of 5% computer users in the world

ASUSEN7900GTX
09-29-08, 06:27 PM
when and if linux ever gets better options for gaming major racibg games an other big titles iŽll consider it

i had suse somethin 3 years ago i liked linux fot its stability and less virus attacked.

but windows is still needed for serious gaminf too bad

AngelGraves13
09-29-08, 07:58 PM
I'm gonna get Windows 7 and pass down my Vista to my mom and finally be rid of XP.

That means I'll need to buy the full retail though. Better start saving lol

mailman2
09-29-08, 08:12 PM
Wow, bold move to charge for Vista SP2 - whoops, I mean - Windows 7. MS gets worse morally in my eyes everyday. Glad I wasn't an early adoptor of it :D

Bearclaw
09-29-08, 08:35 PM
I hope:

1) There aren't a million versions, or however they decide to do this, they don't make it freakin' complicated. ONE version is more than enough. Simple. Adequate.

2) They don't come out with some random pricing scheme...

einstein_314
09-29-08, 08:47 PM
I fail to see how this is such a big shock to so many people....hasn't microsoft based previous OS's on their previous versions? Do you honestly expect them to start from the ground up? Vista isn't that bad. The only reason it's being regarded as the biggest flop ever is because of all the bad hype. I get in arguments everyday with people who claim vista is the biggest POS ever. They have no concrete reasons why they think this. And those who do would have the same problem with any OS. 99% of computer users know virtually nothing about the computers they use everyday and complain because things are different. People don't like change.

newfiejudd
09-29-08, 09:25 PM
I fail to see how this is such a big shock to so many people....hasn't microsoft based previous OS's on their previous versions? Do you honestly expect them to start from the ground up? Vista isn't that bad. The only reason it's being regarded as the biggest flop ever is because of all the bad hype. I get in arguments everyday with people who claim vista is the biggest POS ever. They have no concrete reasons why they think this. And those who do would have the same problem with any OS. 99% of computer users know virtually nothing about the computers they use everyday and complain because things are different. People don't like change.

Couldn't possibly agree more with you there. And I love my MBP 17". But I still use Windows as my Gaming System.

IF Micro$oft try and charge for an upgraded version of Vista I think it will turn alot of Computer savvy poeple Elsewhere. And in a sad way I hope it does. Maybe it would stimulate the open source wolrd a lot more.

Q
09-29-08, 09:35 PM
I fail to see how this is such a big shock to so many people....hasn't microsoft based previous OS's on their previous versions? Do you honestly expect them to start from the ground up? Vista isn't that bad. The only reason it's being regarded as the biggest flop ever is because of all the bad hype. I get in arguments everyday with people who claim vista is the biggest POS ever. They have no concrete reasons why they think this. And those who do would have the same problem with any OS. 99% of computer users know virtually nothing about the computers they use everyday and complain because things are different. People don't like change.

No offense, einstein_314, but Vista has a lot of that bad rap coming. ESPECIALLY pre-SP1.

At the university I work for, we required our users to install SP1 for Vista. Nearly a quarter of the machines (Newish Dells, HPs, Toshibas, etc) failed to upgrade properly. Either black screens or infinite restarts. It was a disaster that we still haven't recovered from, especially since we don't service student machines.....

crainger
09-29-08, 09:42 PM
My experience with Vista has been good Q. Therefore that is gospel and you are wrong.

Q
09-29-08, 09:54 PM
My experience with Vista has been good Q. Therefore that is gospel and you are wrong.

See, I don't follow the "There is nothing wrong with MINE - you must be doing something wrong" mentality. I've had Vista run great and run horribly and I've seen what it can do to thousands of mid-range laptops from big companies. It's not pretty....

::Bows in humility::
....My lord.

crainger
09-29-08, 10:06 PM
I too have had great Vista times with my home PCs, but on works PCs which I have built and been responsible for I've had issues, same as you getting SP1 to install. All issues were fixed by reinstalling Vista, but that's not desirable in most places. ::(:

zoomy942
09-29-08, 10:18 PM
No offense, einstein_314, but Vista has a lot of that bad rap coming. ESPECIALLY pre-SP1.

At the university I work for, we required our users to install SP1 for Vista. Nearly a quarter of the machines (Newish Dells, HPs, Toshibas, etc) failed to upgrade properly. Either black screens or infinite restarts. It was a disaster that we still haven't recovered from, especially since we don't service student machines.....


hence the reason i run linux. simple, elegant, allows me control of my device..oh and no viruses or spyware.

at my work, i manage 70 PC's by myself and i started rolling Vista out to them over the summer. got to 7 machines and had to revert them becaue of hardware/software compatibilty problems and PC's running slow.

We have a citrix server and i have SERIOUSLY thought about switching us to linux and running Citrix for their Windows applications..

einstein_314
09-30-08, 12:48 AM
No offense, einstein_314, but Vista has a lot of that bad rap coming. ESPECIALLY pre-SP1.

At the university I work for, we required our users to install SP1 for Vista. Nearly a quarter of the machines (Newish Dells, HPs, Toshibas, etc) failed to upgrade properly. Either black screens or infinite restarts. It was a disaster that we still haven't recovered from, especially since we don't service student machines.....
I understand what you're saying. And I know that just because I haven't had any problems doesn't mean there aren't any.

I don't think Vista should even be attempted to be put on a machine that was made during XP's lifetime. That's just asking for trouble. And I think that's why there were so many problems. People tried to put it on "older" computer and it didn't work.

I've installed Vista on about a dozen different machines, some laptops, mostly custom built pc's and haven't had a single problem yet.

I think the main problem now is that when you buy a laptop with vista on it, it comes with 30 other stupid resource hogging programs that the manufacturer decided to install. Those are what makes vista a PITA and run poorly.

My roommate just bought a brand new toshiba laptop. 2Ghz C2D, 3 GB ram, etc. It ran like crap. It took forever to boot up, and when it did, there were 10 icons in the task bar, all with popups asking you to do this and that. And the thing was SLOW! Right after boot, there were 81 processes running. This is before she installed anything on it!

I spent a good 3 hours removing the crap and voila, it actually runs quite well. If it had been up to me I would have formatted it and started from scratch.

So yeah....back on topic...

S.SubZero
09-30-08, 06:16 AM
The most obvious difference is MS is removing a lot of their little used bloatware.
Outlook express, movie maker, and other seldom used stuff will be removed.
Vista doesn't come with Outlook Express. It comes with "Microsoft Mail". Which is basically Outlook Express.

These apps aren't going away, they will simply be a separate download. The Live apps are essentially improved versions of these things, with more Live integration. They are a little better than the apps that come with Vista, but don't replace them. There's no need for two Mails and two Photo Gallerys and whatever. I'm sure just like Live Messenger in Vista, Windows 7 will have a very obvious icon to click to download the Live apps.


There are many questions outstanding.
Will Win7 now require a MS-Live account? (Is this a new anti-piracy tactic?)
Doubtful. For the record, when a new Mac is taken out of the box, and OS X started the first time, it happily asks for the user's name, address, phone number, email address, and really wants to create an online account for them, after a few pages of "ARE YOU **SURE** YOU DON'T WANT A .MAC/MOBILEME ACOUNT?!!! IT'S ONLY $99 A YEAR REALLY!!"

Microsoft has so far never asked for these things.

K007
09-30-08, 07:19 AM
i don't think i can eva go back to xp after using vista...

Gimlis
09-30-08, 11:00 AM
i don't think i can eva go back to xp after using vista...


Oh I could and did.

But that was pre SP1, I needed to use a couple older Custom apps that didn't run well / correctly on vista along with performance & stability issues with a couple older games..
Though I am fairly certain the fault was in / with the individual Apps or games programming and not Vista. Regardless of where the fault lied it I meant that Vista was not a viable choice for use as my primary Os at the time.


my need for those apps has since changed so I have been thingking about giving Vista another go.

evox
09-30-08, 11:49 PM
just like all the rest of 5% computer users in the world

Lawl. (nana2)

K007
10-01-08, 04:48 AM
Oh I could and did.

But that was pre SP1, I needed to use a couple older Custom apps that didn't run well / correctly on vista along with performance & stability issues with a couple older games..
Though I am fairly certain the fault was in / with the individual Apps or games programming and not Vista. Regardless of where the fault lied it I meant that Vista was not a viable choice for use as my primary Os at the time.


my need for those apps has since changed so I have been thingking about giving Vista another go.

I waited for SP1 to be out before i installed and try Vista again, before that, i tried it with i think RC2, with my GX2..left horrible memories...

Infact from the first vista sp1 install i have not even gone back to XP yet...