Death of agp video cards or the begining of PCI Express x16?

[Placid]

The successor to Canterwood/Springdale is a family of chipsets known as Grantsdale, due out in about a year, to be launched alongside the first 775-pin Prescott CPUs. As you are well aware, current Northwood based Pentium 4 processors feature a 478-pin micro-PGA package. The second-generation of Prescott CPUs (and eventually CPUs based on the Intel Tejas core), will feature a 775-pin LGA (Land Grid Array) package. The benefits of the LGA packaging include better power delivery to the CPU, lower manufacturing costs and the ability to more densely pack contacts into a small CPU. With a new pin-out, these CPUs will obviously require a new motherboard, and thus what better time to introduce a new family of chipsets?

The Grantsdale family will have multiple members, but their basic features are:

- 800MHz FSB support (initially, moving up to 1.06/1.2GHz eventually)
- Dual DDR400/333 SDRAM
- Dual DDR2-400/533 SDRAM (probably reserved for the higher end Grantsdale chipsets, and obviously depending on market availability of DDR2 SDRAM)
- Optional integrated graphics (Grantsdale-G) using a brand new integrated graphics core
- One PCI Express x16 slot for graphics
- ICH6 with support for 4 independent Serial ATA channels and PCI Express x1 slots


Also rumored the r400 and nv40 gpu cards will be PCI Express x16

[The Baron]

I'll believe in PCI-Express when I see it. I'd rather see PCI-X appear first with PCI-Express appearing later... And PCI-Express is a chicken or the egg problem--boards with PCI-Express slots for graphics won't appear until there are PCI-Express cards (unless they keep a legacy AGP slot (holy crap, did I just say legacy AGP slot?)), and PCI-Express cards won't show up until there are boards to put them in.

But then again, do we really need more bandwidth that is still never used?

[GlowStick]

PCI-Express is the wave of the future, no more of this 'well will this board spport my agp veroson'

yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyay

[Paul]

Neither the NV40 nor the "R400" are PCI Express.

[Placid]

Guess we shall see when they come out.

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PCI Express x16 on its way.
Posted by Scott on Sunday, April 13, 8:43 PM - Link to this item

Intel have demonstrated their PCI Express format using a motherboard with a rather mysterious chipset - the Kyrene. This chipset is due to be announced in week13 of 2003, but the main feature here is the PCI-Express which will be a replacement for AGP, offering even more bandwidth to the cpu.

"Over at IDF Japan, Intel has demonstrated their PCI Express capability with a PCI Express x16 card inserted into the motherboard graphics slot. Apparently, this motherboard is using the Kyrene chipset as revealed by the person in charge of the booth there"

We can expect to see Grantsdale chipsets supporting Prescott, Dual Channel DDR-II 400/533Mhz and PCI Express x16 towards end of this year. Therefore there are strong evidences that the next generation R400 and NV40 will be based on PCI Express x16.

http://www.deviantpc.com/coranto/EpVpkykAlyqJfvudoX.shtml

[Eson]

What i remember, ATI made a r300 with a PCI-Express.

[Gar]

They will probably have 2 versions when pci-x comes out. Just like they did when they made the transition to AGP from PCI.

[Riptide]

My SCSI host supports PCI-X. Any ideas on when it'll be available in a motherboard??

[Placid]

December at the earliest probably first quarted 2004 though.

[Riptide]

That's not to bad. I'm patient. Doom ]|[ is probably the only game coming out this year that'll make my system suck serious wind in 1600x1200 (w/o AF/FSAA on ofcourse).

[Dazz]

Yeah i am wondering if i can hold off on a new board/processor & video card and just buy a PCI Express x16 video card and board?
Problem being is my mobo is supporting it's maxium processor speed :(

[borntosoul]

id like to see the diff between agp 4X and agp 8X, why do we need 16X ?

[Dazz]

If i recall i belive they had the R350 using PCI express 16x in it's early stages as ATi are working close with Intel.

[Steppy]

PCI-X is a evolution of normal PCI...PCI-Express is far more revolutionary. PCI-X will be doomed to Vesa Local Bus type lifespan, where PCI-express will be the next PCI.

[suburbanguy]

I dont think NV40 or r400/r420/loci will be PCI Express.

perhaps NV45 and r450 will be.

but certainly NV50 and r500 will be PCI Express from the start.

[reever2]

I still dont get what the benefits of pci-express are for graphics chips, whenever i ask what they are, people just say more bandwidth but, how is more bandwidth going to help when games and cards aren't even starting to use the bandwidth of agp 8x?

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by reever2
I still dont get what the benefits of pci-express are for graphics chips, whenever i ask what they are, people just say more bandwidth but, how is more bandwidth going to help when games and cards aren't even starting to use the bandwidth of agp 8x?

Oh that is easy.

The agp bus is just dumb, *flashback*

The year was, well pre AGP

I was like 'hey dude look at my new video card, its PCI!!!!' they were like 'whoa thats so powerfull, i cant belive it has 4mb dram on it'

blah blah blah, you could put multipul video cards in your system (high end) to have more monitors.

*end*

To sum it up, right now, if i bought 2 Radeon 9800Pro video cards, i cant put them in my system!!!!! Luckfully it has dual outs so can run 2 monitors.

BUT WAIT!!!!!!!

i, i want MORE MONITORS!

Enter PCI Express

You can buy high end video cards and put them in any spare pciexpress slot and go on your marry way.

Oviously you can do the same with pci video cards today, but your getting toned down value cards. eg 5200pci, : (

[reever2]

But Pci is a shared bus....

And if the Grantsdale specs are really true, it only has one pci-express slot

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by reever2
But Pci is a shared bus....

And if the Grantsdale specs are really true, it only has one pci-express slot

PCI Express is not a shared bus, and workstation boards already have multiple PCI express slots, so you may have to step up to a workstation board, witch makes sence.

If you are buying 2 high end 400$ video cards, i would hope you useing it on a high end board, with a high end processor with high end ram : D

[Paul]

And a low-end bank balance when you're finished :)

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by Paul
And a low-end bank balance when you're finished :)

Well its really just a give and take sitaution

you get, or 'take' a awesome computer

you have to give 'up' food.

clearly takeing the computer is the better choice.



im so hungry

[Steppy]

Originally posted by GlowStick
PCI Express is not a shared bus, and workstation boards already have multiple PCI express slots, so you may have to step up to a workstation board, witch makes sence.

If you are buying 2 high end 400$ video cards, i would hope you useing it on a high end board, with a high end processor with high end ram : D I didn't think PCI-express was available at any level yet...I think you're confusing PCI-X with PCI-Express.

[borntosoul]

as far as i know pci express comes in different speeds, pci express for the video card and slower pci express to replace pci

[GlowStick]

Originally posted by borntosoul
as far as i know pci express comes in different speeds, pci express for the video card and slower pci express to replace pci

Even if it ran at half video card speed, its still alot of bandwith

[Lezmaka]

Originally posted by Steppy
I didn't think PCI-express was available at any level yet...I think you're confusing PCI-X with PCI-Express.

Yeah, the only place you'll find PCI Express is on demo boards, etc. I believe Intel had a demonstration at one of their recent shows.

PCI-X and PCI Express are two different standards. PCI-X is parallel just like PCI. PCI Express is serial.

Don't know if it's technically possible, I wouldn't be surprised to see boards that have an AGP slot, and PCI Express and PCI slots.