Windows 7 ~ Windows Vista

[betterdan]

I'm using an LCD monitor with a digital DVI connection and 60hz works just fine here.

[Elvin Presler]

I'm using an LCD monitor with a digital DVI connection and 60hz works just fine here.

What version of Windows 7? And are you SURE it's working fine? It goes to 60 hertz and stays there if you check it again? Mine has the 60 hertz option, switches to it, asks if I want to keep the new settings, etc....then it just goes right back to 59 anyway. :(

[j0j081]

Im with Bearshank on this one.

Vista is fine and dandy well before sp3 once you spent a thousand trips to google for tips and tricks cuz your that good at it.

7 is a wakeup call to those who forgot about what xp was or what Vista should of been, yea Longhorn right.

I enjoy the new 7 but i love that vista bar alot more.

I don't get how people compare 7 to XP at all.

[betterdan]

What version of Windows 7? And are you SURE it's working fine? It goes to 60 hertz and stays there if you check it again? Mine has the 60 hertz option, switches to it, asks if I want to keep the new settings, etc....then it just goes right back to 59 anyway. :(

Using RC build 7100 and yes I am sure it's working fine. The only thing I can suggest is to maybe go into the services and try disabling NVIDIA Display Driver Service (nvsvc). I always do that and Seeker like he said was having a problem until he disabled it also. I have never found a use for that service and it works fine with it disabled.

[mullet]

http://www.tweakguides.com/NVFORCE_4.html

# Nvidia Display Driver Service - This service generally doesn't have an essential function. In my experience, most people can safely disable it and not run into any difficulties or reduced functionality whatsoever. In fact disabling this service can improve Windows startup and shutdown times and general performance. However, some people report potential issues with temperature monitoring on their graphics cards if this service is disabled. In general if you feel you are experiencing any other strange behavior due to the disabling of this service, set it back to Automatic and restart it. Note: In Vista, the Nvidia Display Driver Service may be a startup item (as opposed to an actual service) called NvSvc in some versions of the Forceware drivers, but the same description applies. Note further that in more recent Forceware releases you may need to keep this service enabled in Vista or Windows 7 for Antialiasing and/or Anisotropic Filtering to work properly. Again, start off by disabling it and then only re-enable it if you find specific problems or certain functionality is unavailable or not working properly.

[betterdan]

So is anyone with the 59hz problem going to try disabling that service and see if it helps? If it doesn't then just reenable it if you like, no harm done.

[seeker]

If you go back to post #21, you will see that just the opposite was necessary for me. The service has to be enabled to change the resolution and disabled afterward.

[betterdan]

Hmm weird, I guess I've just been one of the lucky ones where it just works.

[Sazar]

I thought I was going to like Windows 7. Tried out the RTM though and found it is just Vista with a few small, insignificant improvements, like better options in the Defragmenter, and just as many new annoyances, like not remembering window size/position, and being stuck at 59 hertz (not 60) refresh rate no matter what you do. These 2 alone would prevent me from ever using Win7 if not fixed. Some games REQUIRE 60 hertz or they simply will not run. Battlefield series? Halo FFS! I'm not sure if it's Vista or Nvidia but the Nvidia Control Panel is a total mess in WIN7 with many broken or stuck settings.

Window size and position is remembered. All my folders and windows and applications open the way I want them to. If you have shortcut launches from your taskbar, you likely have to adjust launch behavior if you need it to open some specific way (i.e. maximized).

The refresh setting is reading directly from the monitors so it is not entirely Microsoft's fault there. I personally have no run into any situations where my games won't run but then I also don't play the games you are having issues with. I am sure there is a workaround, i.e. editing the game .cfg or something along those lines.

Re: Nvidia's control panel, I have no issues at all on my HTPC with the control panel. It renders as it did under Vista and the settings all work and the links all function.

I did not find it any faster though it may be on a lower end PC. It comes with no email client but half the old Windows Mail program's files are still sitting there...WTF? I don't care if they remove it, but....well REMOVE it, don't just break it.

I agree about Windows Mail, but I have a lot of storage space so I have never cared about this.

With regards to speed, I love it :D It is a lot more efficient in many areas than Vista, especially when it comes to the WMC and indexing. A lot of other areas are also improved in my overall usage and, I no longer have a dedicated Sidebar application running :)

Homegroups? The new more cumbersome taskbar with zero advantage over the old one? The new "shake the window" feature that drops everything else to minimized? Yeah, you'll need it now that all windows will pile up on top of each other.

Homegroups is fantastic, honestly.

If you have a home network and share apps or files across it, homegroups makes your life a lot easier. It is simple and doesn't have the variety of issues that XP and Vista have. Plus, it is faster and more intuitive. Further, the videos/audio/programs and other folders with their indexing are a huge boon. I can access and control all my media from one folder (where it can pool from other folders and drives in my system or network) instead of navigating to individual drives and folders or network attached devices. HUGE efficiency plus.

The new gui features such as the smart taskbar actually reduces clutter and the aero-peek is now fully functional (i.e. you can mouse-over, click on the application or preview it and so forth). A lot more functionality than just a thumbnail preview :)

The fact that I can preview my tabs within the taskbar (currently only works with IE8) is awesome and the thumbnails are a lot easier for me to navigate through than a multitude of apps on the taskbar. I guess there is a learning curve involved but it is a LOT more efficient. The dock-like functionality is leaps and bounds better than anything on XP or Vista (standard installation, no 3'rd party apps).

I used to use docks back in the day with XP. I gave it up under Vista due to the smart-search box within the start menu. Now, I have the smart taskbar and the search box. Best of both worlds.

The shake function and other extensions of the aero feature set make it a lot easier for people to hide/show files, folders, applications. You don't have to use them but if you are a big multi-tasker, it's just one of those small things that makes a big difference :)

Boot and shut-down times are also massively improved (for me at least, on both my systems with Windows 7).

[Tuork]

Sazar hit the nail on the head.

+1 to everything he said.

[henrybravo]

So is anyone with the 59hz problem going to try disabling that service and see if it helps? If it doesn't then just reenable it if you like, no harm done.

The 59hz "problem" is just Windows 7 conforming better to the EDID standard. Most monitors really run at 59.94hz. Windows 7 doesn't round to the nearest hz the way previous versions did. If you look in your monitor's OSD you'll see your display still says 60hz even though the control panel says 59hz because your monitor is still rounding up like it always has. So in essence nothing has really changed. The problem is there are a few games (it seems like very few) that are hard coded to run at 60hz, and since Windows 7 is reporting 59hz instead of 60 it is causing the game to break, even though the refresh rate hasn't really changed.

More info here:

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=301860

[nekrosoft13]

The 59hz "problem" is just Windows 7 conforming better to the EDID standard. Most monitors really run at 59.94hz. Windows 7 doesn't round to the nearest hz the way previous versions did. If you look in your monitor's OSD you'll see your display still says 60hz even though the control panel says 59hz because your monitor is still rounding up like it always has. So in essence nothing has really changed. The problem is there are a few games (it seems like very few) that are hard coded to run at 60hz, and since Windows 7 is reporting 59hz instead of 60 it is causing the game to break, even though the refresh rate hasn't really changed.

More info here:

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=301860

that explains it i had DDC/CI off.

turned it on, and OS shows 59, and monitor still shows 60hz

haha, clueless folks making all this ruckus just because they don't understand DDC/CI and EDID.

[glObalist]

folks making all this ruckus just because MS didn't have time to fix a simple rounding issue

Fixed.

“If you have a monitor that exposes ~59.94 (and no other frequency that we would use for 60), we enumerate both 59 and 60 and whichever you set, we set 59.94 and persist 59.94. When the UI asks what mode we’re in we tell it we’re in 59, as you see. This is the issue we had back at the end of February when we were trying to make the last minute fixes but in the end we decided that it was too late. So it is by design for now.”

[Dr.Nick]

Same 59Hz here on my desktop (my bros too) but it is 60Hz on my laptop. I wonder if its only desktops that are affected but either way I've yet to run into any games that wont run.
Oh and anyone that has issues with things like Homegroups and such is just trying to convince themselves that something better is not out there:(


On a not related note I've noticed something nice with Win7 just by looking at my drive map in PerfectDisk 10. There is a crap load! less of "black" "excluded" blocks on the drive map. Half of my HD was full of those on Vista and only a single row in Win7. I only needed to run a one boot defrag to get things in order. Of course its only a guess on my part but its probably the reason why its so much faster. If you want to test real world speed difference between OS's I've found Steam to be quite good. Installing games in Steam even while downloading 15+ of them only takes a few seconds in W7 vs. up to a minute or more on Vista.
Every day I find something that puts a smile on my face;)

[nekrosoft13]

Same 59Hz here on my desktop (my bros too) but it is 60Hz on my laptop. I wonder if its only desktops that are affected but either way I've yet to run into any games that wont run.
Oh and anyone that has issues with things like Homegroups and such is just trying to convince themselves that something better is not out there:(


if it bothers you, turn off DDC/CI in monitor settings

[mullet]

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=15892

Windows 7's feel is much improved, but actually performance varies

While Windows 7's requirements (a 1 GHz x86 processor, 1GB of RAM for 32-bit or 2 GB for 64-bit, and support for Direct X 9) are similar to Windows Vista, its install footprint is leaner (16 GB for 32-bit versus 20 GB in Vista, 20 GB for 64-bit versus 40 GB in Vista) and its memory usage is tighter (some users have run the release candidates on systems with less than 1 GB of RAM). All of this adds up to significant improvements over Vista and a modern OS capable of running on most netbooks.

Great graphical looks, touch functionality, and new UI options make the package even sweeter. However, no matter how nice the ride looks, it's always good to look inside -- for example, the snazzy OS X Snow Leopard may look slick, but is incapable of playing most games and will only run (officially) on Mac hardware. With that in mind let's look at a recent benchmark by CNET of the Windows 7 RTM build.

Interestingly, the results were mixed. Boot times, despite dedicated tweaking from Microsoft were slightly worse than in Vista SP2 or XP SP3 (by over a second). Shutdown times, though, showed much improvement over the slow XP, and even some improvement over Vista.

Since the 7100 build, Windows 7's performance in Microsoft Office and iTunes has improved significantly. In the Office benchmark, though it still gets beat by both Vista and XP (the overall leader) and it manages to now tie with XP in iTunes (ahead of Vista). In a final Cinebench benchmark, Windows 7 performance improved between the 7100 and 7600 builds, moving it ahead of Vista and just behind XP.

Gaming results should be coming soon, which should provide more interesting analysis of the new OS's true performance. In the meantime, though, the verdict seems that despite mixed performance against XP and Vista, Windows 7 holds its own.

As the experience and feel are much smoother than the previous two OS's, the standstill in performance, normally a bad thing, probably will be sufficient for Windows 7 to see great commercial success. Windows 7 completes Vista's ascent into a OS X level of user interface polish, while holding its ground in performance, something that has placed Windows ahead of competitors Linux and OS X.

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=37800&stc=1&d=1249495298http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=37799&stc=1&d=1249495298

[Dr.Nick]

if it bothers you, turn off DDC/CI in monitor settings

Nah no bothers here but thanks for the info. If I run into any app problems I will give that a shot tho. thx much

[seeker]

I found this guide that might be of use for those with this resolution problem:

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/7947-force-dvi-hdmi-resolutions-refresh-rates.html

[seeker]

I did not find it any faster though it may be on a lower end PC. It comes with no email client but half the old Windows Mail program's files are still sitting there...WTF? I don't care if they remove it, but....well REMOVE it, don't just break it.

It appears that it isn't exactly broken, just disabled. Therefore leaving that option to turn it on...if a person chooses:

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/5481-windows-mail.html

Personally, I will never use it, because I prefer another email client that I have purchased (The Bat), so I'm wondering what would happen if I deleted the Winmail folder in Program Files & Program file(x86)? Perhaps that would prevent it from running as a process.

[pakotlar]

Yes, yes it is. Vista was buggy as hell and still is.

Yes, every enthusiast on this forum can and does get it to work well but point is - the common people using PC's don't. They can barely turn on the computer let alone ATTEMPT anything we discuss on this forum.

Point is - for the average user, it was a pain in the ass. W7 completely re-defines Vista and while it isn't a "new" O/S, it brings a lot to the table, including an easier experience for the end user.

Go with W7. Anyone who wouldn't install it over Vista, well, have fun with Vista. The failed O/S.

Vista and Win7 are so damn similar that if you alrady have Vista IMO the only thing you should be possibly purchasing Win7 for is either the enhanced UI or the networking options. Ok Libraries. But certainly not for the performance. It is very similar speed, especially after service tweaks, which we all do.