WHY should the US be exempt from warcrimes?

[digitalwanderer]

I just read this story about the US pulling military funding to 35 countries (http://www.abc.net.au/ra/newstories/RANewsStories_892816.htm) because they won't allow the US to be immune from international prosecution of warcrimes.

Why? :confused:

I mean, why should the US be excluded from warcrimes? If we're holding other countries to a certain standard isn't it only fair/right that we should hold ourselves to those same standards?

I'm really confused here, I just don't get it! :confused:

[sonaboy]

I don't get it either.
One of the initial comments was that they were afraid that individuals amongst the US military would be charged and trapped into lengthy trials that they felt were frivolous -
but the whole thing about how they tried to influence other countries from voting their conscience by pulling aide - :rolleyes:

why do they feel that the International Courts are a bad idea NOW, when they cooperated during the Nazi war criminal investigations and sentencing of the 60's 70's and 80's?
AND most recently, for Milosovich after the Croation conflict?
This makes us look like we hold a double standard in the international theater, and doesn't do our reputation much good - AGAIN.

[stncttr908]

ME AMERICA! ME DO WHAT ME WANT! :rolleyes:

For not wanting to be viewed as enourmous bullies, we sure don't protect our image very well.

[1stFlight]

The other part that's bad about this is, we'd already signed onto it, the Bush admin withdrew our signature.

[Matthyahuw]

because we're not evil, that's why...and to deal with some of these evil factions, you have to persuade them a bit more...

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by stncttr908
ME AMERICA! ME DO WHAT ME WANT! :rolleyes:

For not wanting to be viewed as enourmous bullies, we sure don't protect our image very well.
Yeah, that's kind of how it comes across to me too. :(

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
because we're not evil, that's why...and to deal with some of these evil factions, you have to persuade them a bit more...
Doh! I forgot, the ends justify the means since we're the good guys.... :rolleyes:

[outriding9800]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
because we're not evil, that's why...and to deal with some of these evil factions, you have to persuade them a bit more...

what do you mean we are not evil ???

do you remember the military testing chemicals on american citizens without their knowledge ?

if thats not evil i dont know what is.

[1stFlight]

I guess that depends on ....

A) Which side of the gun you're on
B) How many of your people have influence in the U.S. government
C) How much money your country spends buying our weapons
D) How much blind support you give us

I'm sure if the Iraqi had a noticable influence in Congress, this 2nd Iraq war would have never happened.

Don't be so naive as to think we haven't done evil things, we have.

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
because we're not evil, that's why...and to deal with some of these evil factions, you have to persuade them a bit more...

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by 1stFlight
Don't be so naive as to think we haven't done evil things, we have.
No, no, NO!

We're the good guys, remember? That makes it all ok.

Don't you ever listen to Emperor George I? He's told us this many times... :rolleyes:

[Matthyahuw]

Originally posted by outriding9800
what do you mean we are not evil ???

do you remember the military testing chemicals on american citizens without their knowledge ?

if thats not evil i dont know what is. what? like Flouride? :rolleyes:

[vampireuk]

And neither is Europe:rolleyes:

[2fast4u]

america = good.
terrorism = bad.
communism = bad.
islam = bad.
america = overpowered military
americas criticizers = islamic neo-marxist terrorists.

therefore:

america = can decide what is good and evil

neat deal eh?

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by vampireuk
And neither is Europe:rolleyes:
Oh yes you are!

Well, at least France is... :p

[Matthyahuw]

Originally posted by 1stFlight
I'm sure if the Iraqi had a noticable influence in Congress, this 2nd Iraq war would have never happened.

Don't be so naive as to think we haven't done evil things, we have. Don't talk in hypotheticals, as that is an endless useless discussion, and we're not perfect, but we're not evil...

[vampireuk]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
but we're not evil...

And neither is Europe:p

[1stFlight]

Originally posted by vampireuk
And neither is Europe:p

Or France .....*ducks*

[ricercar]

Actually I don't have any problems with a people or a country withdrawing support for any cause they disagree with. If the US doesn't want to expose its soldiers to war crimes, the US can and should withhold any exposure to that danger.

Think about it. The US is giving away something free or at low cost to the needy. If the needy want to impose rules the US disagrees with, the US finds someone to help without disagreeable conditionals.

Is the US wrong? No ****ing way. If I chose to give to the Red Cross instead of Amnesty International, and I wrong? No ****ing way. When a people are altruistic, it should be by their own choices, and that donation shouldn't be criticised.

If the common people starves or has no militia because their government wants a war crime treaty signed, then let the common people arise and get a new government.

[vampireuk]

If the US want to keep their troops safe of war crime charges then they should perhaps remove them all together from any chance of that happening?

[2fast4u]

Originally posted by ricercar
AIf the US doesn't want to expose its soldiers to war crimes, the US can and should withhold any exposure to that danger.

and you dont find it at least one bit suspicious that the us doesnt want to be subject to be treated for war crimes? :rolleyes: what are these government guys trying to tell us? feck, this whole international law "crap" was introduced by the usa so all of the sudden we dont need it anymore cuz we are the good guys? :angel:

[1stFlight]

The point isn't why they are supporting the treaty, it's why we aren't. The criminal court works both ways and it would serve to make the world a better place if we'd stop undermining it.

Most of the world problems are created because the people can't geta forum for justice, now one is finally coming together.

[outriding9800]

Originally posted by Matthyahuw
what? like Flouride? :rolleyes:

no like chemical weapons.

it happened like in the 70's ish.

there was a court trial and the court said the military had all the rights to do that.

http://www.tpromo.com/usvi/dod_test.htm

https://www.classactionamerica.com/cases/case.asp?cid=2124

http://www.rense.com/politics5/hist.htm

[Riptide]

I believe one of the reasons we aren't in this case is due to the crazy belgians again. Trying to get general franks for a bunch of bogus charges.

The situtation at the end of WWII and nuremberg was a lot more clear cut as far as the guilt of those involved and the validity of the charges.

[ricercar]

Originally posted by 2fast4u
and you dont find it at least one bit suspicious that the us doesnt want to be subject to be treated for war crimes?


No, I find it as self-preservation. If I'm helping someone, I don't want to be arrested because of that help. There's enough difficulty bringing home every US soldiers stationed away without some foreign local thinking a US soldier was a "war criminal" for doing his job properly against the foreign local's hostile father.

We can safely assume there are evil US soldiers, but the vast majority are not. Acting sanely is hard enough when you're not holding a weapon under enemy fire. The US doesn't want to sign a treaty that will decrease the chances of "the boys" all coming home safely.

I do not object to punishing war crimes. I do object to signing a treaty that decreases the chance that the honorable sons and daughters of my community won't come home.

I am suspicious of George Bush, and I do not support the assinine decisions he's made, but I do see the twisted logic in this one.

[2fast4u]

Originally posted by ricercar
No, I call it self-preservation. If I'm helping someone, I don't want to be arrested because of that help. The US doesn't want to sign a treaty that will decrease the chances of "the boys" all coming home safely.

real justice doesnt care about how you call a military action. everyone should be equal. period.