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View Full Version : Is anyone else sick of game developers using PC piracy as a scapegoat?


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Sean_W
12-21-09, 03:32 PM
I don't know about you but I get sick of hearing game developing companies claiming piracy is the reason they moving to consoles.

There is all sorts of reasons why games don't sell so well when compared to their console counterparts.

Here're a few;

1. Consoles get a lot more marketings. When was the last time you seen Games for Windows ads being shown every day on a load of channels?

2. The game is more suited to console users. We see this all the time now don't we? It's either a poor port or lacks any kind of PC feature set.

3. Too many unneeded hoops to jump through to get the game to play. GTA IV is a prime example of how bad this is.

4. The PC version has way more bugs and needs serious patching after release. Yet again, GTA IV was and still is a prime example. The new patch actually introduces more bugs that don't exist in the console version.

I just think game developers have gotten greedy like the rest of the world. The only difference is, piracy is made a scapegoat and they don't have the balls to tell us the real reason. Money, money, money! (pb)

Bah!
12-21-09, 04:21 PM
I'm no more sick of hearing them scapegoat piracy as I am of gamers calling businesses greedy for trying to make money.

Seriously, if it were your company what would you do? These aren't non-profits we are talking about after all.

Woodelf
12-21-09, 04:23 PM
Well, if computer games go away - at least we still have free porn.(nana2)

Sean_W
12-21-09, 04:34 PM
I'm no more sick of hearing them scapegoat piracy as I am of gamers calling businesses greedy for trying to make money.

Seriously, if it were your company what would you do? These aren't non-profits we are talking about after all.

Well, I would just turn around and say 'Developing games for consoles as a business make us more money than the PC does' and not just play the piracy card.

Piracy has always been a problem on just about every computer platform, but it didn't stop game developers making money since that's exactly where they came from.

Johnny C
12-21-09, 04:46 PM
Modded consoles.....that is all

aceflier
12-21-09, 05:27 PM
I'm assuming the op is referencing the latest interview with crytek?

I do think they blame piracy far to often instead of taking some of the blame themselves. Making a game that what 2 years later finally runs at 60fps at 1080p with a little AA. (5970)

Don't get me wrong I liked crysis and warhead and paid for both of them but they arent even in top 100 pc games of all time in my book. So to expect sales figures to reach anywhere near say left 4 dead2 is an insult.

And do we see valve complaining about piracy? NO! They make great games. 3 or 4 I consider greatest of all time.

Take lessons Crytek/Epic when you try and sell a mediocre game you get mediocre sales.

Not sure I will buy crysis2 hows that for a sales figure?

|MaguS|
12-21-09, 05:50 PM
Um Valve doesn't complain because they are also developing games for the Xbox 360... they are not a PC Exclusive developer. You can bitch about how they use Piracy as a scapegoat but it is a huge problem for PC Exclusive game developers. Why do you think most major PC Developers have already gone multiplatform they cannot afford to stay PC Exclusive.

Yes piracy is on consoles aswell but it doesn't affect the platform as much. Crysis had tons of advertising when it was released, I remember seeing commercials for it. WoW has more commercials then most console games.

In the end the developer wants to turn a profit, they don't want to break even. They are a business and make games for profit, not to see the smile on your face.

mailman2
12-21-09, 06:02 PM
BIG HELL YA!

Sazar
12-21-09, 06:03 PM
I'm assuming the op is referencing the latest interview with crytek?

I do think they blame piracy far to often instead of taking some of the blame themselves. Making a game that what 2 years later finally runs at 60fps at 1080p with a little AA. (5970)

Don't get me wrong I liked crysis and warhead and paid for both of them but they arent even in top 100 pc games of all time in my book. So to expect sales figures to reach anywhere near say left 4 dead2 is an insult.

And do we see valve complaining about piracy? NO! They make great games. 3 or 4 I consider greatest of all time.

Take lessons Crytek/Epic when you try and sell a mediocre game you get mediocre sales.

Not sure I will buy crysis2 hows that for a sales figure?

What are you talking about?

Crysis ran perfectly fine on lower end systems. You just couldn't play it with everything maxed out. The game was quite scalable.

I LOVED both the Crysis games because there was a lot of freedom in the world and I could choose to play however I wanted with the different weapons and suit mods. There was a lot of innovation in the game overall.

Also, if Epic says there were millions more calls on servers than actual games sold, that gives you an idea of the scale of the piracy.

These guys spend years developing engines and tech and games to be able to entertain and make money at the end. It is not a good feeling having your work stolen. Most of the people who pirate probably wouldn't buy the games anyways, so cutting them out of the framework is perfectly fine.

I do agree, however, that legit buyers, like us, do also suffer the consequences.

musman
12-21-09, 06:10 PM
Don't people pirate counsel games too?

Sazar
12-21-09, 06:13 PM
Don't people pirate counsel games too?

Not to the same degree as PC games.

Sean_W
12-21-09, 06:15 PM
I don't think game developers for the PC have been living in huts for the last ten years because they cannot turn a profit.

I remember seeing a video of EA's car park and thinking, 'it must be nice being a game developer' since most of them have pretty sweet cars.

aceflier
12-21-09, 06:15 PM
Where did i say crysis didnt scale well?

And how many people actually thought ut3 was good? I played the free demo and it was laughable.

I'm talking about a quality title. Hell look at batman AA its a port and it sold alot more than crysis and ut3 prolly more than them combined. Because it was a good game.

|MaguS|
12-21-09, 06:32 PM
And how many people actually thought ut3 was good? I played the free demo and it was laughable.

UT3 was more of a tech demo, Epic is more of a middleware developer then they are a game developer now.

Sean_W, Yes some developers make good money but that average programmer makes around 40K-50K a year. Even then look at how many are now at work because studios go under. Also why is how much they make even brought into the equation, their games are still under selling even though they are doing their job (they don't get paid commission). So if the company doesn't profit their jobs are still at risk.

Sean_W
12-21-09, 06:55 PM
Well, my point is that a lot of game developers you see now moving away from the PC made their money selling PC games, and piracy has not changed that since it's nothing new.

Why not talk about the games that did sell well rather than the ones that didn't, since all games are pirated.

Woodelf
12-21-09, 07:07 PM
I thought steam was going to be the solution.
Why don't they (crytek) make people log in if they have that big of a loss.
I think they are just taking the lazy way out and are trying to justify it.

Sazar
12-21-09, 07:09 PM
Well, my point is that a lot of game developers you see now moving away from the PC made their money selling PC games, and piracy has not changed that since it's nothing new.

Why not talk about the games that did sell well rather than the once that didn't, since all games are pirated.

I think you may be missing the point.

They are STILL releasing games for the PC, but instead of making it 100% PC exclusive, they are spreading the risk and opening revenue streams by making the game work on consoles as well. So now, even if it is pirated like crazy on PC, you will have still have console revenue coming in.

Greg
12-21-09, 07:23 PM
What the OP is calling 'game developers' are really 'game publishers'. There are very few truly independent game development studios left in the world.

Publishers fund and control most game projects. Do you really think the creative and skilled game dev minds out there are thinking "Great, the Shrek movie has been released, lets make a game based on that!" or "Lets use Starforce on our next game and really frustrate those pirates!". Absolutely not. Game developers and their studios are similar to music artists, they want to make great entertainment products but are kept poor and regularly abused by their publishers. Look at the top twenty game sales from this year and the last... same old story... Sequels, Sports, Movie licenses. Publishers will switch platforms to wherever they believe the money is. They will also use any DRM available, favoring online central license server 'lock-in' systems like Steam which prevent re-sale and sharing as well as statistics gathering.

Aphot
12-21-09, 07:35 PM
This year ticket sales for movies are at an all time high. People have money and they aren't going to spend it on crap.

Make a good game and people will buy it.

Greg
12-21-09, 07:43 PM
...Make a good game and people will buy it.
If only that were true. The sad reality is...

Make a soso game, spend 2-4x dev budget advertising it and people will buy it.

|MaguS|
12-21-09, 08:13 PM
If only that were true. The sad reality is...

Make a soso game, spend 2-4x dev budget advertising it and people will buy it.

Or make a great game and its still pirated to hell... people who pirate games just don't buy games. Don't give me that bull**** of "oh I try it before I buy it" because that isn't the case. Once someone has it for free they wont go out and spend money on it.

Oh and I loved the excuse of cost of games being the reason for piracy, if that were the case then budget and indie titles wouldn't be pirated... yet they are. Oh and its not about beating copy protections because even games that use a simple disc check or even no copy protection are pirated...

Piracy is too big of a problem to be exclusive to the PC, if a developer wants to create a profit they must go multiplatform or be a huge AAA game on a console.

trivium nate
12-21-09, 08:22 PM
Yeah im sick of it

NarcissistZero
12-21-09, 08:29 PM
And how many people actually thought ut3 was good? I played the free demo and it was laughable.

I liked it. People gave up on it way too quickly for rather silly reasons. I think its biggest problem is people had old hardware and were content with UT2k4.

As for the topic, piracy is a reality on EVERY platform except maybe the PS3. I read articles all the time about DS, PSP and Xbox piracy. Why is it not as huge a deal to devs? Because the PC market as a whole is rather small, and the piracy on PC particularly easy and large in numbers, and thus it is a bigger fish in a smaller pond.

Other things are harming PC gaming just as much if not more, mostly the influx of more mainstream gamers who would never even think to build a PC gaming rig or even set up a game's resolution in a menu. Most of these people don't even know 1080p means 1920x1080. That is PC gaming's largest problem.

Piracy just makes it a lot worse.

Sazar
12-21-09, 09:41 PM
This year ticket sales for movies are at an all time high. People have money and they aren't going to spend it on crap.

Make a good game and people will buy it.

Sorry Aphot, that is just b.s. :)

For example, Transformers 2 is the highest grossing movie this year in the US. The movie was absolutely rubbish, outside of nausea inducing special effects.

People will buy rubbish products because of hype (i.e. MW2 at $59.99) because consumers are ultimately, for the most part, driven by hype as much as they are by content.

Initially, the biggest complaint I heard about Crysis was not that the gameplay was bad or that the story was overly ridiculous. Nope, it was that the players could not play it maxed out and that when they raised the IQ levels, it was chugging along on their systems. Unfortunately, you have to temper expectations to the lowest common denominator, and it is not always good.

|MaguS|
12-21-09, 09:45 PM
Initially, the biggest complaint I heard about Crysis was not that the gameplay was bad or that the story was overly ridiculous. Nope, it was that the players could not play it maxed out and that when they raised the IQ levels, it was chugging along on their systems. Unfortunately, you have to temper expectations to the lowest common denominator, and it is not always good.

The developer should though also be blaimed for not setting expectations. They advertised the game and showed it off at insane levels that even the best consumer PCs could not play at. They tricked and lied about the engines flexibility inregards to how it would look and play to the majority of consumers.

I had a top rig when that game came out and the game would not even be playable at its max settings yet even then the game did not look as good as it did in developer ran clips.