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onmikesline
02-17-10, 08:37 PM
Keep in mind that a single 30" screen has about 70% more pixels than a 1920x1200 24" screen.
So it's not a given that 5970 Crossfire can handle six 30" easily. I'd say 5970 Crossfire is the sweet spot for 3 30" screens, which already says a lot about the power of such a system. Plus I still think that 1GB is not enough for anything higher than that.
im on a 30'' dell with one 5870, some games it really kills my fps on 2560x1600, but for the most part, i can max out games easy, i think its more driver issues because how it acts when its that high of a res in games. when i updated my drivers to 10.1 i got over 30% in fps gain and windows score is 7.9

Snake101st
02-17-10, 08:42 PM
^ you act like its going to be better then the ati, what if its 2x as much as the ati and 10% faster? will you still get it lol

Yes, Ill get at least one because I love Nvidia 3d Vision. Id probably wait a while for the price to go down if its over $500ish though. :p

shadow001
02-17-10, 09:21 PM
Yes, Ill get at least one because I love Nvidia 3d Vision. Id probably wait a while for the price to go down if its over $500ish though. :p


If it's over 500$ and finally gets released,beating the current HD5870 cards by the rumored 20%,then you'll have the same situation that existed between the HD4870 cards and the GTX280,or between the HD4890 and the GTX285 cards.....Nvidia charging a large premium for a relatively small lead in overall performance,even if you discount the card being released 6 months late,compared to when the HD5870 was released.


And it still doesn't beat the HD5970 cards anyhow,not to mention that there could be refresh cards from ATI shortly after Fermi is released,so Nvidia really screwed up here,at least when it comes to the first generation of the GF100,and it's time to look past that to be honest,into the second or third generation of Fermi,hopefully using a smaller fab process.

Snake101st
02-17-10, 10:04 PM
If it's over 500$ and finally gets released,beating the current HD5870 cards by the rumored 20%,then you'll have the same situation that existed between the HD4870 cards and the GTX280,or between the HD4890 and the GTX285 cards.....Nvidia charging a large premium for a relatively small lead in overall performance,even if you discount the card being released 6 months late,compared to when the HD5870 was released.


And it still doesn't beat the HD5970 cards anyhow,not to mention that there could be refresh cards from ATI shortly after Fermi is released,so Nvidia really screwed up here,at least when it comes to the first generation of the GF100,and it's time to look past that to be honest,into the second or third generation of Fermi,hopefully using a smaller fab process.

Id pay $500 or less for the GTX480 vs. 5870's @ $400ish right now because CF has too many issues. Im not a fanboy, I have a few friends that complain all the time about flickering and whatnot, and I like nvidia's drivers better overall... plus I just spent all this $$ on a 120hz monitor and 3d glasses, so I want to use them heh.

Muppet
02-17-10, 10:51 PM
Yeah. They are supposed to launch within 5 weeks and we still know pretty much nothing as far as clocks, benches, and actual performance.

Yes indeed. I would think they would have to release some info, clock speeds and benchmarks pretty soon. Especially if they do intend to release this quarter.

shadow001
02-17-10, 10:56 PM
Id pay $500 or less for the GTX480 vs. 5870's @ $400ish right now because CF has too many issues. Im not a fanboy, I have a few friends that complain all the time about flickering and whatnot, and I like nvidia's drivers better overall... plus I just spent all this $$ on a 120hz monitor and 3d glasses, so I want to use them heh.



Well at least for 3D vision support,ATI are adding it to the next driver release(Catalyst 10.3),but are keeping it open standard rather than keeping it proprietary like Nvidia is doing,and as for Crossfire support,the driver set they released earlier today(10.2),adds crossfire profiles that are installed as a seperate package and can be updated independently of the actual drivers.


So as soon as a new game hits retail,users can expect updates within days for that game with crossfire support,rather than waiting 1+ month for a new driver release,which was the previous way of getting crossfire support for new games.


I've got a pair of HD5970's right now,and i've been using a pair of HD4870 X2's since those got released in 2008,and from personal experience,at least with the games i've played,crossfire support has been pretty decent overall.


Here's the article so you can read what's coming with the 10.2 and 10.3 driver sets:


http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/3140/future_ati_catalyst_drivers_why_you_should_be_exci ted/index.html

Snake101st
02-17-10, 11:00 PM
Well at least for 3D vision support,ATI are adding it to the next driver release(Catalyst 10.3),but are keeping it open standard rather than keeping it proprietary like Nvidia is doing,and as for Crossfire support,the driver set they released earlier today(10.2),adds crossfire profiles that are installed as a seperate package and can be updated independently of the actual drivers.





Hmm thats pretty interesting, if their 3d support extends to 3d vision and has decent support/profiles like nvidia, I may have to re-evaluate my options. :)

shadow001
02-17-10, 11:25 PM
Hmm thats pretty interesting, if their 3d support extends to 3d vision and has decent support/profiles like nvidia, I may have to re-evaluate my options. :)


I think you can use any monitor that supports 120Hz refresh and use any 3D glasses you want basically....ATI are keeping it an open standard.

JasonPC
02-17-10, 11:49 PM
Hopefully we will start hearing some more info soon. Nvidia's twitter page seems to be hinting at something big.

Muppet
02-18-10, 12:09 AM
That is great news about ATI supporting 3D. With all the major players involved, they can really push it forward. Honestly once you game in 3d, you'll never want to go back. It really is that immersible :D

Snake101st
02-18-10, 12:15 AM
That is great news about ATI supporting 3D. With all the major players involved, they can really push it forward. Honestly once you game in 3d, you'll never want to go back. It really is that immersible :D

Yeah I felt like I was taking a gamble on a gimmick, since thats what everyone was saying about 3d vision, and then I booted up Batman... It was all :D from that point forward. I really hope it takes off!

Muppet
02-18-10, 12:19 AM
Yeah I felt like I was taking a gamble on a gimmick, since thats what everyone was saying about 3d vision, and then I booted up Batman... It was all :D from that point forward. I really hope it takes off!

I would honestly think it is people who have never tried 3D, that think it is a gimmick.

Revs
02-18-10, 03:26 AM
I would honestly think it is people who have never tried 3D, that think it is a gimmick.

I'm gonna join the 3D posse as soon as 42"+ 3DTV's are available at a reasonable price. Also, this new ghost-free 3D tech Panasonic are releasing soon will probably be worth waiting for. TBH I can't wait for the Avatar BluRay3D release, too :D. I'm hoping it all comes together later this year.

lee63
02-18-10, 09:18 AM
I'm gonna join the 3D posse as soon as 42"+ 3DTV's are available at a reasonable price. Also, this new ghost-free 3D tech Panasonic are releasing soon will probably be worth waiting for. TBH I can't wait for the Avatar BluRay3D release, too :D. I'm hoping it all comes together later this year.I'm getting the new 2010 Panasonic 50VT25....rumor has it that it comes with a BluRay player but only one pair of glasses :thumbdwn:

The price is $2499.98....here's a thread on the new models.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1214096

shadow001
02-18-10, 02:02 PM
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3D_Vision_Requirements.html



That's the main difference though,you still need to use Nvidia's own 3D glasses and displays that are supported within the drivers themselves,while ATI's aproach allows users to use any 3D glasses they wish,and there are better ones on the market than what Nvidia supports,as well as using all displays that support 120 Hz refresh rates,including some recent models of LCD TV's already support,and not just LCD desktop displays.

shadow001
02-18-10, 02:20 PM
Ouch if true,and even though it comes from charlie over at semi accurate,which is widely known he's got no love for Nvidia to say the least,he has been pretty accurate with regards to fermi issues over past 6 months,so his sources,whoever they are,have been providing accurate information.


http://www.semiaccurate.com/2010/02/17/nvidias-fermigtx480-broken-and-unfixable/


Seems the A3 yeilds are still way too low for any sort of high volume availability,and that to fix it and the high power draw,doesn't require a simpler and faster metal respin like what they've been doing for the last 3 revisions so far(A1 to A3),but a full base layer respin which would include new masks,and delay fermi at least another 3~6 months in the process.


Also seems that the clock speeds for it hit 600 Mhz at most,even with 64 SP's disabled,and only 5000 to 8000 cards available on the first run,with the actual performance lead with the reduced clocks and shaders will be about 12% faster than cypress overall,and that's with the card using 280 watts of power,versus the 188 watts than cypress uses,while the HD5970 remains untouchable basically....This is not good.

shadow001
02-18-10, 02:44 PM
what ATI approach? They have nothing on the market at the moment. I hear Duke Nukem Forever is an excellent game by the way ;)



3D Stereoscopic support

While ATI won't be offering their own 3D support like NVIDIA does with its 3D Vision, they will be updating their D3D driver to enable 3rd party middleware vendor support such as iZ3D. They'll be able to offer support for 120 Hz screens and output 60 Hz per eye.

ATI have said they don't want to lock users into only one option like NVIDIA do with 3D Vision. This isn't the first time we've seen ATI say this; in the past they said how they didn't want to lock users into an ATI branded only physics support like NVIDIA do with PhysX.


http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/3140/future_ati_catalyst_drivers_why_you_should_be_exci ted/index4.html


You should also read the next page on that article for eyefinity bezel correction...it's pretty cool to make sure that no graphics information is lost between the bezel frames.

Enrico_be
02-18-10, 02:51 PM
@ semiaccurate article.

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/Madshrimp.png

Uggerber asks Igor Stanek (Nvidia) : "Honestly, is there any truth to this Charlie BS?"

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/Igor.png

:thumbsup:

---
---
---

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/tease2.png

I'm ready :)

Enrico_be
02-18-10, 04:30 PM
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20100218124405_Fermi_Architecture_Will_Only_Hit_th e_Pull_Stride_Next_Quarter_CEO_of_Nvidia.html

Nvidia Corp. will finally start selling its highly-anticipated GeForce GTX 400-series graphics cards as well as other products based on the code-named Fermi architecture and GF100 (NV60, G300, GT300) graphics processing unit (GPU) in the first quarter of fiscal 2011, it looks like mass availability of appropriate products is only expected in Q2 of FY 2011.

Q2 [of FY 2011] is going to be the quarter when Fermi is hitting the pull stride. It will not just be one Fermi product, there will be a couple of Fermi products to span many different price ranges, but also the Fermi products will span GeForce Quadro and Tesla. So, we are going to be ramping now on Fermi architecture products through Q2 and we are building a lot of it. I am really excited about the upcoming launch of Fermi and I think it will more than offset the seasonality that we usually see in Q2, said Jen-Hsun Huang, chief executive officer of Nvidia, during the most recent conference call with financial analysts.
--

2011 :/ ?

shadow001
02-18-10, 05:41 PM
@ semiaccurate article.

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/Madshrimp.png

Uggerber asks Igor Stanek (Nvidia) : "Honestly, is there any truth to this Charlie BS?"

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/Igor.png

:thumbsup:

---
---
---

http://www.we-wi.be/Images/Nvidia/tease2.png

I'm ready :)


Maybe it is or not,the point being is that even from as way back as july of 2009,charlie has been stating that Fermi is a no show for 2009,even when Nvidia's own CEO stated that a november 2009 release for fermi was possible,and charlie also suggested that it depended on the number of revisions that fermi required in the end,which he also stated 6+ months ago,that if Fermi required 3 revisions,we wouldn't see it until march of 2010 at the earliest.


This latest article simply adds that clock speeds for Fermi aren't what Nvidia wanted initially(750/1500Mhz was the mark),or that yeilds are still crappy even now with the A3 revision,even with the chips clocked at 600Mhz and having 64 shaders disabled,and even then still using 280 watts of power in the process.


It was stated months ago that fermi "Should" be 60% faster than cypress initially,but i'm guessing that would be if the clocks really were 750/1500 as initially intended,with the full 512 shaders enabled.


But like you said,we'll see next month for the truth,should the retail versions of Fermi run no faster than 600 Mhz with 448 SP enabled,really consumes 280 watts and availability really is that limited to under 10 000 cards for the first production batch,and keep in mind that like him or hate him,charlie hasn't been wrong with regards to fermi so far,so that's something to keep in mind.

shadow001
02-18-10, 05:45 PM
you clearly do not understand the different 3d technologies. sorry, you are dead wrong.
Let me educate you:

Iz3d requires you to use THEIR specific monitors that are two LCDs stacked upon eachother and require you to use THEIR polarized glasses. They also have a method of using shutter glasses but you have to use with a limited range of TVs which means the same selection of tvs as supported by Nvidia.

AMD talked about a broader approach during the last CES but that approach is NOT available yet thus potentially vaporware much like Duke Nukem 3d. Meanwhile Nvidia's solution is mature and immediately available.

I have the Iz3d and Nvidia solutions at my house and have used both and I have been sponsored by both companies.


The point is that you have more options than simply what's on Nvidia's list of supported hardware,and can use whatever 3D glasses you want as well.

shadow001
02-18-10, 06:53 PM
You can't use ANY glasses on an unreleased system that, as far as we know, only exists on paper or in someone's mind. if you bothered to watch teh video you will even say THEY are making the glasses and that they are different and theoretically an improvement over Nvidia's. Again, their solution is as available as Duke Nukem Foverver. I personally am not going to forgo all other games since Duke Nukem Forever is right around the corner.


Err...The graphics hardware supports it just fine with just a driver update,which is coming with the Catalyst 10.3 driver set next month,and you can pick wichever monitor you like as long as it supports 120 hz refresh or use whatever 3D glasses you wish to use with those displays.


if you want to use IZ3D's,or any other kit that's sold as a package,go for it...If you want to use seperate parts for the displays and glasses,that come from different hardware vendors,that's cool too....The consumer has the choice in the end.


EDIT:Here's some models for glasses.

http://www.i-glassesstore.com/iglassespc-3d.html


http://news.cnet.com/crave/?keyword=3D+glasses


There's many more brands available too....

onmikesline
02-18-10, 09:04 PM
LOL - so you can use polarized or shutter glasses? Sorry, that is complete bull****. I am going to point this thread out to my friends at Iz3d and Nvidia for a good laugh. please at least try to educate yourself on the basics before you jump in.

people like you cant think outside the box?

onmikesline
02-18-10, 09:04 PM
I dont have a Fermi yet but I just did get this gift from Nvidia
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/235/dsc02180vm.jpg
i used to have that card :)

CaptNKILL
02-18-10, 09:18 PM
i used to have that card :)

You're probably thinking of the Geforce FX 5800, not the Quadro FX 5800. :lol:

The quadro currently costs around $3000.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133253&cm_re=quadro_fx_5800-_-14-133-253-_-Product