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Yaboze
03-08-10, 03:38 PM
It seems the Fermi will be very limited and be hard to get. Looks like if you want something better than a 285 or 295, then you gotta move to a AMD 5X70.

Vardant
03-08-10, 03:51 PM
I'm not sure what to think.
First we've heard Fermi will have software tesselator, which was proven wrong. After that, it was supposed to be really hot, but the coolers actually look great.
Than it was eating too much power, but if NV PSU recommendation tells us anything, it looks this won't be the case either. We've also been told, that they missed their clocks by a lot and we won't see anything beyond 650MHz, but recent rumours put it over 700MHz, so that might not be the case either.

The only thing I can say for sure is, that these rumours made most forums unreadable :thumbdwn:

Ninja Prime
03-08-10, 03:58 PM
I'm not sure what to think.
First we've heard Fermi will have software tesselator, which was proven wrong. After that, it was supposed to be really hot, but the coolers actually look great.
Than it was eating too much power, but if NV PSU recommendation tells us anything, it looks this won't be the case either. We've also been told, that they missed their clocks by a lot and we won't see anything beyond 650MHz, but recent rumours put it over 700MHz, so that might not be the case either.

The only thing I can say for sure is, that these rumours made most forums unreadable :thumbdwn:

I'm still not convinced they have real tesselation hardware, it is really hot, it has one of the first stock direct contact heatpipe coolers and a 1.8 amp 12v fan, compared to a normal fan like the 5870s, which is a 0.8 amp fan. It eats more power than anything else in its performance class, it eats more power per unit of performance than the competition, it requires a better powersupply with higher power ratings than previous generations and the competition does. They did miss their clocks, they are 625MHz, target was 750MHZ. All these things are true.

So, are you just being a blind fanboy or what? I'm curious as to why these things are out there now for everyone to see, but for some reason you don't believe them?

MUYA
03-08-10, 09:01 PM
I'm still not convinced they have real tesselation hardware, it is really hot, it has one of the first stock direct contact heatpipe coolers and a 1.8 amp 12v fan, compared to a normal fan like the 5870s, which is a 0.8 amp fan. It eats more power than anything else in its performance class, it eats more power per unit of performance than the competition, it requires a better powersupply with higher power ratings than previous generations and the competition does. They did miss their clocks, they are 625MHz, target was 750MHZ. All these things are true.

So, are you just being a blind fanboy or what? I'm curious as to why these things are out there now for everyone to see, but for some reason you don't believe them?

Why don't you ease off on the name calling Ninja. Vardant has his preferences and his own reason to state what he believes just like you have, leave him to it, he hasn't called you out and you shouldn't either.

Can we all calm down just a little bit thanks. I know its the silly season and its fun to speculate/have a discussion but, we should do it a manner with less of the name calling, certainly stop ourselves from goading and being rude to each other.

Let's all try to keep things civilized thanks.

Iruwen
03-09-10, 04:41 AM
I'm still not convinced they have real tesselation hardware, it is really hot, it has one of the first stock direct contact heatpipe coolers and a 1.8 amp 12v fan, compared to a normal fan like the 5870s, which is a 0.8 amp fan. It eats more power than anything else in its performance class, it eats more power per unit of performance than the competition, it requires a better powersupply with higher power ratings than previous generations and the competition does. They did miss their clocks, they are 625MHz, target was 750MHZ. All these things are true.

So, are you just being a blind fanboy or what? I'm curious as to why these things are out there now for everyone to see, but for some reason you don't believe them?

Must of this simply isn't true, so I won't even bother to argue about it EDITED by MUYA Less of the calling out /goading please

/e: I'm sorry. So I'll argue instead ;) Not about the real tesselation hardware thing though :cool: Obviously it isn't hot because the GTX 470 has a worst case TDP of 225W, also this could be seen (or heard and felt) at the Cebit. Just because the fan can draw 1,8A at max load, that doesn't mean it will. All GTX 400 at the Cebit have not been loud. The GTX 280 had a 0,48A fan - so it was way more silent that a 5870? Also, this doesn't have to be the reference design, I think like the final clocks it wasn't sure at this time. Since the real world performance isn't clear yet, nobody can say how much power they will consume in relation to their performance. If they use 10 or 20W more than an ATI card than that actually isn't much and one has to keep the cards' featureset in mind. The same is true for the power supplies (don't focus on power supply recommendations but rather on how many amps are required), a GTX 285 required 40A, the 5870 requires 40A, the GTX 480 seems to require 42A so the GTX 470 will be en par with the other cards - how good or bad this is again depends on real world performance. The final clock speeds aren't even known yet.

weevil
03-09-10, 06:25 AM
for some reason you don't believe them?

Just the facts ma'am

Ninja Prime
03-09-10, 02:40 PM
Why don't you ease off on the name calling Ninja. Vardant has his preferences and his own reason to state what he believes just like you have, leave him to it, he hasn't called you out and you shouldn't either.

Can we all calm down just a little bit thanks. I know its the silly season and its fun to speculate/have a discussion but, we should do it a manner with less of the name calling, certainly stop ourselves from goading and being rude to each other.

Let's all try to keep things civilized thanks.

I'm not calling him out, as I said, I'm just curious as to why he says the opposite when it has been fairly well proven true.

Iruwen
03-09-10, 02:49 PM
You just repeated Charlie's FUD, I wouldn't call that proven.

Dogmifier
03-09-10, 08:35 PM
I said in another thread, I'll say here. Whichever card you like, and both are good cards (I just happen to like nvidia better than ATi), there's really no reason to bash the other.

Buy what you want...don't worry about what Joe Jim Bob around the corner buys.

Hot, not hot, Tesselation hardware or not....driver issues or not. I'll be buying an NV Fermi. Fanboy you say? Ok..I can live with that. I'll worry about buying what you like when you pay for what I Buy...

Other than that, why all the hostility?

JasonPC
03-09-10, 11:54 PM
Well that was the 470 have yet to see the 480's clock. I had always thought it was the 480 that had a targeted clock of around 700 and 512 cuda cores. There's obviously a large power draw difference between the two cards and I'm betting the clock speed has a lot to do with that. But even if it does near the target clocks I am willing to bet they're going to price most people out into getting the 470.

Ninja Prime
03-10-10, 01:48 AM
You just repeated Charlie's FUD, I wouldn't call that proven.

None of that came from charlie.

scubes
03-10-10, 02:44 AM
i say they will charge about £ 450 to 550 quid and theres no way ill pay that come on a half a grand thats wot overclockers are charging for the ati 5970 these ppl need to wise up and lower the prices...

nekrosoft13
03-14-10, 03:41 PM
Grey screen of death?

or the great Green Screen while running some h264 in DXVA

shadow001
03-14-10, 04:13 PM
Must of this simply isn't true, so I won't even bother to argue about it EDITED by MUYA Less of the calling out /goading please

/e: I'm sorry. So I'll argue instead ;) Not about the real tesselation hardware thing though :cool: Obviously it isn't hot because the GTX 470 has a worst case TDP of 225W, also this could be seen (or heard and felt) at the Cebit. Just because the fan can draw 1,8A at max load, that doesn't mean it will. All GTX 400 at the Cebit have not been loud. The GTX 280 had a 0,48A fan - so it was way more silent that a 5870? Also, this doesn't have to be the reference design, I think like the final clocks it wasn't sure at this time. Since the real world performance isn't clear yet, nobody can say how much power they will consume in relation to their performance. If they use 10 or 20W more than an ATI card than that actually isn't much and one has to keep the cards' featureset in mind. The same is true for the power supplies (don't focus on power supply recommendations but rather on how many amps are required), a GTX 285 required 40A, the 5870 requires 40A, the GTX 480 seems to require 42A so the GTX 470 will be en par with the other cards - how good or bad this is again depends on real world performance. The final clock speeds aren't even known yet.



Though on a general principle,would they design the cooling and specifically the amps used by the fan motor,if there would never be a case where a fan that powerfull wouldn't be needed?....That's the main issue,as engineeirng teams are extremely competent,and don't add things just for the fun of it.


just my 0.02 cents.

Iruwen
03-15-10, 06:40 AM
We'll see, my guess is that that fan won't be used on the final product.

Blacklash
03-16-10, 12:02 AM
I guess in ten more days or so the speculation will end. I'm eager to see how the 480 does.

gulizard
03-16-10, 06:01 AM
an nvidia fan forum, full of ati fans... wow all of a sudden I don't feel like I can come here and read post without seeing an damn ati war from the little fan boys. Yes I am a fan of nvidia, but I am on what is suppose to be an nvidia site, not a graphics war. No matter who wants to argue this, nvidia is on top, its not just on top in graphics. Its looking ahead at things outside of gaming. ATI is simply behind, and it will not catch up with people who have bought one and come here to post their awful experience. If this was some long time forum member I could see, but this guy is someone who asked a simple question because clearly he didn't want to tread through hours of "Hey ATI is better" threads to find the answer, which is exactly all these threads in the GF100 Thread is.

The guy answered a question and automatically 10 ****ing ati fan boys come here telling him hes wrong, just because hes unhappy. I mean come on if I go out here and buy a damn lawn mower for instances, and it doesn't work to my satisfaction, and I take it back, is the store clerk suppose to sit there and tell me how he has one, and its perfect, and how I am wrong. NOPE I'd throw the keys in his face, and request my ****ing money back. In this case its just a bunch of people who need to grow up and except the fact that not to many have had good experiences with these ****ty ATI card's. Most I find it rather funny that some are willing to down grade to a "lower" nvidia card just to avoid having to use the crappy ATI card. Everyone keeps coming here saying "The 5870 is so much faster then the 260" well good for it, but there isn't one game out there not even ****ty Crysis, that I can't play on mine, and enjoy, because 30-40 FPS is perfectly playable for me, and the 260 does a great job at handling that FPS without dipping to low.

I've been playing Bad Company 2, maxed out at 1600 by 1050 since its released, got 8XAA and I average around 35 to 45 FPS, sometimes into the upper 50's. Even in a intense sitation, fraps never reported my game dropping below 30 FPS.

So you guys have fun sitting here being little kiddies, but just be warned, this is an nvidia fan site, and I registered here because I like nvidia, and still do. I won't be buying no ****ty ATI CARD, and yes they are ****ty in MY opinion, which is the keyword there. If you wanna open your mouth with one, then be pre-warned ima spout right back, not one thing you can say here to offend me, or even counter anything I've said. I don't care how much higher the ATI card does in games, and I damn sure could careless about DX11 till more "DX11 games" are released. ATI has ****ty drivers, and from just reading the first page of this thread, "You gotta do this, and that to get this to work", **** that, if I bought an ATI card I'd be sending that hunk of **** back, if I couldn't even play without issue.

How many of you are in a gaming clan? Probably very few that are. I have CLAN MATES, that have those ****ty cards. They are always crashing, or having some complaint about their card. One guy had was playing took a screen shot and his **** had little tears all in it, I pointed out his card was articfacting it went out a week later. I am not talking about a small clan, I am talking about a pretty good sized clan here.

Bottom line is, theres more then a few people who disagree. So fan boys go away, go on over to that Rage3d site, and RAGE about your awesome cards there.

Iruwen
03-16-10, 08:37 AM
Wow, that's a lot of stars in this post.

/e: http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/18087/1/
GTX 470 ~349€

Ninja Prime
03-16-10, 02:27 PM
Bottom line is, theres more then a few people who disagree. So fan boys go away.

I agree. GTFO fanboy. Better yet, go back to jail.

Dogmifier
03-17-10, 05:45 PM
I agree. GTFO fanboy. Better yet, go back to jail.

I don't see the need for this, although I do have to say ...

For the amount of NV hate a lot of you seem to be putting out I wonder why you bother
to come here and post when there are plenty of ATi boards around.

Seems to me you just like to 'troll' and get a rise out of people. *shrug*

Both cards have their merits and problems. I fail to see why *EITHER* side needs
to berate the other..if you enjoy ATi, more power to you. I personally prefer NV.

Edit: To be fair, the NV person who you were going after needs to tone it down too. It's not
worth getting worked up about. It would be nice to come to an NV forum and not have to deal with the nv hate though.

Johnny C
03-17-10, 08:20 PM
I don't see the need for this, although I do have to say ...

For the amount of NV hate a lot of you seem to be putting out I wonder why you bother
to come here and post when there are plenty of ATi boards around.

Seems to me you just like to 'troll' and get a rise out of people. *shrug*

Both cards have their merits and problems. I fail to see why *EITHER* side needs
to berate the other..if you enjoy ATi, more power to you. I personally prefer NV.

Edit: To be fair, the NV person who you were going after needs to tone it down too. It's not
worth getting worked up about. It would be nice to come to an NV forum and not have to deal with the nv hate though.

Wow joined in Jan 2010.....

Calling long term members trolls because as technology evolved so did their selection in GPU's.

Why join another forum? That doesn't make sense at all, I joined here initially because of my Ti4600.....you might wanna google that one.

Like many others here that currently have ATi hardware, historically I've had nV based boards.....

So now ATi is on top and I bought that.....why wouldn't I continue to frequent the forums I have for 6 years?

Where the problem lies...is that some people can't accept that ATi has made a huge comeback, people are buying their Gpu's and talking about them in a positive sense....comparing them to the non-existent offerings from nV....

And when nV is on top again....in price, performance, features, and corporate ethics (I consider the disabling of hybrid physics and lying repeatedly about Fermi Sept-Jan to be unethical) I'll be buying up an EVGA something or other with an nVidia Gpu in it.

Till that Day, I'll continue to support AMD.

WTF is wrong with competition people? It's what's keeping graphics cards in the realm of "some what affordable".

This forum has gone for the ****s....since nV stopped being on top.....Fanbois just can't handle that.

Iruwen
03-18-10, 05:29 AM
No benchmarks at PAX. (http://www.nordichardware.com/en/component/content/article/71-graphics/10910-nvidia-moving-media-embargo-to-march-29th.html)

Enrico_be
03-18-10, 05:32 AM
No benchmarks at PAX. (http://www.nordichardware.com/en/component/content/article/71-graphics/10910-nvidia-moving-media-embargo-to-march-29th.html)

Aaw if true :/

But hey, 29 March ... we've waited so long now :D I can wait that few days extra, no problem :cool:

Vardant
03-18-10, 06:09 AM
At least you'll see Mafia II ;)
Calling all Mafia II fans attending PAX East from March 26-28! The 2K Games booth will be featuring Mafia II and a playable demo! Each day, weíll be hosting two play sessions specifically for Community VIPs (along with a special thank you gift for your support.) So how do you get on the list? Itís simple!

Email me at 2KElizabeth@2KGames.com with the subject line ďMafia II VIP at PAX East.Ē In the email, state your name, age (you must be 17 or older) and attach proof that youíll be attending PAX (a photo of your pass will do!)
http://www.mafia2game.com/community/us/home.php

Enrico_be
03-18-10, 01:26 PM
Manufactures wait and maybe another delay for GTX 400 Series (http://www.shanebaxtor.com/2010/03/19/manufactures-wait-and-maybe-another-delay-for-gtx-400-series/)

At the moment Iíve only managed to lock in a GTX 470 from NVIDIA directly who have said that getting a GTX 480 isnít possible due to short supply. Thatís fine; I can understand that. So I do what I always do at launch, chase a couple of manufactures for stock and get some retail samples.

I had one company commit to sending the GTX 470 and GTX 480 2 weeks ago but with cards only shipping between the 15th and 19th they didnít feel they would be able to send me full retail packaging. Thatís fine but today being the 19th factories in Taiwan and Honk Kong are still high and dry with no stock, making it at the moment impossible to lock down any retail samples.

Word going around is that the review date has been pushed back to as early as the 29th of March or as late as April 9th which we where first told was just going to be the retail date.

Iíve got a con call with NVIDIA in 10 hours and while weíre under NDA there should still be information I can tell you. Either way Iíll be sure to keep everyone in the loop.