PDA

View Full Version : Mipping pics - good or bad?


serAph
08-21-03, 12:20 AM
Here's some in-game shots of UT2K3 on my 5900. 8x AF, Quality, no AA, slight overclock, firstcoloredmip 1

drivers: "Starstorm 45.23x - Quality"

need any other info, ask.

http://personalpages.bellsouth.net/k/i/kieferkj/mip/ut2k3_mippping_8202003.jpg

http://personalpages.bellsouth.net/k/i/kieferkj/mip/ut2k3_mippping2_8202003.jpg


I wasnt too sure which angle to take the snaps from, so I took a couple. Anyway, is this good or bad mipping and why?

Steppy
08-21-03, 05:04 AM
Bad mipmapping...the colors should gradually blend into each other rather than well defined "lines" where the colors join.

Hanners
08-21-03, 05:50 AM
Originally posted by Steppy
Bad mipmapping...the colors should gradually blend into each other rather than well defined "lines" where the colors join.

Exactly. The harsh transitions are indicative of bilinear filtering, whereas the smoother transistions tend to show trilinear.

I might try and snap a couple of quick screenshots with my 9800 Pro in my lunchbreak, to show how things 'should' look for comparison. :)

Hanners
08-21-03, 07:52 AM
Okay, here's a couple of screenshots taken with a 9800 Pro using the Catalyst 3.6 drivers and the firstcoloredmip 1 command.

First up is 1024x768, no AF enabled, and trilinear enabled in UT2003.ini:

http://www.hanners.nildram.co.uk/ut2003trinoaniso.jpg

Second is 1024x768, with 16x Quality aniso selected via UT2003.ini (i.e. doing trilinear filtering on all texture stages):

http://www.hanners.nildram.co.uk/ut2003fulltrianiso.jpg

Ruined
08-21-03, 08:24 AM
FYI, Nvidia's official stance on this is that it will be fixed in Det50s.

Hanners
08-21-03, 08:28 AM
Originally posted by Ruined
FYI, Nvidia's official stance on this is that it will be fixed in Det50s.

They told [H] it would be fixed in the 45.23s, and look what happened there. I won't hold my breath waiting for them to remove this optimisation.

The Baron
08-21-03, 08:50 AM
It'll be removed when Doom 3 or HL2 replaces UT2003 as the FPS benchmark du jour.

serAph
08-21-03, 10:45 AM
Originally posted by The Baron
It'll be removed when Doom 3 or HL2 replaces UT2003 as the FPS benchmark du jour.

hahah :D you cynical person, you.... :) I sense you mean they'll take away trilinear from them...

anyway, Ok I understand now. Hehehe - Im glad I convinced my friend to get a 9800 instead of a 5900. We're gonna trade off every now and then.



After messin around with UT2k3 last night, I must say I am somewhat pleased with the quality - though not with the mip coloring - I cant imagine how good it would look with trilinear on. Has anyone tested the anti-detector script with 45.23 or 45.24 by chance? I know its a long shot, but just in case? Im gettin tired of piss-poor IQ in Planetside...

say nVidia fixes the bilinear cheat thing - am I going to have to edit an INI file to get best quality in UT2K3 or are those slider things in the driver panel gonna work?

Hanners
08-21-03, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by serAph
say nVidia fixes the bilinear cheat thing - am I going to have to edit an INI file to get best quality in UT2K3 or are those slider things in the driver panel gonna work?

If nVidia fixes it, you'll probably need to set the drivers to 'Application' mode for AF, and set trilinear and the aniso level within the UT2003.ini file to guarantee the best results.

Ruined
08-21-03, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by Hanners
They told [H] it would be fixed in the 45.23s, and look what happened there. I won't hold my breath waiting for them to remove this optimisation.

They told hardocp *something*, what it actually was who knows, though obviously it was interpreted to be the next driver release (though perhaps it was said in an ambiguous way where that would be assumed, but not the definite answer). This is the first time that Nvidia have gone on the record and publically stated in an interview that this specific issue would be fixed, and stated it would be so in the Det50 drivers. Could be BS, but this is straight from the horses mouth, no chance for misinterpretation here. If they don't do it in the Det50s, they will be directly breaking their word to the public. In the same interview they stated that the Det50s may have (but won't definitely have) an application checkbox where the app will control all.

serAph
08-21-03, 03:21 PM
over @ guru3d, everyone's talking about 50.xx like the friggin mesiah is coming or something. What do you guys think? I honestly am not letting my hopes get too high for obvious reasons.

reever2
08-21-03, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by serAph
over @ guru3d, everyone's talking about 50.xx like the friggin mesiah is coming or something. What do you guys think? I honestly am not letting my hopes get too high for obvious reasons.

If its anyting like the Detonator FX intro, its not going to be pretty, this Inq article springs to mind http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=9486

Hanners
08-22-03, 04:26 AM
Originally posted by serAph
over @ guru3d, everyone's talking about 50.xx like the friggin mesiah is coming or something. What do you guys think? I honestly am not letting my hopes get too high for obvious reasons.

People have been talking about those drivers since NV30 was released over 8 months ago, and we still haven't seen anything of them.

I'm sure they'll be good and all that, but you can't work miracles on a piece of hardware, it can only ever perform so well.

The Baron
08-22-03, 07:08 AM
Hanners, that depends on whether or not they fix the busted ILDP (well, according to Uttar) architecture. If they do, well, NV35 might gain a definite lead over R350 without any driver cheats. If they don't, which is probably more likely, then I don't know.

I think all of NVIDIA's hopes rest on fixing the NV3x's ILDP components.

serAph
08-22-03, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by The Baron
Hanners, that depends on whether or not they fix the busted ILDP (well, according to Uttar) architecture. If they do, well, NV35 might gain a definite lead over R350 without any driver cheats. If they don't, which is probably more likely, then I don't know.

I think all of NVIDIA's hopes rest on fixing the NV3x's ILDP components.

uh... thats definitely the first Ive heard of that! Sounds interesting. Do you know of any documentation on that? And will that increase shader speed?

The Baron
08-22-03, 08:56 AM
Go to Beyond3D, do a search for posts containing ILDP by Uttar. He posted his first ILDP discussion here, but he's elaborated upon it at B3D.

It's interesting stuff.

serAph
08-22-03, 08:58 AM
Originally posted by The Baron
Go to Beyond3D, do a search for posts containing ILDP by Uttar. He posted his first ILDP discussion here, but he's elaborated upon it at B3D.

It's interesting stuff.

aight. it sure sounds like it!

The Baron
08-22-03, 09:04 AM
Okay, so maybe the first part of the ILDP stuff isn't here. Guess I read it at B3D.

AnteP
08-22-03, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by Ruined
FYI, Nvidia's official stance on this is that it will be fixed in Det50s.

FYI they just said that they "wanted" to provide an option to disable these optimizations in Det 50.
They also said that these optimizations didn't lower image quality.

So in short it's a very faint maybe, not a promised fact.

And as Hanners mentions people have been talking about Detonator 50 since the early days of NV30, major performance increases, increased AA quality, increased AF quality, proper FP32 support, etc. etc.
Hell they'll probably cook me dinner and make me look beautifull while at it. ;)

serAph
08-22-03, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by The Baron
Okay, so maybe the first part of the ILDP stuff isn't here. Guess I read it at B3D.

i posted links to this stuff @ guru3d and ppl are very thankful - thx again for the tip, baron!

Hanners
08-22-03, 12:17 PM
Originally posted by The Baron
Hanners, that depends on whether or not they fix the busted ILDP (well, according to Uttar) architecture. If they do, well, NV35 might gain a definite lead over R350 without any driver cheats. If they don't, which is probably more likely, then I don't know.

If they can't fix it in the year or so they've probably been writing drivers for NV3x cards, I would say the chances are very slim. I think there are still too many other limiting factors of the architecture to really see a huge jump in speed.

serAph
08-22-03, 12:23 PM
dunno man - I would have agreed with you, but after reading those articles, its plain to see that nv3x has shading power thats untapped. I dont expect to see a big increase in something like fillrate or bandwidth, but I do expect to see shaders fixed. I hope they can even integrate good shader performance thru the ARB pipes too.

The Baron
08-22-03, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by Hanners
If they can't fix it in the year or so they've probably been writing drivers for NV3x cards, I would say the chances are very slim. I think there are still too many other limiting factors of the architecture to really see a huge jump in speed.
I don't know that fixing it will entail a driver update alone. We might see BIOS updates.