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Matthius
08-21-03, 04:23 AM
which one is better for price and performance? i know that amd's are a lot cheaper, considering that the 2400 costs only half the price, but how much faster is a 2.6 then?

Malfunction
08-21-03, 05:00 AM
Originally posted by Matthius
which one is better for price and performance? i know that amd's are a lot cheaper, considering that the 2400 costs only half the price, but how much faster is a 2.6 then?

Put it this way, if a P4 3Ghz can handle a AMD XP3200+ that should be all you need to know really. With the right mobo (P4P800 Deluxe or P4C800-E Deluxe), you can o/c that 2.6Ghz to 3Ghz alot easier than you can with a 2.4Ghz. You should be able to hit 3.2Ghz without a problem :D .

Now depending on your needs, some good PC-3200 from: Geil, OCZ, Corsair, Kingston, TwinMos or Micron would be a great. Overkill might be some PC-4000, but you might be paying a premium right now.

I don't trust Abit. With all the problems people here and people I know personally have had with Abit mobo(s), I don't risk going back to them.

Funny thing is Asus has it's querks too, although they are not bad at all actually. For instance, many get beeps during boot up. I get three that myself. My memory is recommended by Asus to use in all four banks for a total of 2GB which is why I got it. Typically, the beeps would represent a memory parity error or such. After further review into the subject, I found someone was annoyed more than I about it and called Asus Germany. Turns out that if your system boots up fine without errors and you still get the beeps, it is a result of the BIOS counting how many USB devices you have connected to the mobo. The guy asked the tech, "Why doesn't it say that at the Asus website or in the manual?" The tech avoided the reasoning behind it, and it is a very common problem with alot of Asus P4P and P4C owners.

I was releaved because I just so happen to have 3 USB devices hooked up. Memory has run fine, even better than I had expected it to. I got the Micron myself from Dell actually. That was the only place I could locate it. It was rated at CL3 but I have it running 2.5-3-3-5 flawlessly. If you watercool your system (ie. CPU and NB Chipset) you would be able to hit in excess of 3.5Ghz easy. It is what I plan to do after I get my NV38 or NV35 or R390. :D

I got 2x512MB sticks of Micron here (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/ProductDetail.aspx?category_id=&keyword=&mnf=&prst=&prEnd=&sku=A0118498&mnfsku=&SearchType=&Page=MemConfigProductListing.aspx&spagenum=1&Pageb4Search=&InStock=&items_per_page=25&orderby=&mnfname=DELL&brand=Dimension+8300+Series&SubmitSearch=&refurbished=&c=us&l=en&cs=19&iCompatid=160066). If you look at the Manufacturer part#, you will see that it matches the Micron Memory on the Asus P4C800-E Deluxe Qualification Chart (http://www.asus.com/products/mb/socket478/P4C800_DDR400_QVL.pdf).

Good luck with what you decided. I personally love my Intel P4 and will never return to AMD again.

Peace,

:cool:

Star_Hunter
08-21-03, 09:38 AM
Save some cash and go with the 2400+ and OC it to like 2.3GHz

ReDeeMeR
08-21-03, 12:44 PM
It's funny how people can compare 2400+ to 2,6Ghz arent the numbers obviously different?> It describes how faster Intel cpu would be, so why ask???

And that 2400+ can go way past 3000+ speed, Malfunction just doesnt know that amd's mhz doesnt equal intel's. 2400 @ 2300mhz = ~3Ghz P4

Malfunction
08-21-03, 01:29 PM
No,

I know what AMD's CPU model #'s reflect. all I have owned before this Intel system had been AMD. My first system was a K6-2 266Mhz. Then a Abit KT133-A/ Druon 850 o/c'd to 1050Mhz way back when. Then a XP2100+. And like I have said previously, you pay a bit more for Intel... but you are also paying for features AMD doesn't have.

When I think AMD, I always associate it with a budget concious buyer. Infact, along with these Intel vs. AMD discussions are always price. What if price wasn't an option?

It is just sad when people justify a AMD CPU strictly because of price first, then performance. You might find that going Intel is not as expensive as you think when you compare the performance you can get out of the CPU. In no way am I suggesting that a AMD is a bad CPU, however if you compare them to their overclock ability you will always get more performance out of the P4 vs. an XP CPU.

Now, if you are not an overclocker... then a AMD CPU would deffinitely be the better buy hands down as far as performance/price goes. Although that is the only way I can justify going AMD over Intel, Not being an overclocker and budget concious.

Peace,

:)

B&R
08-21-03, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by Matthius
which one is better for price and performance? i know that amd's are a lot cheaper, considering that the 2400 costs only half the price, but how much faster is a 2.6 then?

if it is 2.6C then it is definitely better than 2400+ even when OC'ed so go for it. If anytin else then i guess 2400+ is a better choice.

Malfunction
08-21-03, 02:12 PM
Just an example of what I hit without breaking a sweat now :D :

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?s=&postid=178839

Peace,

:cool:

Matthius
08-22-03, 08:47 AM
fair enough i spose, but im pretty sure that if u overclock a 2400 to 2.3ghz, its not gonna be faster than a 3200xp is it??

The Baron
08-22-03, 08:51 AM
Originally posted by Matthius
fair enough i spose, but im pretty sure that if u overclock a 2400 to 2.3ghz, its not gonna be faster than a 3200xp is it??
Probably not because of the 3200's extra cache.

ReDeeMeR
08-22-03, 01:35 PM
that extra cache is like +100mhz(intel) plus barton process is more mature and I think you can o/c it higher.

Dazz
08-22-03, 03:29 PM
Here's my XP2500+ o/c my FSB an't that high as i am using 333MHz CL2.5/3/3/8 memory @ 400MHz CL2.5/3/3/7

http://www.pchardwareforum.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=114347

And here is the highest FSB i can get but the memory is running at 360MHz :(

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?s=&postid=179515

B&R
08-22-03, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by Dazz
Here's my XP2500+ o/c my FSB an't that high as i am using 333MHz CL2.5/3/3/8 memory @ 400MHz CL2.5/3/3/7

And here is the highest FSB i can get but the memory is running at 360MHz :(

man that is impressive.. my friend got his too 2.57Ghz(i think) with 200Mhz ram.

Malfunction
08-22-03, 06:14 PM
Right on Dazz. :)

I just raised mine to 3.5Ghz (stock voltage on the core still) since I found out the Max Operating temp on the New Northwood's with D1 stepping is 75c. I am still way below that with 2 games running and Photoshop open. :D

Check it out:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?s=&postid=179616

Peace,

:cool:

Dazz
08-23-03, 05:27 AM
Oh did i tell you i am overclocking with a Thermaltake Volcano 7+ in silent mode :D still 3.5GHz is impressive with stock voltage If only you memory could do 500MHz then you would have a pretty speedy system :) http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/icons/icon14.gif

My other one at 2388MHz had it's FSB at 433MHz. Strange as it won't boot at 440 :o not bad for the cheapest nForce2 board on the market :D

ReDeeMeR
08-23-03, 08:51 PM
lol Malfunction Dazz's CPU is higher then your's according to that AMD PR calculating proggy.

It's a 3600+ rating ;) Not bad for a cpu and overall setup that's nearly twice as cheaper then your brag machine :D

(haha- sorry coultn hold that one :D )

Now some real world numbers would be interesting.

PS: damn I wish I get atleast 2200-2300mhz from my upcoming barton 2500 :D

What mobo and what ram are you using dazz?

Malfunction
08-23-03, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by ReDeeMeR
lol Malfunction Dazz's CPU is higher then your's according to that AMD PR calculating proggy.

It's a 3600+ rating ;) Not bad for a cpu and overall setup that's nearly twice as cheaper then your brag machine :D

(haha- sorry coultn hold that one :D )

Now some real world numbers would be interesting.

PS: damn I wish I get atleast 2200-2300mhz from my upcoming barton 2500 :D

What mobo and what ram are you using dazz?

What are you... like 12 years old? :rolleyes:

What numbers do you want, you never were specific.

Should I provide screen shots too? I haven't seen any numbers from Dazz either nor pics... what do you want?

I got Sadra, you want those scores?

SiSoftware Sandra

Int Buff iSSE2 (Integer STREAM) Results Breakdown
Assignment : 5205MB/s
Scaling : 5216MB/s
Addition : 5300MB/s
Triad : 5297MB/s
Data Item Size : 16-bytes
Buffering Used : Yes
Offset Displacement Used : Yes
Bandwidth Efficiency : 82% (estimated)

Float Buff iSSE2 (Float STREAM) Results Breakdown
Assignment : 5218MB/s
Scaling : 5202MB/s
Addition : 5287MB/s
Triad : 5290MB/s
Data Item Size : 16-bytes
Buffering Used : Yes
Offset Displacement Used : Yes
Bandwidth Efficiency : 82% (estimated)

Test Status
Memory Used by Test : 511MB
NUMA Support : No
SMP Test : No
Total Test Threads : 1
SMT Test : Yes
Number of Test SMT (per CPU) : 2
Dynamic MP/MT Load Balance : No
Processor Affinity : No

Chipset 1
Model : ASUSTeK Computer Inc 82875P Memory Controller Hub
Front Side Bus Speed : 4x 250MHz (1000MHz data rate)
Width : 64-bit
Maximum Bus Bandwidth : 8000MB/s (estimated)

Logical/Chipset 1 Memory Banks
Bank 0 : 512MB DDR-SDRAM 2.5-3-3-6CL 1CMD
Bank 1 : 512MB DDR-SDRAM 2.5-3-3-6CL 1CMD
Channels : 2
Speed : 2x 200MHz (400MHz data rate)
Width : 64-bit
Performance Acceleration Technology : Yes
Maximum Memory Bus Bandwidth : 6400MB/s (estimated)

Features
MMX Technology : Yes
SSE Technology : Yes
SSE2 Technology : Yes
SSE3 Technology : No
HTT - Hyper-Threading Technology : Yes

Peace,

:rolleyes:

jAkUp
08-24-03, 12:07 AM
pwned:D


and i agree.. the p4 2.6c is the way to go. i can get my 2.4b to 2.89 at stock voltage easily. the 800fsb versions are even better overclockers.
amd's are playing catch up right now.. good for the money but not top of the line at the moment.

Matthius
08-24-03, 06:08 AM
ok, my 2400xp isn't oc'd. i just bought a noisy-ass volcano 11+ for it. what do u think i should oc it to? right now its running at 2.08ghz. ok, its oc'd a little...:D

ReDeeMeR
08-24-03, 07:09 AM
Originally posted by Malfunction
What are you... like 12 years old? :rolleyes:

What numbers do you want, you never were specific.

Should I provide screen shots too? I haven't seen any numbers from Dazz either nor pics... what do you want?

I got Sadra, you want those scores?


lmao no, but you definately are,

1: I dont want anything from you.

2: I'm not braging with my o/c / cpu like you are :p

3: real numbers means games or something not so Intel biased as sandra

:rolleyes:

ReDeeMeR
08-24-03, 07:10 AM
Originally posted by jAkUp
pwned:D


and i agree.. the p4 2.6c is the way to go. i can get my 2.4b to 2.89 at stock voltage easily. the 800fsb versions are even better overclockers.
amd's are playing catch up right now.. good for the money but not top of the line at the moment.

Coming from some one who bought FX 5800 *cough :p ;)

B&R
08-24-03, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by Matthius
ok, my 2400xp isn't oc'd. i just bought a noisy-ass volcano 11+ for it. what do u think i should oc it to? right now its running at 2.08ghz. ok, its oc'd a little...:D

My friend with a really good cooling(forgot wat the brand).. got his stable at 2.35Ghz. U can go to upto 2.3Ghz without no prob.. but start by increasing fsb slowly.

Malfunction
08-24-03, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by ReDeeMeR
lmao no, but you definately are,

1: I dont want anything from you.

2: I'm not braging with my o/c / cpu like you are :p

3: real numbers means games or something not so Intel biased as sandra

:rolleyes:

Well, if you had read any of my post dealing with this mobo/CPU/videocard that I have you would have clearly seen I was/am not bragging about anything. I am clearly showing what the potential is for a New Northwood Intel CPU with a D1 stepping and 800Mhz FSB.

Have you even seen a mobo benchmarked before? What do you suppose they use while benching? I would suggest you go find out as with the Intel 800Mhz FSB CPU's, the bandwidth is so great... that there isn't a videocard out that takes advantage of it yet. That means there is alot of potential.

This is about the 2.6Ghz vs. a XP2400+. The 2.6 will easily clock to 3.0Ghz even up to 3.25Ghz, since the multiplier is x13. 250FSB x13 = 3250Mhz. Depending on how agressive you get with cooling, I've seen 2.4Ghz hit 4.2Ghz. :eek:

I would really like someone to convince me that a Phase cooled XP2400+ would prove the same... hehe. :)

What I am suggesting isn't about brand loyalty. It is about the right decisions, and price/performance right now Intel 800Mhz FSB CPU's are it.

Find out the spec's of the 2.6Ghz here. (http://processorfinder.intel.com/scripts/details.asp?sSpec=SL6WH&ProcFam=483&PkgType=5882&SysBusSpd=6107&CorSpd=5465)

* ReDeeMeR - you really make yourself look unbias with your comments and lack of information to provide some relative comparison. Going to AMD with my CPU specs is about as dumb as going to Intel with a AMD machine asking why you need an Intel CPU over the AMD you got.

What we are talking about right now is the XP vs. P4. It is one of the best times to go Intel because it is so affordable and the performance is insane. Look at any benchmark/review site out right now and they will concur with this theory. Now, if you tried to compare the Athlon64 with a P4, that would be silly. They are not even in the same price class nor spec. The Prescott CPU would be competition for the Athlon64, and as well as the Athlon64 looks right now with the highly advisable 3DMark utility (sorry...lol), it is going to be a real winner. Though keep in mind, you have not seen the Prescott in action either, so it is too close to call unless you are a fanboy.

Peace,

:cool:

P.S. Glad you see what I am talking about jAkUp, hopefully others can see as well when not being blinded by fanboyish remarks with no stats or links to support their comments as to why AMD is *suposedly better than Intel. Must applaud ReDeeMeR for that though...lol. :D

ReDeeMeR
08-24-03, 03:41 PM
Originally posted by Malfunction
Have you even seen a mobo benchmarked before? What do you suppose they use while benching? I would suggest you go find out as with the Intel 800Mhz FSB CPU's, the bandwidth is so great... that there isn't a videocard out that takes advantage of it yet. That means there is alot of potential.


Ughh lol, do you even have any idea whatchu talking about? lmao anything R300 is cpu limited, even on R9500NP

And they use games in mobo benches to or whatever else they bench, who gives a **** about sandra? you bought cpu just for that? Well then I have no interest to argue with you since you seem very satisfied with your Intel cpu having high numbers in some synethic biased app :p

Originally posted by Malfunction
This is about the 2.6Ghz vs. a XP2400+. The 2.6 will easily clock to 3.0Ghz even up to 3.25Ghz, since the multiplier is x13. 250FSB x13 = 3250Mhz. Depending on how agressive you get with cooling, I've seen 2.4Ghz hit 4.2Ghz.
I would really like someone to convince me that a Phase cooled XP2400+ would prove the same... hehe. :) :eek:

You can o/c 2400+ to 2300mhz 400fsb now ofcourse someone like you who only sees raw mhz isnt impressed, but it's a 3000+ rating so equals intel's 3Ghz

I'm sure with water cooling it can go higher, maybe not 4Ghz but then again P4 doesnt do that either, you'd liquid nitrogen.

Originally posted by Malfunction
What I am suggesting isn't about brand loyalty. It is about the right decisions, and price/performance right now Intel 800Mhz FSB CPU's are it.

* ReDeeMeR - you really make yourself look unbias with your comments and lack of information to provide some relative comparison. Going to AMD with my CPU specs is about as dumb as going to Intel with a AMD machine asking why you need an Intel CPU over the AMD you got.


No way lmao and I'm not trying to convice you go back to AMD cause seems like you're having heat issues at home(get a conditioner maybe?).

And yes it would be a downgrade for you, but one thing for sure you spent so much money on that crap and now look what video card you have pffft muwhahahahah :afro:

Dazz spent his money alot better then you did mister, he would own your spec in any game and that's what I'm about.


Originally posted by Malfunction
What we are talking about right now is the XP vs. P4. It is one of the best times to go Intel because it is so affordable and the performance is insane. Look at any benchmark/review site out right now and they will concur with this theory. Now, if you tried to compare the Athlon64 with a P4, that would be silly. They are not even in the same price class nor spec. The Prescott CPU would be competition for the Athlon64, and as well as the Athlon64 looks right now with the highly advisable 3DMark utility (sorry...lol), it is going to be a real winner. Though keep in mind, you have not seen the Prescott in action either, so it is too close to call unless you are a fanboy.


No, what were talking about is best CPU for gaming and price/preformance ratio, intel obviously is losing big time, but because of lost people like you around the globe they sell alot of cpu's

Depends on how Intell will deal with the issues, both cpu's look like decent upgrades either way(except that I see Intel again upping price for their ****, making AMD yet again bang for the buck).

jAkUp
08-24-03, 03:46 PM
not really.. the 3200 is a complete rip off since it cant even be compared to a 3.2ghz p4.. granted the p4 is about $100 more though.

ReDeeMeR
08-24-03, 03:51 PM
oh yah 10 fsp more, can you justify that extra 100$ ?? But I agree all high end cpu's are ripp offs

PS: I was talking about 2400+ o/c to 2300+ and AMDPR tool gave me 3000+ number wich is interesting since the real 3000+ is just 2200mhz hmm