State of Matrox Parhelia

[StealthHawk]

is Matrox Parhelia actually shipping yet? i've seen it online and it looks like you can actually buy it and have it shipped at the time of purchase.

if this is the case, is it available in retail stores yet too?

[saturnotaku]

Newegg has the OEM version available (lower clock speeds from what I understand) but I've not seen the retail boxed one at any store, retail, online or otherwise.

These delays only put Matrox farther behind the curve. Unless they can put out some sort of uber-driver that boosts performance past Ti4600 levels, they'll be playing 3rd fiddle to that card and the Radeon 9700.

[SnakeEyes]

This has been one of Matrox's banes, imo. The G400 series was only really available for the longest time direct through the Matrox online store. The same is currently true of the Parhelia, though many MURC Forum regulars have ordered and received their retail cards through the store now.

[JonathanM]

I live in Montreal (Matrox HQ) and have yet to spot a retail Parhelia. Of course, this could be cuz they're flying off the shelves too fast though. The retail versions are available if you're willing to place an order and wait a couple days for it to be filled...

[Raptorman]

Why would you want a Parhelia with its low benchmark scores? Sure it can support 3 monitors for surround gaming, but I don't know anyone that has 3 monitors to use it with. Even if the image quality is great

[netviper13]

If you need the best IQ for work reasons, yet still want to be a gamer, Parhelia is perfect.

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by netviper13
If you need the best IQ for work reasons, yet still want to be a gamer, Parhelia is perfect.

But this really is the only situation where the Parhelia makes sense. The gaming performance difference between the Ti4600 and Parhelia is quite significant considering that the Ti4600 is in many cases less expensive.

For many, the added image quality yet inferior performance will probably be enough for people to say no thanks to the Parhelia. I think it would be a different story if Matrox brought this card out at a $200-250 price point.

[SnakeEyes]

Right saturnotaku. (ugh, being a Matrox fan, it bothers me to say this, but it's true)

In the case of most home computer users, including gamers, the Parhelia isn't justified, especially when you consider that most people won't notice the difference in quality (not too significant on the average home monitor), but WILL notice the performance difference as well as the cost difference. :(

(keep in mind that Matrox never said that this was the audience they're targeting anyhow- the ones they want are the crowd netviper mentioned, and maybe some corporate / high end users).

[koslov]

Parhelia is the perfect card for you to ask your boss for, with the excuse that you'll (theoretically) increase productivity 3X (with 3 displays), but in reality will be using it to play DooM3 at lunch.:D

Parhelia to the average gamer really only had its much-hyped AA going for it, but then it was revealed that this was not up to par in some aspects (I lost the article, but it showed that Parhelia did not antialias inside polygon edges). In my eyes, price is really the biggest barrier from Parhelia being competitive.

[StealthHawk]

i'm rather skeptical as to how well Parhelia would perform in Doom 3.

how many businesses do you know where the employees are allowed 3 monitors? presumably all LCDs. please point me in their direction :D

[jbirney]

The gaming performance difference between the Ti4600 and Parhelia is quite significant considering that the Ti4600 is in many cases less expensive.


Actually once you turn on AF and FSAA then the Parhelia pulls in the lead perfromance wise. Then factor when its FAA works it looks better than anything else out today AA wise, then its not soo bad. However I still think its a very specific target of people they were aiming at. I guess the flight sim crowd is really digging the 3 monitors (did you see that review over at SimHQ). Its not the card for the average or hardcore player....

[Raptorman]

I think the 3 monitors is a great idea. I play flightsims, but also first person shooters, so a significant drop in fps is not acceptable to me. That is the main reason why I am not getting a Parhelia, and the second reason is that I have got to have my A-A. Can't live without it, and the Parhelia's doesn't always work.


Have you checked PriceWatch for the Retail Parhelia, StealthHawk?

[StealthHawk]

no, i only checked Newegg(before i made the post) as well as websites for CompUSA and Best Buy.

yes, Parhelia wins(barely) in top image quality over the gf4. of course you are comparing 2x AF on Parhelia to 8x AF on GF4. in DX AF obviously has a large performance hit in GF4. if Matrox includes higher degree AF support Parhelia most likely won't win. same thing is true if nvidia works on their AF(in OGL with the latest RivaTuner you get another 10% peformance increase)

[jbirney]

Your also comparing x4 AA with x16 AA when then both work :)

[StealthHawk]

except that sometimes Parhelia's FAA supposedly doesn't work in situations where it's supposed to, according to the previews.

[jbirney]

same thing with GF4 (Alpha textures) but i know your point.

[StealthHawk]

well i heard that Parhelia doesn't AA some poly edges in addition to not doing alpha textures :p

[JonathanM]

I must admit that Matrox's AA which affects only the edges is an extremely smart and optimized implementation. Kinda makes me wonder why it wasn't though of sooner. :)

[SnakeEyes]

It sort of has been, but not using the same methodology. A recent article that I read somewhere explained the current AA techniques in use by nV and ATI (MSAA, SSAA, etc.), and it certainly appears that nV's MSAA is an edge-only algorithm, but that it has the disadvantage of blurring within textures (a notable point in Matrox' favor, at least until nV's nV30, which, if it's performance is close to predictions, should be capable of running extremely high aniso with high MSAA settings, still at high res, in practically all games, effectively eliminating the blur factor that is inherent to the MSAA).

Performance issues aside (mainly caused by the Parhelia's relatively low core/memory clocks), the only real issue I have with it's IQ right now is the lack of greater than 2x anisotropic filtering. Despite all the people bowing to it and awarding it wins for it's 3D quality, I've been disappointed, since most of my games run fine on my GF4 with 4x or 8x aniso and at least quincuunx enabled, and those same games appear to have better IQ with the higher aniso than the shots I've seen of them with the Parhelia's 2x aniso and 16x FAA (yes, the FAA does give better AA in most things, but the lower aniso is more noticable to my eye when playing, imo).

[sebazve]

I completely agree with SnakeEyes. GF4 with x4 or 8x aniso and quincuunx enable it is much more better than parhelia in performace and IQ.

The FAA from Parhelia is nice but, only x2 aniso come on!!!, like snakeeys siad it is more noticable than any other setting.

I know Parhelia support higher aniso but it is obviously that they hadnt enable it for perfomace issues, am i right?

In my opinion a Parhelia is not a good card for any market because it does not perform well (i mean top notch) and for professional graphics (3dMAX, etc) from what i read a regular GF4 is better. It only include triple head...:rolleyes:

So i was going to buy a profesional card it would be wiser to get a FireGL, Quadro or a Wildcat and for games a RADEON 9700 that will be almost at the same price as Parhelia (i dont know if they are cheaper now).


just my $2