CATALYST™ v3.8 available! Feedbacks here please!

[EMunEeE]

I give the Catalyst 3.8 a A. But, they were extremely hyped up....extremely hyped up. But the IQ is surprisingly and noticeably better...most of those Rage3D newbies who complain do not understand how to install ATi drivers....its an ART.:p

[Sotos]

Originally posted by $E Mun$
I give the Catalyst 3.8 a A. But, they were extremely hyped up....extremely hyped up. But the IQ is surprisingly and noticeably better...most of those Rage3D newbies who complain do not understand how to install ATi drivers....its an ART.:p

I agree EXTREMELY HYPED

Anyway if the Control panel was as good as the drivers
then i am sure we will have THE best ATI DRIVER SUITE

Anyway i am hopin a better Control panel with 3.9 and of course even more fixes for the drivers

[tomv]

why is it the control panel has yet to ever turn me off?? I really like the 1 panel display for GL and D3D, I really hope they keep it that way. For one thing it's less clutter. The VU panel has some potentially big bugs, one being sending bogus reports. Hate to be on that troubleshooting team. Great idea tho but again, the email stuff really has to be improved. When I was getting cautions and stuff for the program sending e-mails it almost look like I had some spyware on my machine... Eww...

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by $E Mun$
most of those Rage3D newbies who complain do not understand how to install ATi drivers....its an ART.:p

Yeah, it's a real art to boot into safe mode, use add/remove programs to uninstall, reboot, double click on the executable to install, reboot and apply Refresh Force. This wasn't directed at you, but to those who seem to not understand the basic concepts. ;)

I agree these drivers were way overhyped, but it's not like they totally suck. They've fixed a couple small issues, w1zzard got a soft 9700 patch out quickly, image quality continues to be excellent and performance is great. While these drivers are by no means revolutionary, they continue to be evolutionary in asserting the fact that ATI can produce solid software to support their hardware. :)

[tomv]

i think calling anyone a newbie or n00b or anything is demoralizing and insulting. I don't do it except for kidding and usually in msn or something.

[Sotos]

Originally posted by saturnotaku
Yeah, it's a real art to boot into safe mode, use add/remove programs to uninstall, reboot, double click on the executable to install, reboot and apply Refresh Force. This wasn't directed at you, but to those who seem to not understand the basic concepts. ;)

I agree these drivers were way overhyped, but it's not like they totally suck. They've fixed a couple small issues, w1zzard got a soft 9700 patch out quickly, image quality continues to be excellent and performance is great. While these drivers are by no means revolutionary, they continue to be evolutionary in asserting the fact that ATI can produce solid software to support their hardware. :)

Well they have some nice revolutionary features that not even Det 5xxx does not have

like the VPU Recover (they can make it better)
or the new SAFE oveclock tool
Games profiles ( i hope they make it better)

etc

The DRIVERS ROCK
The Control panel can become better...

I do not know about Tomv...
but i find the 3d settings to confuse things rather than simplify with Switching OpenGL-Direct3d sellection and it's Costum settings

I do not say it is ugly but it could be better and simple...

[oldsk00l]

I was looking at the harsh criticism from R3D about these drivers. One thing to keep in mind.

nVidia drivers are far behind by the terms of the interface. ATI is at least introducing stuff like this though, so by the time that nVidia tries to do something similar ATI already has some information on what does and doesn't work on these concepts. Plus, I have only seen ONE driver, EVER that lest you overclock. It was part of the driverset for the old CreativeLabs TNT2 Ultra's. You go through steps to achieve better solutions. You have to be a TNT before being a TNT2 Ultra, likewise it takes an 9700 to make a 9800. Learn to crawl before walking etc.

I think that smartshader will turn out to be something awesome soon. Not to mention, we should be giving VPU reset alot more attention as well. To my understanding, this is the first major rollout of a feature that lets you reset the state of an external processor in case of instability. If more chipmakers follow suit ala Creative, nVidia, etc. then we have some really impressive stability improvements. Plus this would help find bugs in BIOS, and the like.

ATI's focus on drivers is far ahead of nVidia, I don't know how or why, but in the last 3 years ATI has demonstrated a superior and more focused development on all aspects of their products overall than nVidia....the fruits of that will affect the entire industry.

The drivers were mostly hyped by us in the community as well. Terry is absolutely right when he said it's their biggest software release, because it is. Does that mean that the horn of africa is now abundant with food, Pyongyang has dismantled all arms, Bush's approval ratings are now %99, and Saddam has turned himself in? No, and I wasn't implying that we would think that of a driver release. But all the hype came from the users, in part from ATI as well, but they're excited at what they are doing.

They have really tried hard to earn the trust of the business, I for one am happy to be there for them. I will be right there when all my associates benefit from being ATI customers as well.

And my back is not to nVidia, much of nVidia's people is now ATI, explains why ATI is doing so well ;) Actually it's due to a few very talented ex-SGI engineers that went to nVidia back in the day that I know personally, who now work for ATI. If nVidia thinks they are making a comeback without that team, they are smoking something hallucinogenic. (he he he he)

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by tomv
i think calling anyone a newbie or n00b or anything is demoralizing and insulting. I don't do it except for kidding and usually in msn or something.
If it is directed at someone in particular I agree, but I was using the term to describe a group of people who are actually new to the tweaking/driver game without pointing any fingers at anyone.

I didn't mean it as an insult in the context it was used, I meant it to be descriptive. :)

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by oldsk00l
ATI's focus on drivers is far ahead of nVidia, I don't know how or why, but in the last 3 years ATI has demonstrated a superior and more focused development on all aspects of their products overall than nVidia....the fruits of that will affect the entire industry.


The last 18 months I will grant you, but not the last three years. Three years ago was back in the original Radeon days, when driver updates came once every three months if you were lucky, and good luck trying to find a working Windows 2000 driver. And driver leaks to fix potential issues with your card? Fuhgetaboutit.

The launch of the 9700 was the start of a new era for ATI, and it didn't come a moment too soon. While NVIDIA was struggling to get some semblance of the NV30 out the door, ATI launched a killer product with drivers unlike any previous card from the company. Their timing was perfect and their revitalization has been nothing short of amazing.

[Kombatant]

For me the 3.8s feel the most polished release I have ever tried (and I have them installed for 20+ days now :p). As for the hype, some of it is justified. Mark my words gentlemen, the 3.8s are a turning point for ATI, and some of the things you are going to see in the following months are really great :)

Sounds good? Now have patience, the driver development is in good hands ;) Now allow me to hide before Terry sees me telling you these stuff :p

[ChrisRay]

Originally posted by Kombatant
For me the 3.8s feel the most polished release I have ever tried (and I have them installed for 20+ days now :p). As for the hype, some of it is justified. Mark my words gentlemen, the 3.8s are a turning point for ATI, and some of the things you are going to see in the following months are really great :)

Sounds good? Now have patience, the driver development is in good hands ;) Now allow me to hide before Terry sees me telling you these stuff :p

I quoted you! there's no hiding now. Like I said. I think some people have been majorly critical of these drivers. And Ironically. I've been very critical of the Catalyst Team and I like these drivers.

Without sounding too much like a Hypocrite. I apreciate whats being done. I feel the effort is what counts the most. And this released showed alot of effort IMO to improve driver feature set. In time I believe it can/will get better if the attitude to improve based off customer demand continues.

Tho I must I admit. I am still disapointed no saturation tool is there. I am begining to wodner if Atis Ramdac is capable of saturating images.

[Kombatant]

Originally posted by ChrisRay
I quoted you! there's no hiding now. Like I said. I think some people have been majorly critical of these drivers. And Ironically. I've been very critical of the Catalyst Team and I like these drivers.

Without sounding too much like a Hypocrite. I apreciate whats being done. I feel the effort is what counts the most. And this released showed alot of effort IMO to improve driver feature set. In time I believe it can/will get better if the attitude to improve based off customer demand continues.

Tho I must I admit. I am still disapointed no saturation tool is there. I am begining to wodner if Atis Ramdac is capable of saturating images.

Now repeat after me, "It's ok to like these drivers" :D. The last set that felt just right for me were the 3.4s. And you must be critical of the drivers, trust me, we all are (you should see the forum us beta testers have, being critical there is an understatement LOL). If you're not critical of the drivers, and just repeat like a broken record "everything is great! everything is great!", the drivers will NEVER get better. But the key is to be constructive. I implemented a voting poll in Rage3D (1 to 10, with 10=best) to see how users like the new drivers. Some have voted 1!! I mean c'mon! Not even some old Savege drivers I once used deserve a 1!!

Anyway... whatever :)

[oldsk00l]

I wonder how nVidia is going to react next?

Are they going to actually innovate this go around? They made some significant strides in OGL 2 compliance. Maybe not DX9, but that's at least something.

Maybe their software guys are just doing the best with what they have, I dunno. With looking at the NV38 stuff, and how ATI is hitting their head against the wall anything is possible.

I just hope that nVidia looks at these drivers and gets motivated to add even better stuff. Then again, nVidia has excellent panels and options already, but what ATI is trying to do is far better.

I don't care who does it first, but I want to see application profiles by executables, and at that, each load autonomously each time the executable is loaded. Now I know that may be difficult, however, it CAN BE DONE through the drivers!!!

Another thing, ATI participates more in the nV oriented forums than, NV!!! Come on!!!

nVidia needs to throw out the policy and get with it!!! The enthusiast community is dragging nVidia through the mud right now, and nVidia is sticking to its "policy" and not talk to us! Oh wait, they will...through their legal dept.....

It's stuff like this that makes me have no frets about ATI gouging them hard, I about died when I read the headline "Valve speaks, nVidia skewered"

[edit]

Sorry for that complete rabbit-chase there...

Ya know that is a very good point about being critical....
We don't need to be hard on ATI...but being critical is crucial. It's like a relationship, say someone goes through extreme lengths to make you a wonderful breakfast, when coffee and toast does it for ya...but they make HORRID lunches and their cakes suck. Well continuing to say "yeah, great breakfast, great lunch" just perpetuates the illusion that you are being pleased...actually its a delusion.......you are only deluding yourself when you say anything is perfect.

[CATALYST MAKER]

Originally posted by Kombatant
For me the 3.8s feel the most polished release I have ever tried (and I have them installed for 20+ days now :p). As for the hype, some of it is justified. Mark my words gentlemen, the 3.8s are a turning point for ATI, and some of the things you are going to see in the following months are really great :)

Sounds good? Now have patience, the driver development is in good hands ;) Now allow me to hide before Terry sees me telling you these stuff :p

I seeee you
:firedevil

[digitalwanderer]

Originally posted by oldsk00l
Another thing, ATI participates more in the nV oriented forums than, NV!!! Come on!!!
It just seemed too suited to quote this right below Terry's tease...it just feels right. :lol:

[ChrisRay]

Originally posted by Kombatant
Now repeat after me, "It's ok to like these drivers" :D. The last set that felt just right for me were the 3.4s. And you must be critical of the drivers, trust me, we all are (you should see the forum us beta testers have, being critical there is an understatement LOL). If you're not critical of the drivers, and just repeat like a broken record "everything is great! everything is great!", the drivers will NEVER get better. But the key is to be constructive. I implemented a voting poll in Rage3D (1 to 10, with 10=best) to see how users like the new drivers. Some have voted 1!! I mean c'mon! Not even some old Savege drivers I once used deserve a 1!!

Anyway... whatever :)

IMO Ati Drivers are hardly bad. I see a few things that need fixed. Issues ect. BUt nothing that would mark them as worse inferior wise stability wise. As Long as ATI tries to keep up with bugs and odd performance (NWN) I think ATI drivers are going be good.

Feature set is the next big thing ATI needs to work. Unfortunately considering the dynamic nature of the computer game industry these are things that have to be done after bugs are repaired.

But fortunately feature set being the most important aspect of the drivers. I try to be critical on. I still think Super Sampling and Saturation are neccasary steps in the progression of the Catalyst Driver suite.

The problem I have found. Specifically at rage3d. Is When people suggest something. Or bring up there own critical points is there ideas are slandered most of the time as being ridiculous.

[CATALYST MAKER]

Originally posted by ChrisRay
IMO Ati Drivers are hardly bad. I see a few things that need fixed. Issues ect. BUt nothing that would mark them as worse inferior wise stability wise. As Long as ATI tries to keep up with bugs and odd performance (NWN) I think ATI drivers are going be good.

Feature set is the next big thing ATI needs to work. Unfortunately considering the dynamic nature of the computer game industry these are things that have to be done after bugs are repaired.

But fortunately feature set being the most important aspect of the drivers. I try to be critical on. I still think Super Sampling and Saturation are neccasary steps in the progression of the Catalyst Driver suite.

The problem I have found. Specifically at rage3d. Is When people suggest something. Or bring up there own critical points is there ideas are slandered most of the time as being ridiculous.

Be specific. What are these few things we need "fixed" (or is it things we just dont support that you want).
I hear Super Sampling (and we have said many times there is no real benefit for R300 and it would cost us a large amount to support it), and I hear saturation (but I feel our color control panel can do everything).

I want to help but please be specific as to what you want and why you want it.

[Sotos]

I am generaly happy with ATI

Every time the Catalyst drivers get better in Image quality
The 3.8 are the best Image quality drivers up to date

The newest drivers may introduce some new bugs but i have not seen anything SERIOUS until now and ATI works hard to minimize them as it seems

I have tested all my games and until now i can say EXCELLENT WORKS
The 3.8 DRIVERS ROCKS for me

Excellent image quality and all my games running :D
NO problem at all
I can not understand why the people are arguing in RAGE3d forum ?????


The only thing is that i expected better things with 3.8 Control panel...Anyway we can not have it all

I am sure 3.9 will be even better fixed for games...
i just hope ATI does the same with their new control panel and not only the drivers

[CATALYST MAKER]

Originally posted by Sotos

The only thing is that i expected better things with 3.8 Control panel...Anyway we can not have it all


Again be specific. I cant help unless I know exactly what you want. Telling me that you "expected better things" doesnt help me make it any better.

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by CATALYST MAKER
Again be specific. I cant help unless I know exactly what you want. Telling me that you "expected better things" doesnt help me make it any better.

Some of us liked the old control panel better. Very clean and very effective. The new one seems...I dunno, not well thought out. I don't like it as much as the old panel.

[rellingsen]

For the CP going back to the old way of a separate D3D and OGL tabs would be nice. Partial qoute from my post at the bottom of page 2.

Originally posted by rellingsen

The one thing that bugs me is the single 3D tab for OGL and D3D. It's more work getting to the advanced features in each. It bugged me so much I even sent feedback to ATI asking that they be put into separate tabs again so the advanced features are back on the front of the tab. I know I can just set it up and save the custom config. but it's just as easy to change them for each game the way the tabs were set up before. If they need an extra tab just put the 2 VPU recover settings in the "Options" tab instead of their own.

[Sotos]

Originally posted by CATALYST MAKER
Again be specific. I cant help unless I know exactly what you want. Telling me that you "expected better things" doesnt help me make it any better.

Ok :)

1)First the 3d settings in panel has become a little complicated and lost it's simplicity

You have to switch from Direct3d to Open gl and opposite and then the Costum settings becomes even more complicated...

The 3.7 panel and before was simple with the Direct3d and Opengl beeing in different Tabs and then changing it's Costum settings

2) I do not understand the reason why ATI didn't import the New Overclocking tool (not remember the name) for all R3xx and only for the R360

3) Does the new Smartshader effects needed???:confused:
They make the driver BIGGER for download and i do not see their use

Irellevant A Bug found with 2xAA and 4xAA settings when using Costum settings with these new Panel


I am Happy with your new driver CATALYST MAKER as i said :D
I do not know why the rest are complaining about (especially in Rage3d forum)
I have tested it in all games and WORKS GREAT with even better Image quality

Is just the Control panel can become more Simple and still beautifull

Thanks for hearing me :) :) :) :)

[D.K.Tronics]

Is there any reason why the colour resets, just as you get into Windows ?

Lets say, I've just spent a while with the colour controls. Got them just how I like them, save the settings, only to have them reset when Windows boots up. :confused:
Coming out of games, also does the exact very thing.

This is on a fresh Windows XP Pro SP1, install (done for the Cat 3.8's), and also in WinME.

As for the drivers, these are definately the best since the Cat 3.4 sets.

Stability is nice, IQ is top notch, and I see no problems in the 50+ games I've tested so far.
I agree with users on the Profiles, in that, you should be able to tie a setting to a specific EXE file.
For example, Games like Splinter Cell, and Halo, don't like FSAA. So it would be nice to turn FSAA off, but keep AF on, and whatever else you like on. But to then save these settings with particular EXE files.

Could the driver crew include an overclocking tab, BUT hidden from the user ? And to unlock it would require a registry setting, as this would help pass WHQL.

Anyway, thanks for some great drivers, CATALYST MAKER. Now look forward to the 3.9 sets.
BTW, are these now on a 4 week release ?

Cheers,

dk.

[oldsk00l]

@Catalyst Maker

and also @everyone

Mostly for him though,

I get the feeling from using nVidia stuff, and I don't want ATI to be like nVIdia, I want ATI to be like ATI, but that the control panel might do well with some useability improvements. Such as having the panel be in a seperate place that is convenient to access. Perhaps there is a way to integrate into a sub-menu of when you right click on the desktop like "ATI Options" or something to the effect? I have not been a fan of the systray icon. Another thing that I deal with alot is the common conception that systray items need to be cleared out to improve performance in games...freeing up memory. A quick question, if all those options from the control panel are/were integrated into the systray applet, does it require much of a memory footprint to run? It could even be through that venue that you could better implement the profiler.

Another arguement for the profiler is that it does save SOME time. I find that instead of checking and unchecking and moving slidebars is accomplished by the profiler....for example, leaving 4xAA and 16xAF in Unreal2 and then going to play Halo....absolutely crippled....

Cat-Maker,
How often do you go to bed thinking about aspects of your driver developments?

[oldsk00l]

Sotos

I can answer some of that for you

Not the 1st question but 2 and 3 for sure.

2) Because there is new hardware for the R360 that allows dynamic clock changes by a thermal diode, this circuitry is not present on prior cards.

3) The 3.8's are only 1MB bigger than the 3.7's...are you on dialup? To me that's only %5 bigger......and it's very doubtful smartshader accounts for all that.

[edit]

Just a personal opinion, and a message to Terry,
If you guys had to add 15MB to the current size, to add really cool new features, by all means, PLEASE DO IT!!!!

PILE IT ON BABY!!! I CAN TAKE ALL YOU GOT!!!!!!!!!