Faster 9600XT than has been reviewed. Inquirer Article.

[TheTaz]

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=12161

If it's true... Great.

But more core speed alone ain't gonna do it... It needs better memory.

Taz

[Hellbinder]

Interesting about the new inq article...

It looks like ATi may be mirroring what Nvidia did with the FX5600U. heh. They saw the results and quickly released a "Mark2" card.

In this case all ATi really needs to do is upgrade that rather *cough* pathetic *cough* 300mhz ram... The core speed of 500mhz is fine. The 9600XT sould be 500/400 at least. Its likely that this is what they are doing. Although they could with this latest spin do something REALLY CRAZY.. and core clock it at 600mhz. which would really raise some eyebrows.

If True... I think its pretty sad that something like the hexus review to trigger whoever it is at Ati that keeps handicaping their cards with lower speed ram to get a *cough*grip *cough*. I have been contacting all kinds of Ati people over the last few months asking them to stop putting such slow ram on their cards.

I have no information at all currently that there is a new revision comming. Ill ask though and see what answer i get.

[bkswaney]

I agree... ATI needs to get off this slow ram speed crap on all there cards.
Even the 9800 XT should have much faster memory.
They r using the same old 9700 ram still. :(

[r2d2d3d4d5]

Hm. I hope this doesn't delay the official launch of the card (edit1// ie the date at which the cards start arriving at my favourite retailer).

ATI's website still claims that the card will be 500/600. Perhaps there will be a Radeon 9600 XT Pro. :confused:

edit2// Perhaps this is why the 9600XT has taken this long to arrive since being announced compared to the release of the 9800XT.

[ih8mblogins]

Perhaps they bought too much of the stuff and are still trying to get rid of it? Yes, if they don't update from the 9600xt incarnations used in the reviews, the release could be called '9500 pro reloaded'(well, actually I think 9600xt still falls short but..).

[Hellbinder]

Originally posted by OWA
HB, what is the official response when you mention something like this? Is cost the basic reason? It seems like just using faster memory would be an easy and quick way to boost performance.

It's too bad they (whatever company, not just ATI) don't design cards where we could upgrade the memory ourselves. Then the user could decide if they wanted to spend big bucks on really fast memory or take the practical route. Weren't sound cards upgradeable like that early on (you could add a memory card - daughtercard or memory chips). Since that didn't last long I guess there must have been a good reason for it disappearing. I guess that would also have the potential of blurring the products lines even further especially when various models are close in performance.
the official response is usually something to the effect of.

"There are reasons why the ram speeds are what they are. I too would like to see faster ram used. Future products will indeed have faster ram"

[sxotty]

HB that sounds like a typical response allright.

I too would love to see everything be better, it will in the future :) heh...

edit: I do not understand why ATI doesn't go for Nvidias juglar while they are down be releasing as fast of stuff as they can. It is almost like they are waiting to see if Nvidia can catch up instead of just going all out ... weird.

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by Hellbinder
Interesting about the new inq article...

It looks like ATi may be mirroring what Nvidia did with the FX5600U. heh. They saw the results and quickly released a "Mark2" card.

In this case all ATi really needs to do is upgrade that rather *cough* pathetic *cough* 300mhz ram... The core speed of 500mhz is fine. The 9600XT sould be 500/400 at least. Its likely that this is what they are doing. Although they could with this latest spin do something REALLY CRAZY.. and core clock it at 600mhz. which would really raise some eyebrows.

What was ATI thinking when they released the card with the same memory clock as the r9600Pro. Duh. What a stupid idea. If they want to please OEMs they could always have released two version. I just don't understand ATI. Everything since and including R350 has not made a whole lot of sense.

[ChrisRay]

Originally posted by StealthHawk
What was ATI thinking when they released the card with the same memory clock as the r9600Pro. Duh. What a stupid idea. If they want to please OEMs they could always have released two version. I just don't understand ATI. Everything since and including R350 has not made a whole lot of sense.

It is. In my honest opinion is ATI feels no need to innovate products right now due to there comfortable market position right now. This could very well bite them in the butt if they continue down this trend.

[bkswaney]

ATI has a history of using the cheaper memory on there cards compared to NV anyway.

If ATI sits on it's ass I'll be going back to Nvidia the next round.

They should match nvidia's memory speed or at least close to it.

[Hellbinder]

Originally posted by StealthHawk
What was ATI thinking when they released the card with the same memory clock as the r9600Pro. Duh. What a stupid idea. If they want to please OEMs they could always have released two version. I just don't understand ATI. Everything since and including R350 has not made a whole lot of sense.
Actually Stealth.. I pretty much agree with everything you just said. I cant imagine that Ati would not have seriously upped the kitty without some serious reason against it. Not talking new architecture. But it seems to me that the 9800pro itslef should have been no less than 400/400.

Sure the speed is good enough with their current cards. But why risk letting Nvidia catch up and pass them? Its not like they gained a lot of marketshare going the route they did. They did increase their profits a whoooole bunch though. Anyway i think it would have been nice if...

1. 9800pro at 400/400
2. 9800 at 325/350 (Replacing the 9700)
3. 9600pro at 400/400
4. 9600 at 300/300 for 100$
5. 9600 at 300/200 for under 100$

6. 9600XT at 500/450

Then with the 9800XT perhaps gone 435/450 with overdrive somewhere abone that. Actually i guess it should be 450/450 but.. With a 9800 at 400/400 you liekly would not even ahve needed an XT. Although i like mine.. *snif*...

[Geforce4ti4200]

fast ram is too expensive for ati, but since nvidia's cores suck they have no choice but use fast ram and thats why Nvidias cards cost more. who cares I am not buying a radeon9600 pro anyway, but once they drop to $50 I might consider

[Hellbinder]

Originally posted by Geforce4ti4200
fast ram is too expensive for ati, but since nvidia's cores suck they have no choice but use fast ram and thats why Nvidias cards cost more. who cares I am not buying a radeon9600 pro anyway, but once they drop to $50 I might consider
You DevilDog Big Spender you.... http://www.stupid-boy.com/smilies/contrib/blackeye/hehehmn.gif

[ih8mblogins]

You're in for a long wait for that $50 9600. Notice a trend of late with graphics cards? At least with ATI, they've been discontinuing earlier and releasing a lot of revisions. It keeps the price up for both because the older ones aren't that old yet and now harder to find and of course the 'new' ones are still new. Though, the 'new' performance is roughly the same as the old. That and instead of dropping the price of the old cards to second tier status when releasing the new, they've just been raising the new price. I think it's going to take new players to drop prices back down from nvidia and ati's continual attempt to answer the question of 'how high can we raise the price and still have suckers bite', someone should start a pool for how long it'll take for them to reach a grand, which is why I'm interested in seeing the duo and s3's card fair well when they're released(hurry up already!).

[Edge]

Yeah all these revisions are getting pretty annoying. Now there's the 9000, 9000pro, 9200, 9200pro, 9500, 9500pro, 9600, 9600pro, 9600xt, 9700, 9700pro, 9800se, 9800, 9800pro, and 9800xt. It's ironic that even with all those cards out there, there's only 1 game out right now that even uses heavy DX9 effects. Choosing which card to get is pretty damn annoying now that thier naming system is messed up. The 9500 is faster then the 9600, the 9800se is slower then a 9600pro, and the 9700pro is faster then a 9800. It makes the naming system behind the GF4MX seem like it makes sense.

But the good news is, when the newer, "faster" cards come out, the old cards are usually put on clearence. 9800nps can be had for as cheap as $240 at a retail store, and I've even seen FX5900s for $230 at Best Buy (most likely in preparation for the 5950s). The flood of new cards onto the market pushes the old cards down to cheaper prices. But usually they don't make enough of any individual card to make it widely availible enough to drop the price on them, even GF2MXs can still be picked up for under $50 at major retail stores.

[ih8mblogins]

Ah, now there's a phrase: 'as cheap as $240'. They've been sticking with their price structure long enough that more and more people don't see that as a contradiction of terms. I can afford it, but I refuse to pay $200, $300, $500, etc for a video card.

[Hellbinder]

I Am getting the impression that there was indeed one last respin of the Rv360. it did indeed get to board partners recently. BUT that does not mean that the base spec of the 9600XT is changing. I think the INQ is all washed up on this. Board partners are customizing the 9600XT's to some degree but thats about it i think.

I am not 100% sure on this.

[ChrisW]

Board makers already have the choice of using whatever ram they want. There is nothing stopping them from adding faster ram to their boards. The question is just how much do you think people are willing to pay for a mid-range card? 250? 300? I don't think so. If you increase the cost anymore, you might as well purchase a 9800 non-pro. The more these cards cost, the fewer people will purchase them. You can't expect ATI to make their mid-range products as powerfull as their high end products. The 9600XT is already $200 and a 9800 non-pro can be found for around $230.

[yoladude]

Originally posted by Edge
Yeah all these revisions are getting pretty annoying. Now there's the 9000, 9000pro, 9200, 9200pro, 9500, 9500pro, 9600, 9600pro, 9600xt, 9700, 9700pro, 9800se, 9800, 9800pro, and 9800xt.

heh, you left out the 9200se, 9600se, and 9600 pro EZ version. don't forget there's at least three different types of 9800se.

my god. when will it end. it's getting rediculous. all i want right now is a geforcefx 5900 off ebay for the holidays; they're as fast as a 9700-card off ebay and a little cheaper. seems like a good deal to me.