r400 <-> nv40

[ulukay]

hoi

anyone knows release dates (or should i say ... paper launch dates :D )

some rumors about the specs would also be nice

[-=DVS=-]

First quarter of 2004 im sure :)

R400 was not released this year and is called R420 or so rumors are flying so next year it must come out early.
N40 should come out also or else its bad for Nvidia.

[Unit01]

I wanna see some funny promo vids like what nvidia did with the NV30. Don't care which company, i just wanna see some funny promo vids :D

[Paul]

This has already been discussed in a number of threads. Any need to start a new one?

[B&R]

yeah dig thru rumor forums. I am sure u will find alot threads abt this.

[-=DVS=-]

why dig when you can start a new one :D :lol: and it look noone knows exact date of shiping anyways :(

[truth]

but seriously NV30 causes a lot of ppl to lost money when it was supposed to be their best high end product whereby, suddenly, nvidia just decides to scrap it off and release another newer which is 5900 within weeks.

[Uttar]

Originally posted by truth
but seriously NV30 causes a lot of ppl to lost money when it was supposed to be their best high end product whereby, suddenly, nvidia just decides to scrap it off and release another newer which is 5900 within weeks.

NV35 was in development for a lot longer than a few weeks :P
Plus, not scrapping the NV30 would have been insane: bad reviews AND per-product losses...


Uttar

[suburbanguy]

The R400 as it was originally intended, you will probably never see released. it was intended to be out this fall.

R400 was cancelled.


The R420 is the replacement but will not be as advanced or ambitious as the R400.


the R420 is said to be based on modified & enhanced R3xx core and should have alot more speed. hopefully, at least 2x as fast as R300 / 9700 .

[-=DVS=-]

well it should be atleast twice as fast if we look at history

"R100"Radeon 64 -> "R200"Radeon 8500 -> "R300"Radeon 9700 (all new cores twice as faster) "R400"/"R420" should be a big step forward :drooling:

Refreshes doesn't count :p

[bloodbob]

The next gen cards were supposed to come out in the Q1 of 2004 I guess there could be some delay in the both of them but hopefully they both come out atleast in Q1/Q2 2004 just thinking they might be pushed back because of the realtively late respins that came out/coming out. ( 9600 XT isn't in stores yet is it? )

[suburbanguy]

well it should be atleast twice as fast if we look at history

"R100"Radeon 64 -> "R200"Radeon 8500 -> "R300"Radeon 9700 (all new cores twice as faster) "R400"/"R420" should be a big step forward

Refreshes doesn't count


Indeed :D :D :D :D

[nobie]

Originally posted by -=DVS=-
well it should be atleast twice as fast if we look at history

"R100"Radeon 64 -> "R200"Radeon 8500 -> "R300"Radeon 9700 (all new cores twice as faster) "R400"/"R420" should be a big step forward :drooling:

Refreshes doesn't count :p

OK just for fun, this is what twice a Radeon 9700 (non-pro) would be:
35.2 GB/s memory
4400 MTexels/Pixels per second
550 Mtris/s
~9500 in 3DMark03

That's all realistic I think. Assuming R420 has 12 pipes as rumours suggest, it would only have to be clocked at 366 MHz to have twice the theoretical fill-rate of the 9700. I think even Doom3 and HalfLife2 would be no sweat on such a card :afro2:

edit: more fun! Here's twice what a GeforceFX 5800 (non-ultra) would be:
25.6 GB/s memory
3200 MTexels/Pixels per second
560 mtris/s
~7000 in 3DMark03

:mad: I'm hoping for alot more from NV40. Atleast we know the memory will be fast :D

[S.I.N]

What you guys think the price on such a card will be, being that this is new gen card? Top end new gen used to be $400 (halfway acceptable) but the trend lately has been $500 (not acceptable). If there is a chance this beast by all accounts comes in at $400 I may just hold off on spending $330 to upgrade now.

[nobie]

I expect the price-points will be similar to todays cards.... IMO right now is a bad time to upgrade, since a new generation of cards will come out in the spring.

[Riptide]

I would guess at LEAST $500, possibly nearing $600. The trend has been upwards and I don't see why it won't continue that way.

[Paul]

Originally posted by nobie
edit: more fun! Here's twice what a GeforceFX 5800 (non-ultra) would be:
25.6 GB/s memory
3200 MTexels/Pixels per second
560 mtris/s
~7000 in 3DMark03

Heh, no :cool:

[-=DVS=-]

Originally posted by nobie
OK just for fun, this is what twice a Radeon 9700 (non-pro) would be:
35.2 GB/s memory
4400 MTexels/Pixels per second
550 Mtris/s
~9500 in 3DMark03

That's all realistic I think. Assuming R420 has 12 pipes as rumours suggest, it would only have to be clocked at 366 MHz to have twice the theoretical fill-rate of the 9700. I think even Doom3 and HalfLife2 would be no sweat on such a card :afro2:

edit: more fun! Here's twice what a GeforceFX 5800 (non-ultra) would be:
25.6 GB/s memory
3200 MTexels/Pixels per second
560 mtris/s
~7000 in 3DMark03

:mad: I'm hoping for alot more from NV40. Atleast we know the memory will be fast :D


realy nice figures ,R420 should be a beast
as for NV40 rumors are its only full 8x1 pipe... compared to 4x2/8x1 current FX.. so its not fast IMO

But im sure both future cards should get over 9000 3dMark2003 :drooling: and rumors are offten just rumors :D

[nobie]

I've heard NV40 is 8x2/16x1, in the same way that NV30 was 4x2/8x1.

[-=DVS=-]

Originally posted by nobie
I've heard NV40 is 8x2/16x1, in the same way that NV30 was 4x2/8x1.

Realy ? well then its better then 8x1 only i guess , but still
its gonna be then similar situation to current

R300 8x1 NV30 4x2/8x1
R420 12x1? NV40 8x2/16x1?

Kind of interesting can't wait :D :drooling: both cards should be superb ,i hope Nvidia improves AA :o

[AngelGraves13]

I'm done upgrading until PCI-Express (2nd generation is out)... It's good to hear we're moving on up though.

[MUYA]

Originally posted by 99 to Life
I'm done upgrading until PCI-Express (2nd generation is out)... It's good to hear we're moving on up though.
Definately good news as traditional bottle necks are slowly being made redundant. On other fronts, I do like Intel's & VIA's approach on making SATA controllers native rather than tagging it to the PCI bus, NVIDIA is going to do thats oon with the MCP-S. I wonder though about traditional PIDE. Can any tell me if this can be moved from the PCI Bus etc?? I dunno the mecahnics behind it just now being native makes SATA much faster?

Cheers
MUYA

[Uttar]

Originally posted by nobie
I've heard NV40 is 8x2/16x1, in the same way that NV30 was 4x2/8x1.

Actually, AFAIK, it's 8x2, but cannot be 16x0. That's because the focus is on AA, and the 8x0 advantage of the NV3x is gone as of 4x AA - considering that with 48GB/s, 4x AA in all situations is a strict MINIMUM, I'd say that 16x0 wouldn't be an advantage in the NV40 generation :)

Basically, if you want DX7 games performance, the NV40 is a pretty well know beast:
NV30/500*600*2 = 2.4x NV30 or NV38 @ 500Mhz ( remember DX7 games performance on the NV35 are lower than on a NV30 since its clocks are lower and there's no improvement beside FP PS power ).

DX8 games, I'd suspect:
NV30/500*600*2*(number between .60 and .80) = +- 1.75x NV38

DX9 is harder to speculate about due to how important certain unknown factors are.


Uttar

[nobie]

with 4x AA, what is the advantage of two texture units per pipe? or is this a matter of increasing pixel shader performance?

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by nobie
with 4x AA, what is the advantage of two texture units per pipe? or is this a matter of increasing pixel shader performance?

It's a matter of increasing fillrate. Think Doom3 stencil shadows.