VR and the future of computer games

[srelaimtoh]

OK now this is a long post that ive gone into some detail about. Sorry if its a little long winded and crazed and over the top but I wanted to get this out!


Continuing the disscusion about photo realistic graphics.
Something I would like to get off my chest is the amasing lack of real
excitment about whats going to happen with computer games in the future.
I see the next major step in gaming is the changing of a monitor to a VR head set or something of similar nature.
Sometimes I play games on my 19" monitor and pull the screen about 6" away from me and I relise how stupid it is to play a game on a monitor with
so much of the real world in the way. If you put a VR headset on HL2 it would beee AWWWWEEESSSOMME. I dont think you realise how good.
So you talk of photo realistic graphics but to be honest having a VR headset would be a point in history where mankind moves up a level!
The question is how long? I figure that to have a very high res picture in a headset your going to need a screen resolution of like 2400X3200 because the screen is so close to your eyes. So we need more computer power yet. Also they have to be able to make that at around £500. I hope they do soon.
Can you imagine it being 2010 and we are still playing on monitors? I think its real sad that we have the potential to use VR today but we cant due to cost and the fact that private companies hog patents to their technology! So roll on VR!
As for photo realistic graphics well...im guessing about 8-10 years away? So hopefully VR will be out by then or it will be real bummer. What use is photo realistic graphics with out a VR headset of some sort? I hope they sort it out soon!!

Now on to further things. We are all talking about NV40 and 50.. But where will we be 10 or 20 years from now? They say in 20-30 years we will have 1,000,000 times the computer power we have now! The thing is if you think about 1,000,000 times the power we have now isnt that like terriblly frightening?
All I see is this huge technology bomb ticking away and soon its going to get crazy! I think one reason people arn't completly histerical about it and not sleeping at night with excitment is that its so far away! Tell a man he won the lottery but cant have the money in 30 years and he soon feels like hes won nothing.
We go to movies like the matrix and all though we kind of expect to get to that level one day we also kinda think its not real.
Do we all go home and think GOD!, in 30 years I could have computer at home that is just like the hollodeck of star trek or matrix!!!! No because its too far away!
This is because the brain puts things that are 20-30 years away into the IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN catagory. Do you see? How can you get excited when it is 20-30 years away? What if computer power was 1,000,000 tommorow? and Half life 8 came out running at 1,000,000 time the power?
You would pee your pants with insane excitement! Oh but 20-30 years away? Not that bothered. Ill think about it nearer the time! Its barely real.
A computer thats 1,000,000 times more powerful than something that runs HL2? My point is we should be thinking seriously of what might happen in 20-30 years?
We need to imagine what we could do with all that computer power... Sure its cool talking about NV40 or oooooh the NV50 but what about the NV200 or NV300 from 20-30 years away?
I have some thougts on the matter.
My thought is that as time moves on man will learn to interface his mind with the mind of a computer until the two become one!
What im talking here is a brain extension. You plug your brain up to a whopping super computer and that computer then becomes part of your own mind!
You can think at 100000's time faster speed etc...See entire planets massive databases with everything happening on it simultanusly like a god!
You could read everything on the net in a day! This kind of thing could easily be possible by 2050 at the latest. Sure we will all be 80 odd but hell they may of found out how to slow aging down so much by then we will be like 40-50 years old. Not necessarily OAP'S!
I guess it would be a litttle like the borg to some degree. Imagine having a suped up ultra quantum computer as part of your own mind!
One thing I dont think people get about technology improving is the threshold that occurs. People seem to forget that it improves at a faster rate. I mean that between say 2010 and 2020 we will advance as much as we did between 2000 and 2015 then from 2020 to 2028 we will advance as much as 2010 to 2020.
The figures arnt meant to be acurate im just pointing out the idea that most people miss.
Isnt it also a thought that one day computers will be so powerful they can invent new graphics cards/better computers without much input from man that in turn can make a a better computer utill BOOM! Isnt that a scary thought?
My point is that a technology in say the year 2050 will be like its from the year 6000 AD.
And technology from 2100 from 30000 AD, Assumning we dont get stoped by limiting factors in technology.
Will we get stoped when transistors are like atom sized? What if we spend the rest of existance in this universe for 100000000000's of yeas not growing any more?
Would that be a bit lame? Evolutions great pan was for us to stop there and not grow any more?
Or will we get past it and carry on for ever? What then?
Does anyone else agree with me that people cant see the threshold effects thats going to occur?
Things will plod along for the next 5-10 years but round about 2010 onwards things are going to start getting scary. I mean people will almost be having nightmares about how good technology is getting wehn they beging to see that 2040 is going to be like the year 3000-5000 AD !

Any way to wrap all this up.
Evolution started on this planet with tine cells. Basic life forms... Over millions of years they grew and grew and grew. Now if you think how slow it was for growth.
Taking millions of years for changes to happen. Then along comes man a mere 2 million years ago which they say if the life of earth up untill now is a day then the clock of earths evolution in the last 2 million years is 23 59 59 seconds!!
The 2 million years man has been here is only the last second of an entire day!
Now we have nearly 2 million years of hardly moving anywere again
(although relative to earths evolution we are moving at frightening speed) and now here we are in 2004 nearly with graphics cards doubleing every 18 months or so 2,4,8,16,32,64 tiimes better..
The next 100 years counts as the last 4 seconds of the 2 million years of mankind lifetime.
So on earths full clock 2 million years of mankind is at 23.59.59 secs
On mankinds full clock this upcoming 100 years is 23.59.56 secs
So the total point we are now at in 2000-2100 in earths full evolution is about 23hrs 59 mins 59.999975 Secs !!! How amasing is that?
The question is we stop at some point or wil technology go on forever? Well to go all this way just to stop growing in 50-100 years because transistors cant get any smaller would be so pathetic after billions of years of all this growth so I bet we can get past it. But if we do what gos on in 1000000 years from now or 100000000000 years from now if we dont stop? I have absolutily no idea! Any one any clues?

Ok thats all im sorry if this post is long winded but I just wanted to see if anyone was interested. IF not we can go back to talking about NV40! :)

[Viral]

What is needed is a VR headset for everyday use.. something that is not constricting, awkward, or of any major inconvenience. For this problem to be solved the headset would have to be lightweight and probably not have an actual object in front of your eyes, more of a hologram (getting a bit far-fetched here). The unit itself would preferrably be wireless, and only consist of a small unit that perhaps clips over your ear.

If this problem is solved monitors could be gotten away with all together for PC's... notice the bold P... Personal. Another problem is the displaying of an image to multiple people.. is it really viable to have multiple headsets? probably not. Unless another solution is thought of, monitors in one form or another will stay in our lives for quite some time. As for the enthusiast gaming market.. thats another story. For LAN's such a device would be brilliant. I see quite a dilemma when it comes to monitors and LAN's.. one one side you have your 17-21" CRT, preferrable for games, yet heavy and not all that portable. On the other there is a light 15-19" LCD, not so great for games (although changing), expensive, yet very portable. Even in a non LAN situation the addition of sometimes much needed desk space would be a welcome upside to not having a monitor.

VR has attemped to make its way to PC in the past.. but support was a major problem.. i remember seeing one device in a mag.. problem was the only games supported by it were Quake 1 and 2. There could have been a reason for this, the product may not have worked well, or ID may have been the only company willing to take a risk in the attempt to make gaming better. Of course in those days, 320x24-640x480 res was the norm.. i have no idea how such low resolutions would have come accross over such a device, but i assume the image was either somewhat blurred, or just an eyesore ;p

As for the rest of this (you're lucky it's late and i'm bored! ;p).. well, personally i only see technology progression becoming much tougher as time moves on. There are four aspects which will ensure progression equal to or greater than the current rate, need, desire, the push factor and ability.

Need and desire are obvious.. what do customers need? if there is no need for something faster, who's going to make it anyway? there always seems to be a market who wants these 'faster' or 'better' objects, but will there always be such a market? lets use the car analogy for example.. who needs a 600bhp car? the design of roads cannot sustain a car with such power being pushed to its limits, nor can people control such a car on these roads in everyday traffic. There are exceptions, but there are laws against doing such a thing for a reason. There is no need for a 600bhp car. However, there is a desire. The simple purpose of such a car is for racing. Racing is a form of entertainment, an act of want, desire. To buy a car for the road is also obviously a desire to simulate racing in a real life environment (among other things). For computers, here is where we should soon see a distinct division. In the past every user used similar peices of harware.. on the desktop front anyway. Much was the same in the early days of the car. As time goes on a division occurs, and will occur for computers. It has already begun making its way onto the desktop user level with the introduction of '3D accelerators' late last decade. Eventually, there will be a much more disticnt difference between certain desktop computers, all will be made for different taks. Sure it is happening now, but its has only just begun.

The push factor and ability are interlinked because if one is lacking, the other generally thrives (depending on need and desire). The push factor is competition, what must be made to stay competitive with the competition? Ability has afew sub-categories. Financial ability, technical/physical ability. Financial is very interlinked with the push factor.. generally the underdog will have a harder time making their way to the top because they are less financially able to keep up. Of course this is in no way set in stone, there is also the factor of how the competitor runs their company (how agressive are they towards the competition? are they good at business? are they making the right moves? did they employ the right staff?). The business with the financial advantage usually has the upper hand however. They have more tactics to use in 'battle', such as lowering prices and losing money, and they also have access to better technology (generally).

As for the current situation... well we will (theoretically) come to a wall in the way we make processors (CPU's, GPU's, APU's etc). Current estimates are somewhere just below the 15nm node i believe. There has been talk of using a completely different technique, such as Bionic technology to produce technology that can surpass what todays manufacturing techniques take us too.

Ultimately i think technology in the distant future will be completely different to todays tech. It won't just be a faster version of it with more abilities and built on a smaller technology node. It will be completely differen't. This is why it is important to not cling to traditional ways. Revolution is the key to progression, evolution is a temporary fix. Sure revolution is risky, and companies that built themselves from a traditional way of doing something may be scared of it, but thats where the push factor comes back into play. A company who hasn't found their desired success using traditional methods will be less against risking it all on something revolutionary. This is why we can't have singular dominant companies. There must be competition to ensure progression is not hindered, and so that we get better technology for what we pay.

Well it's been fun draggin all this from my head.. :p I don't think i managed to beat your post, but i tried.:rolleyes:

I'm looking forward to owning an NV120 made from modified human DNA and a manufactured brain (never mind the ethical issues! i want my technology!)with 512Gb of RAM at 2.8Tb/s... though i'm sure it may be rather 'forgetfull' O_o

[-=DVS=-]

But if we do what gos on in 1000000 years from now or 100000000000 years from now if we dont stop? I have absolutily no idea! Any one any clues?


earths natural resources will end up much sooner then we can reach end of technological advancment , to put it short we all be dead before that :rolleyes:

[srelaimtoh]

hmm not sure about that.
Resorce problems will be solved in the next 100 years.
One thing that we should well see in the future (still in our life times)
Is some sort of anti-matter energy generator.
I think once we develop one of those our society is going to go boom!
Also science says that one day they can actualy change elements of the periodic table into others by displacing electrons/protons etc. so you could turn lead into gold etc
Resources wont be a problem anymore.
Also we will be able to go to other planets etc
Im sure by 2050 we will have anti matter energy.
I bet in 20-30 years we will have it if we are lucky.
I wonder how our society will change then?
What will we do with almost unlimited energy?
Well like I said space travel will then be a serious reality and living on other planets soon after. Sure space travel over the past 50 years has been rather pathetic but give it another 10 years or so and its really going to get started.
I know that the space shuttles/station we see arnt very high tech but I bet the GOV has top secret space ship projects running right now.
It wouldnt suprise me if they were only 5-10 years away from using anti matter engines. The scientists tell it us its a long time off but I think top secret Gov's with trillions of dollars are probably more ahead than we think. If any offical NON-secret GOV scientists were told of the progress other countrys would try to steal info so any new advances with say anti matter are hidding from pubilic so were all like oh yea anti matter energy or fision energy is like 50 years away when really it might not be.
You have see X files havnt you?
So no I dont see resources being a problem. We have plenty of time.
Any way once oil runs out people will use deisel or hemp oil.
Did you know hemp oil would cost about 10% the price of petrol and run cleanly? But Bush and the corupt USA Gov. (in the past) wanted to sell thier oil so they banned cannabis because it was such a good souce of fuel that threated the oil. Inst that horrible 10% the cost and enviromently friendly. Shesh.... Hate that corrupt USA gov.......

[srelaimtoh]

Oh yea an for viral...
Yes I did wonder about the multi player thing and the weight of the head set.
I recently saw a movie called Toys and what they had was a half circle type screen. Well it was like half circle but the two ends of the half circle go straight for a 10" or so the screen encompaces you more.
All you can see then is the screen and nothing else.
Maybe something like that is more suitable?
I can imagine at the moment one of those would cost a load.
Maybe in 5-10 years it would be possbile to make one for around £500 or $800. I just hope so.
Another point is I heard about 2 years ago that Japan was working on a revolutionry new monitor that doesnt use pixels like todays monitors.
Something about some sort of blending lazer beams or something?
I think it was meant to be like a bilinier or triliner monitor if you get me that doesnt have pixels just a totally smooth screen and because it can blend lazer beams or something the resolution is far beyond what we have now.
Anyone here know anything about this?
Maybe its no longer inproduction.
Ill have to see if I can find out more info on it.

[Ninja Prime]

Binary computer tech isn't expected to continue to advance after 2025-2030. By that time processors might be 1,000,000 times more powerful than today, but that won't do much for graphics, as graphics are expected to reach reality in realtime by 2015 or so.

[druga runda]

VR headsets,

Wireless, light, perhaps some kind of "glove", glovers or even a VR suit will be "normal" in not so distant future for total VR immersion.

I can already see Nvidia " Geforce Suit - the revolution in human evolution :afro:

[rwolf]

Geforce suit with a leaf blower to keep you from melting.

[srelaimtoh]

Yea. Imagine some sort of gloves with chips on a large number of points on them or what ever. It would be cool. Just pretend now and you will see what I mean.
Hold you hands out in front of you now (go on do it) and imagine your a charater on a game with a guy in front of you and reach out your hand and grab his ear and then pull his head to the side then uppercut him with your other hand. Just play about imagining you could see it on the screen.
Grab his hair and imagine seeing you twist it about as he stuggles.
It feels so good! Playing a game like HL3 or HL4 grabing peoples ears and stuff would be 100 times more satifying than clicking a button.
Imagine if you say grab their ear and cut it off with a knife in the other hand!!!!!! aheheheh
Playability factor goes up a lot. Just try it pretending....I cant wait!

[Viral]

Ok Mike tyson thats enough with the ear obsession;)

Its hard to think of VR seriously because of how it became so 'corny' those years ago in movies and what not.. still, i believe it will dramatically change gaming. however, beyond that, i think a device directly linked to our brain would work much better... but that's a long way off:rolleyes:

[nobie]

I would love a decent consumer-level VR headset. So far all that i've found (http://www.i-glassesstore.com/hmds.html) are very expensive :mad:

[Woodelf]

What ever happen's with VR, I'm sure that bill gates has plans for it allready.;)