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View Full Version : Nvidia's 'automatic' image sharpening (thin or thick text), 53.03


tekdroid
01-30-04, 07:15 PM
I got an FX5200 the other day (fanless) and thought I had a hardware problem after I noticed the card was displaying text 'different' - the text appeared thinner, not as 'bold' as it usually is. I first noticed it on right-click menus in my browser. Then I noticed it was Windows-wide - text was thinner, most apparent on all the 'grey window' areas through Windows. Then I found I couldn't stand reading anything online.

Anyway....
This was weird because immediately after putting the card in I didn't notice any real visual differences (in standard windows) to my ti4200 and I wondered what was cuasing it - or whether I just started to notice it.

So...
Later on I rebooted and found the card went 'back to normal'. Hmm, I thought. I started to investigate. Simply clicking the GeforceFX tab enabled it. Grr.

I also found that clicking on "Color Correction" on the white Nvidia pop-out menu on the left would enable and disable the Image Sharpening effect if I then clicked:
on my Geforce FX 5200 tab,
then clicked on any other tab

Clicking back and forth between my Geforce FX 5200 tab and another tab would enabled and disable the effect for immediate comparison. Thin text (image sharpened) and thick text (normal) would show. Unforunately the normal thick text could not be saved as it would revert to image-sharpened text, but it's a good quick comparison between the two.

Anyway, the fix I found for it was to simply switch resolutions temporarily and it would return back to its normal 'unsharpened' state.

Questions:
1) Why hasn't nvidia fixed this (I read here that this has been part of earlier 5x.xx revisions).
2) Is there a faster way to disable the automatic image-sharpening besides changing resolutions? Going into the driver properties then having to switch resolutions just to get around this annoying bug is really annoying.

PS. I have my suspicions about what Nvidia is up to with this feature.

StealthHawk
01-31-04, 03:40 AM
Have you tried 53.06? Some people are saying that it is fixed...although I'm not sure they know what to look for. Anyway, if you give 53.06 a whirl leave some feedback in the thread: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23860

And yes, the Image Sharpening bug(?) has existed in every 50 series driver up to and including 53.03.

Discussion (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19636)

Surely NVIDIA must know about the problem by now, and it shouldn't be that hard to fix. After all, older 40 series drivers didn't have this problem. Like you, I have my suspicions that this is intentional as it is ludicrous that the problem has existed for over 4 months.

tekdroid
01-31-04, 06:31 AM
Stealthhawk, nah I haven't tried any other drivers. I make it a habit to just use official releases from nvidia.com. I really try to avoid uninstalling/installing/rebooting too - it's easier on my sanity.

I will upgrade to the next official release when it comes out and see if it's solved. Right now, I am living with it. I'll just avoid changing any driver settings for the card if I can. If I have to get in there, I'll do the resolution switcheroo to disable image sharpening.

re: the discussion link you posted. Yep, I read up about it here before posting. Choosing correct search terms for the issue was a challenge since I had no idea what to put in since I had no idea what was going on, but I eventually found it. It was good to see others had the same problem - I would have otherwise returned the card.

I am surprised (and disappointed) that Nvidia have let this problem slip through for so long. It's very noticeable on my Trinitron.

DSC
02-01-04, 02:59 AM
Yes, this bug is EXTREMELY ANNOYING on the FX5200 that I have atm. I'm just about to suggest we email support@nvidia.com (address given during the Bjorn3d chat with Nvidia for support/bug reporting issues) about this issue until they actually FIX the damn bug.

fivefeet8
02-01-04, 03:27 AM
I've been hearing this problem a lot. But since I do like a little image sharpening applied to games, it wasn't much of a problem for me. I however started testing if Image sharpening was being applied to the desktop without me choosing it. Strangly enough, I don't notice any image sharpening going on when I disable it when I click on ok after setting it to 0. Or when I restart my computer and test it. Image sharpening isn't being applied.

I would know if it was since I mainly use it when I play some emulated N64/psx games. I turn it off afterwards though. Also, I used the d3d-AF tester program and looked at a squares getting smaller(made them really small) in the funnel for the AF test. No image sharpening being applied either.

particleman
02-02-04, 05:03 PM
It's definitely there but only after you go into nVidia's control panel, if you turn on clear type font smoothing it's almost unoticeable though. I just get around it by using Rivatuner instead of the display properties CP.

StealthHawk
02-03-04, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by particleman
It's definitely there but only after you go into nVidia's control panel, if you turn on clear type font smoothing it's almost unoticeable though. I just get around it by using Rivatuner instead of the display properties CP.

Do you have a CRT or LCD? I was using ClearType FS on my CRT and it was noticeable to me. When I installed 52.xx I noticed that the text in these forums was harder to read and looked weird. The only reason I found out that it was Image Sharpening that was behind it was that other people reported it.

And of course, ClearType doesn't work well with CRTs anyway. Makes things a lot more readable, but the odd color disparities get annoying.

threedaysdwn
02-14-04, 04:06 PM
ClearType was designed for LCDs (it modifies the sub-pixels used at the edges of screen fonts - since CRTs don't have subpixels, it doesn't really work). But many people leave it on anyway as oppsed to the normal "font smoothing" setting, and it does look different. It's just not the intended effect.

As for this "image sharpening" bug that everyone is talking about... I have no clue what it is nor have I ever seen its effects (or noticed them) on my card.

particleman
03-11-04, 07:34 PM
Woohoo!!!! just read the front page and someone finally made a fix for this bug that has been plaguing us for ages. There is now a patch script for Rivatuner to remove the image sharpening bug.

Hmmm... the script only seems to work with 56.XX though, now if only nVidia would release an official 56.XX with the UT 2004 performance bug fixed.

DSC
03-11-04, 10:53 PM
It takes Unwinder a day to fix what the Forceware control panel programmer can't fix in months.... :rolleyes:

Shaitan
03-11-04, 11:20 PM
"As for this "image sharpening" bug that everyone is talking about... I have no clue what it is nor have I ever seen its effects (or noticed them) on my card."

Same here. I don`t notice this bug at all, yet so many seem to rave on about it. lol

Unwinder
03-12-04, 01:21 AM
Originally posted by particleman
Woohoo!!!! just read the front page and someone finally made a fix for this bug that has been plaguing us for ages. There is now a patch script for Rivatuner to remove the image sharpening bug.

Hmmm... the script only seems to work with 56.XX though, now if only nVidia would release an official 56.XX with the UT 2004 performance bug fixed.

It's not a problem at all to create the same script for the previous drivers. I'll do it if users will demand it. ;)

Unwinder
03-12-04, 01:26 AM
Originally posted by DSC
It takes Unwinder a day to fix what the Forceware control panel programmer can't fix in months.... :rolleyes:

I'm afraid that they simply don't aware of the problem. I've tried to contact control panel programmers yesterday via email which I used to disccuss some control panel related issues with them in the past, but they didn't replied yet. Hope that they'll put the fix on the task list.

StealthHawk
03-12-04, 02:57 AM
Originally posted by Unwinder
It's not a problem at all to create the same script for the previous drivers. I'll do it if users will demand it. ;)

If I was still using a gfFX I would be bugging you like crazy to modify the script ;) But since I'm not I'll leave that up to other people.

Good work, by the way.

saturnotaku
03-12-04, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by Unwinder
I'm afraid that they simply don't aware of the problem. I've tried to contact control panel programmers yesterday via email which I used to disccuss some control panel related issues with them in the past, but they didn't replied yet. Hope that they'll put the fix on the task list.

If you have a problem with NVIDIA not responding to you, use this forum to send a private message and/or e-mail to Andy Meacham, the Linux guy who moderates those forums. Tell him you're having problems getting a hold of the Windows development team and that you've found a solution to this problem. He might be able to point you in the right direction or pass on the message to the appropriate people. Good work and good luck getting NVIDIA to notice.

Unwinder
03-12-04, 08:14 AM
Originally posted by saturnotaku
If you have a problem with NVIDIA not responding to you, use this forum to send a private message and/or e-mail to Andy Meacham, the Linux guy who moderates those forums. Tell him you're having problems getting a hold of the Windows development team and that you've found a solution to this problem. He might be able to point you in the right direction or pass on the message to the appropriate people. Good work and good luck getting NVIDIA to notice.

Nope, it's not a problem to find right people to talk to. I've just informed ppl that I've informed NV control panel developers and didn't received any response yet. Let's wait a bit. Unlike other IHVs, NVIDIA fixes all the problems _very_ fast after receiving detailed problem description.

OWA
03-12-04, 01:28 PM
Is this a problem that everyone has if they're using the 5x.xx drivers? I have never been able to figure out what the bug actually is either so could someone take a screenshot of text before and after? Would it show up in a screenshot? I'm not sure if I have it and just don't notice it or if I really don't have it. I guess I shouldn't worry about it if I don't notice it but I'm still curious about it.

fivefeet8
03-12-04, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by OWA
Is this a problem that everyone has if they're using the 5x.xx drivers? I have never been able to figure out what the bug actually is either so could someone take a screenshot of text before and after? Would it show up in a screenshot? I'm not sure if I have it and just don't notice it or if I really don't have it. I guess I shouldn't worry about it if I don't notice it but I'm still curious about it.

Image sharpening is a Post process filter. You can't take a screenshot of it. You can however, mimic it's affects by using photoshop and apply sharpening to the picture. The good thing though, is that, if you like it's affects in games, you can enable it without any performance hit and it's probably a good way to make older monitors display look better. Same with digital Vibrance.

I have also seen that this "bug" isn't happening on my Samsung 18" LCD display Digital. Once I boot into windows and then check the display properties, nothing changes. No image sharpening is applied. The thing is though, is that recently, I got a Princeton 21" CRT display($150 on sale ;)), and it DOES have the image shapening bug. It doesn't bother me much though since I usually use a little image sharpening with my games. :D
But I do see why it would bother those who don't like it.

turnergo
03-08-05, 03:24 AM
When shutting down - usually after problems - I find I get certain tasks that will not shut. I am told Nvidia is not responding and I often get another pop-up saying "Insight SM's hidden window"???
I am an active Nielsen Ratings member and have noticed in other discussions that people have had problems when they were ran Nielsen's rating software. I used to have problems with certain net-based applications when I ran with the an older version of the Nielsen software. I am currently running V3.60.1.
If anyone has any ideas to get rid of the Insight or nvidia problem I would be grateful.
Thanks,

Q
03-09-05, 07:22 PM
Not to crap the hell out of your first post....but...

First you dig up a post thats a year old.

Then you have a post that doesn't even relate to the thread you dug up.

THEN you post your problem in the driver section...when it doesn't really seem to be a driver issue.

Please put some more thought into your posts....I DO appreciate adding to old threads when something is relevant in them instead of making another thread....but this post doesn't seem to be relevant.

Good luck with having your problem solved, however.

AND WELCOME TO THE FORUMS! =D

Falkentyne
03-12-05, 09:05 PM
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