PDA

View Full Version : New Toy....


Pages : [1] 2

RobHague
02-28-04, 09:47 AM
This arrived on my door step this morning....:D

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?s=&postid=278819

It's getting coupled with my new SK8V and Opteron 146 (2ghz).

Ill post some impressions, i know its prolly not the best time to buy such a card but i couldnt resist - the prices have come way down. It was a toss up between the 9800XT and the 5950, but the 5950 was cheaper and NVIDIA, and aparentley going to be the mutz nutz for doom3.... so it won. ;)

I have been from 5800U > 9700 > 5900XT > 9800 > 5900 and now to a 5950... so im not totally biased btw. ;)

Skinner
02-28-04, 11:16 AM
Well, at least you have complete and new 64 bits videodrivers ;)

Can you run some painkiller (level3 palace ) numbers and Chrome?

Those game are choppy on my XT (1280x1024x32 16 performance AF)

GlowStick
02-28-04, 11:23 AM
Nice!

I have to say that i am jelious, i have been getting the upgrade bug lately that i just cant shake lose.

RobHague
02-28-04, 03:57 PM
Hey, yeah i really didnt need to upgrade but i just felt the need to make a change. I did swop to a 144 opt and an SK8N and while it was great - i felt i needed to go one step furthur as i was planning on sticking with for about 6months...

I have the following right now :-

AMD Opteron 146 (2Ghz)
Asus SK8V (K8T800) 1600Mhz HTT
1Gb of Corsair XMS3200LL (ECC REGISTERED)
160GB SATA Maxtor DiamondMax9 (8Mb Cache)
NEC 2500A DVDRW (8x/4x)
XFX GeforceFX 5950 Ultra 256MB DDR
SoundBlaster Audigy2 ZS (connected to a set of Inspire 6.1 6700's)
Chieftec Golden Green Case w/ 5 LED Case Fans
Vantec Nexus Fan Controller in 5 1/4 bay
Antec 450w SmartPower PSU
ACER AL1721 17" TFT screen (using DVI connection)

Not too shabby eh? :D

Tis running quite well at the moment, i seem to have fixed a small problem i was having with the SK8V and the power switch, the SK8V gives me increased memory bandwidth over the Nforce3 (thanks to the 800/1600 HTT and 16/16bit im sure) and i must say VIA seem to have improved since my last 'encounter' with them. The opteron seems quite nippy, at last ECC works without crashing the PC (couldnt get ECC working on the SK8N) and a few other niggles seem to have been fixed by the MB swop.

I will report back on the 5950 when ive got all my drivers installed etc, at the mo im just finnishing my XP installation and downloading all the drivers hehe. I dont have the Painkiller demo yet, but ill try and get hold of a copy (56k poor me :().

OWA, the 5950 was £287 btw and i got it from OcUK (http://www.overclockers.co.uk). Its made by XFX (as i just listed up there) but it looks the same as all the others ive seen, apaart from the PCB is blue and not green.

A word on the opterons btw for anyone looking to go AMD64, the 2.2Ghz Opt 148 i have seen selling for less than the ATHLONFX-51. Round about £200 less actually (£328 vs £550), as its the same CPU (just multilocked) thats quite a deal. ;) The 2.0Ghz (146) is now around £210, pretty much equal to a 3200+ price wise. Considering u get DualDDR.... might be worth a look. If you dont already have standard RAM that is.

bkswaney
02-28-04, 06:10 PM
U r as bad as me switching video cards. :D "lol"

RobHague
02-29-04, 04:31 PM
Had a chance to run a few benchmarks, not really played any game apart from Halo though - but i can run Halo @ 1280x1024 and it runs just as well as it does at 1024x768... so that cant be bad considering how slow Halo can be. :)

18200 Marks for 3dMark2001se
6200 Marks for 3dMark2003
(rounded them off)

So thats not too bad, expected the 2001 score to be higher mind you....

RobHague
03-09-04, 07:07 PM
I was not quite happy with the performance of the 5950 Ultra and suspected something wrong with the 18k in benchmarks....

Was looking around and decided to try a 9800XT (Hercules) to see how it compared. 20k i get in 3dmark now. Shader intensive games (mainly morrowind and Deus Ex) are a lot smoother too... i think im gonna keep this and get rid of the 5950 :( its just so much better value unfortunatley. As much as NVIDIA's drivers kick ass i think im going to go with ATI on this one.......

PoorGuy
03-09-04, 07:19 PM
:bleh: (pb)

bkswaney
03-09-04, 08:36 PM
Originally posted by RobHague
I was not quite happy with the performance of the 5950 Ultra and suspected something wrong with the 18k in benchmarks....

Was looking around and decided to try a 9800XT (Hercules) to see how it compared. 20k i get in 3dmark now. Shader intensive games (mainly morrowind and Deus Ex) are a lot smoother too... i think im gonna keep this and get rid of the 5950 :( its just so much better value unfortunatley. As much as NVIDIA's drivers kick ass i think im going to go with ATI on this one.......


I could have told u that. ;) :angel2:

ChrisRay
03-09-04, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by RobHague
I was not quite happy with the performance of the 5950 Ultra and suspected something wrong with the 18k in benchmarks....

Was looking around and decided to try a 9800XT (Hercules) to see how it compared. 20k i get in 3dmark now. Shader intensive games (mainly morrowind and Deus Ex) are a lot smoother too... i think im gonna keep this and get rid of the 5950 :( its just so much better value unfortunatley. As much as NVIDIA's drivers kick ass i think im going to go with ATI on this one.......


You Comparing the Nature results? Currently Nvidias Nature in 2001 is unoptimised and ATIs is still optimised.. its crappy cuz if you use the older Dets the Nature score rockets about 30 FPS and increases my score like a good 850 points...

jAkUp
03-09-04, 09:18 PM
3dmark01 has never been favorable to NV cards... they always run better on ATI

RobHague
03-11-04, 11:55 AM
Yeah, well i expect 3dmark2003 t run better on ATI hardware, that benchmark i really dont take seriously, but 18k (17990-18100) vs 20k (20850) is quite a difference with 3dmark2001... I trust 3dmark2001 to give a current 'real world' result, that and AquaMark too :) Checking out the comparisons and some of the differences are quite large.... not just the nature demo which is DX8 anyway isnt it?.

bkswaney : I know all about R3xx/NV3x and DX9 :) I but I didnt expect games like Morrowind to suffer with any shader issues on the FX card, its not using DX9 is it?? I mean its an older title so it should be using lower precission and running rather speedy... yet there it is. The 9800 runs perfect, on the FX 5950 it 'stutters' in open area's where shaers seem to be in use (water ect)...

Considering both cards cost the same i thought id try both out as there was no reason not too :).... at first i was doing it just to do a little comparison of my own (reviews i think are too bias one way or the other).

I still have both but im quite liking the 9800xt paired with my CPU... :)

Skinner
03-11-04, 12:44 PM
Rob, run Far Cry demo with cat 4.3 and you will amazed by the perf. I'm like you and tried both cards also, but the XT is so much better.

RobHague
03-11-04, 12:53 PM
FarCry was a reason i decided to try out the XT actually. After the whole PS 1.1 issue i felt a little cheated - I knew DX9 issues existeed but i never thought NV would pull back IQ quality like that to such a degree - £300 for a DX9 card that runs games using DX8 tech.... Like i said i knew and accepted the whole DX9 issue surrounding the NV3x but i was not prepared for that happening in FarCry - Especially as it was a TWIMTBP game and thought they would optimize, opimize optimize to get it running smooth and looking nice....

Anyhow, XT is so far so good..... im getting the Cat 4.3's as they promise performance boosts for TRAOD and Halo (two games i own :D). Looking forward to that....

zoomy942
03-11-04, 01:48 PM
i just went from an fx5700 NU (that i overlokced and scored like an ultra) to an fx 5900 se that i have a little above ultra.. i love it. remember guys, far cry is just a demo. the code isnt totally done yet. try painkiller demo. thats a good indication of nvidia hardware.

jbirney
03-11-04, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by zoomy942
i just went from an fx5700 NU (that i overlokced and scored like an ultra) to an fx 5900 se that i have a little above ultra.. i love it. remember guys, far cry is just a demo. the code isnt totally done yet. try painkiller demo. thats a good indication of nvidia hardware.

zoomy942,

The problem is that its that Pain Killer is not really using Any DX9 features. The Farcry demo uses the following shaders:

58 PS 2.X and 246 PS 1.1 on >= NV35. Not sure about < NV35

108 PS 2.0 and 244 PS 1.1 on R3XX

Kind of a shock to see that difference there. But the point is some of the new games are treating the FX as DX8 cards. So users that bought it wanting DX9 are getting "cheeted" after a fashion. Again your right that its just a demo but so far every thing we have seen has pointed to this effect.....

zoomy942
03-11-04, 03:28 PM
Originally posted by jbirney
zoomy942,

The problem is that its that Pain Killer is not really using Any DX9 features. The Farcry demo uses the following shaders:

58 PS 2.X and 246 PS 1.1 on >= NV35. Not sure about < NV35

108 PS 2.0 and 244 PS 1.1 on R3XX

Kind of a shock to see that difference there. But the point is some of the new games are treating the FX as DX8 cards. So users that bought it wanting DX9 are getting "cheeted" after a fashion. Again your right that its just a demo but so far every thing we have seen has pointed to this effect.....

i didnt know about how it uses diferendt features. but the thing for me is that.. i have seen examples in halo, were directx 8 and 9 were put side by side and they dont seemt hat dfifferent to me.

Skinner
03-11-04, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by zoomy942
i didnt know about how it uses diferendt features. but the thing for me is that.. i have seen examples in halo, were directx 8 and 9 were put side by side and they dont seemt hat dfifferent to me.

Thats because Halo uses at least ps 1.4 for fx cards and maybe ps2 with 16 bits precision? ps 1.4 almost looks as good as ps2 in some cases.

zoomy942
03-11-04, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by Skinner
Thats because Halo uses at least ps 1.4 for fx cards and maybe ps2 with 16 bits precision? ps 1.4 almost looks as good as ps2 in some cases.

oh okay. well in that case, i'm not too worried about what looks better or what ruins better, as long as its smooth on my pc and it looks good. and since they look equally good. woohoo for me

EMunEeE
03-11-04, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by zoomy942
oh okay. well in that case, i'm not too worried about what looks better or what ruins better, as long as its smooth on my pc and it looks good. and since they look equally good. woohoo for me

You are one of the most positive in the middle of road type of pc gamers i have ever seen on a forum...LOL...good for you... :)

fanboys go to hell :p

zoomy942
03-11-04, 04:31 PM
Originally posted by $E Mun$
You are one of the most positive in the middle of road type of pc gamers i have ever seen on a forum...LOL...good for you... :)

fanboys go to hell :p

:lol2: thanks. i just love pc gaming and i love how things have come along, hardware wise.

RobHague
03-11-04, 06:12 PM
Heheh

Yeah Ps 1.1 and 2.0 dont look much different in farcry unless u stop to smell the roses as it were...

I guess it just comes down to accepting less for the same money, if u shell out £300/$300 or whatever for a new top-end graphics card ur going to be a little p***ed when u discover that games carrying the companys 'tag' have had no special optimizations done with them and the game just shunts it back to shaders of yester year...where as the competitions hardware does it fine....

I found out about the 'FarCry issue' just after i got my 5950 btw.... which kinda put me off a bit. :) I love NV products, their drivers rock and the performance is fine. But im not cutting my noise off to spite my face and i built my PC for speed at the expense of cost (although i shoulda got an FX51, the 146 is almost there and HALF the price ;)).....

I just like graphics cards really so i dont mind swoping them out when im in the mood... :D the NV cards are the most impressive though - in terms of hardware for your money. Im hoping the NV40 or R420 are the 'FX 5800 Ultra's' of 2004 :D only without the hover type sound ;)

freak77power
03-11-04, 07:58 PM
Originally posted by Skinner
Well, at least you have complete and new 64 bits videodrivers ;)

Can you run some painkiller (level3 palace ) numbers and Chrome?

Those game are choppy on my XT (1280x1024x32 16 performance AF)

I'm running that level smoothly 1280*1024 AA2x AF8x...

Radeon 9800XT, P4 3.06 RDRAM

bkswaney
03-11-04, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by freak77power
I'm running that level smoothly 1280*1024 AA2x AF8x...

Radeon 9800XT, P4 3.06 RDRAM


I'm running FC demo with 4xAA and 8xAF on in my CP at 1024 res
and it runs smooth on my rig.

RobHague
03-12-04, 08:18 PM
After some comparing i think i should maybe do a quick 'point by point' kinda conclusion. Just because i have nothing better to do like... ;) these are my personal observations btw.

GeForceFX 5950:

PROs
+ Cheaper than the 9800XT by about £30 in the UK....

+ Broad driver base. Any OS u need em for near enough.

+ Driver's are pretty feature packed, the 56.xx that point to ForceWare 2.0 features have to be the best drivers out there ever...

+ Has the RAW power to provide high FPS in well known titles like Quake3

+ Nice varied range of AA modes. Including SSAA.

+ If you have a case window it looks amazing (the reference cooler) pretty much like a 5800 Ultra only without the noise.

+ Fan is silent in 2d Mode, nice feature that is. NVIDIA have a winner with the reduced 2D speeds.. why waste heat and energy when its not needed? We need to see more of this 'scaling' of hardware for each task IMO.

+ Runs cool, the heatsink design we have to thank for that. I get 30*c to 45*c in heavy use and IMO the idea of pumping the air outside of the case is one every card maker should follow.

DOWNs
- Lacks support for NVIDIA's "way" of doing things. If FP16/32 mixed modes were widley accepted then NV would be fine. But they cant keep up trying to "patch" the drivers for every game release that follows the DX9 standard...

- With reference to above, the worrying trend set by FarCry... replacing PS2.0 with 1.1...FORCED.... isnt nice at all. If this is fixed in the final game then hats off to NV and the FarCry team there... but i doubt it somehow this late in its development.

- The benchmarks never seem to match upto the specifications.... with 30gb/s of bandwidth you would imagine the 5950 being AAA class at AA but the XT still wins out.

- Not totally silent, even if it is quiet in 2d mode. 3D Mode is noticable on a quiet system... which is either "cool" or "annoying". ;)

-/+ Uncertain future. If the NV40 differs from the NV38's FP16/32 or as suggested runs FP32 just as fast as FP16 then NV may just drop any optimizations and other attempts with the drivers for NV3x... which would leave people in a bit of a dodgy situation... just a thought...

Radeon 9800 XT:

PROs
+ Excellent performance across the board.

+ Unrivaled AA performance and Quality.

+ Nice driver set, the updates are frequent and show ATI's commitment.

+ Games seem in general much faster than the 5950 even with no AA... if its a game like Halo or Deus Ex then the card does show its hardware advantage when dealing with shader intensive scenes and particle effects... seem to produce less of a performance hit on the 9800..

+ Seem's to excel with DX9 games and makes it look as good as it can. Prolly an indication that this card will still be great with the next generation of games when the R420 and NV40 arrive to steal the limelight.

DOWNs
- ATI tend to ignore the users too often and neglect features people want. Like SSAA and XP 64bit support.

- Fan and clocks are the same speed all the time. Which is a waste of engergy and produces more heat than is needed.

- Overdrive...it only offers 7Mhz over the current core speed, so it seems more like a gimmik than a useful feature. More like ATI got the XT's working fine at 418mhz, then clocked them down to 411mhz so they could add this overdrive feature to set it back to 418mhz and make it look better ;)

- The cooler.... they should take a leaf out of NVIDIA's book and make a cooler that sends the heat outside of the case!! I get idle temps of around 67*c which is just crazy.

Oh and IQ in games to my eyes is great for both cards. I think the whole screenshot comparison debate is taking it too far because you never actually notice any of the small differences when playing actual games. Halo for example looks the same for both and works just as well, so NV's complier does work great sometimes.... but it does sitll seem faster on the XT where things like explosions and lighting effects are concerned...

edited to tidy it up a bit