has theonion hit the nail on the head?

[vampireuk]

linkage (http://www.theonion.com/onion3836/bush_seeks_un_support.html)

I think this sums up the watch out europe here we come thread, and lots of other issues with a touch of humour too:D

[LORD-eX-Bu]

It should be called, "Bush Seeks U.N. Support For 'U.S. Does Whatever It Needs To Do To Protect Itself' Plan".

[netviper13]

Perhaps if the US didn't try so damn hard to be the world hegemon it wouldn't have to 'protect itself'. Honestly now, you can't tell me the US is somehow taking reactionary action against Iraq if Bush gets his bombing campaign. Self protection is a joke.

I agree that The Onion has once again hit the nail on the head. You know, as much of a satirical publication as The Onion is, it's usually quite right in the points its satire makes.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by netviper13
Self protection is a joke.

So, you're supposed to let people beat the hell outta you before you do anything?

[intercede007]

While I do agree that the US has engaged in questionable foreign relations strategy's in terms of dealing with communist and renagade nations, I also know that a country has the responsibility to its citizens to protect them from attack. While Junior isn't going about ANYTHING in a way that is conducive to getting the job done right, the essence of the whole thing is pretty much bulletproof; get rid of the people that want to kill innocent Americans. My great hope is that nothing too drastic happens before election time rolls around. Then we can get someone else in office and do things the right way.

Then again, I say forget the UN if they stand between our boy's and killing the enemy. Instead of making the Americans do all the dirty work (Like making sure UN peacekeepers can get food to the startving masses in Somalia), France can do it next time.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by intercede007
I say forget the UN if they stand between our boy's and killing the enemy. Instead of making the Americans do all the dirty work (Like making sure UN peacekeepers can get food to the startving masses in Somalia), France can do it next time.

Amen. My feelings exactly, you couldn't have said it better.

[DaveW]

I thought The Onion article was great.

The idea of attacking a country just because you consider them a threat is a lousy excuse. The "we are protecting ourselves" argument was used by the Nazis when they gassed all the Jews. It was used by the Japanese when they bombed Pearl Harbor. It was used by Iraq when it invaded Kuwait. It was even used by the Roman Empire.

The UN was created to prevent another world war, but the USA seems about to start one. After Iraq it will be Iran, North Korea, Libya, Syria, many other small countries along the way and eventually China.

All this war talk from Bush makes me very nervous.

[DaveW]

Perhaps if the US didn't try so damn hard to be the world hegemon it wouldn't have to 'protect itself'.

Exactly, when was the last time an Arab nation declared a Jihad against Canada?

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by DaveW
I thought The Onion article was great.

The idea of attacking a country just because you consider them a threat is a lousy excuse. The "we are protecting ourselves" argument was used by the Nazis when they gassed all the Jews. It was used by the Japanese when they bombed Pearl Harbor. It was used by Iraq when it invaded Kuwait. It was even used by the Roman Empire.

The UN was created to prevent another world war, but the USA seems about to start one. After Iraq it will be Iran, North Korea, Libya, Syria, many other small countries along the way and eventually China .... we will probably need nukes for that one, but the US seems to have no problem using them.

Wow, thats got to be one of the worsts post yet. We consider Iraq more than a threat, heck, they tried to assasinate one of our presidents, remember? or did you forget that all of the sudden, they break the sanctions that have been imposed on them, breaking international laws and treaties and nobody does anything about it. Hmmm... that reminds me of when Hitler took over the Sudetenland and Chzekoslovakia. Nobody did anything because they were afraid of starting another war, so they let it go just to appease him. What happened? hitler ended up running their asses all the way to Britain. It was really close, good thing the Brits, Americans and the Russians decided to fight back, unlike the French, Polish, and everyone else. Now then, Iraq is more than a threat, they are a certainty for disaster if anything is not done, they have had four years now, thanks to democrats, to develop their weapons without inspectors. And even before, the weapons inspectors were being toyed with and tricked all the time. You really think that Hussein is gonna let anyone find anything that he doesn't want found in his own country? It is because of democrats that Bin Laden found out that we were listening in to his satellite phone communications. It is because of the democrats that the CIA, FBI, DIA and NSA have been mutilated, castrated and made almost impotent up until this point. We are not just protecting ourselves this time, we are ensuring our very survival by taking this loser out. If the UN is too stupid to see what Iraq is doing and doesn't go in with us, then screw it. Bush already warned NATO that if they don't help with Iraq, the US's role in NATO will change drastically. I say that we should pull out of both the UN and NATO, both have become sissies and just don't do anything that could mean then actually doing something. Instead, they call on the US to go into places that it shouldn't be in, i.e SOMOLIA, BALKANS. The US doesn't need the UN or anyone else to win our wars, if anyone wants to help, they are welcome, if they aren't, fine, but the US will remember that when that country is in need. The UN actually hinders the US's potential, and since we are its largest contributor, I beleive that we should receive more authority and say on what goes on. Even tho our president isn't perfect, I am confident that he will do the right thing and send us into Iraq. Too bad Saudi Arabia is out of the question.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by DaveW


Exactly, when was the last time an Arab nation declared a Jihad against Canada?

When was the last time Canada started watching its immigration? When was the last time an Arab nation really did anything that helped the world?

[DaveW]

not even going to bother replying to your other post...

When was the last time an Arab nation really did anything that helped the world?

ummm world war 2, many of the Arab nations fought the Germans... they get zero credit for it though. And the afghans also fought those "evil commies" on your behalf.

[DaveW]

The US doesn't need the UN or anyone else to win our wars, if anyone wants to help, they are welcome, if they aren't, fine, but the US will remember that when that country is in need. The UN actually hinders the US's potential, and since we are its largest contributor, I beleive that we should receive more authority and say on what goes on.

Oh dear... sounds like a paragraph from the Pax Americana document.

The world does not revolve around America!!!

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by DaveW
not even going to bother replying to your other post...

ummm world war 2, many of the Arab nations fought the Germans... they get zero credit for it though. And the afghans also fought those "evil commies" on your behalf.

Don't appease me.

[netviper13]

Originally posted by |TX|-LORD-EX-BU


When was the last time Canada started watching its immigration? When was the last time an Arab nation really did anything that helped the world?

Jeezum dude, could you possibly be more overtly racist? You may consider Middle Eastern nations as lower class, but I praise them. The United States started what will proably be the end of the world with the development and use of the atom bomb. But being able to destroy the world with atomic radiation wasn't enough, so we had to develop a chemical and biological arsenal large enough to wipe out any organism in our whole damn galaxy. Oh yes, the US has made so many great contributions to the scheme of humanity. :rolleyes:

[intercede007]

Originally posted by DaveW


The idea of attacking a country just because you consider them a threat is a lousy excuse. [/B]

Then what do you condsider a valid reason to go to war? If the fact that a country harbors terrorists and has the capabilities to make weapons of mass destruction (and possibly a stockpile of them?), has attempted assasination of a world leader, and just generally wants to kill Americans, what else is there? Do you remember the poor Kurdish inhabitants of Northern Iraq that Hussein used Nerve gas against? People are STILL dying in infected villiges because of his attacks. Hundreds of thousands of his own countrymen are dying because he has a beef with them. Children are born with horrible birth defects, cancer kills almost everyone that survives, and not to mention the constant battle against starvation and the lack of clean water. If the man is capable of exterminating people in his OWN COUNTRY, what do you think he could do to others? Forget about the US going in there to kick his butt to protect our own, the rest of the world needs to wake up and see just what kind of animal this power-monger really is.

The man has shrugged off the sanctions the world imposed on him the last time he tried to take his toys into another country's sandbox. It's really time that everyone realizes that this man is a sicko, and someone needs to go in and kick him out!!

[DaveW]

Then what do you condsider a valid reason to go to war? If the fact that a country harbors terrorists and has the capabilities to make weapons of mass destruction (and possibly a stockpile of them?),

Ireland meets the same qualifications.

Do you remember the poor Kurdish inhabitants of Northern Iraq that Hussein used Nerve gas against? People are STILL dying in infected villiges because of his attacks.

I remember, and I never said Saddam was a nice guy. But I don't think Bush wanting to invade Iraq has anything to do with helping out the poor Iraqi people.

Besides, didn't the USA test the effects of radiation on its own people (all blacks) by giving them radioactive iron pills?

[intercede007]

Originally posted by netviper13
[B]

The United States started what will proably be the end of the world with the development and use of the atom bomb. But being able to destroy the world with atomic radiation wasn't enough, so we had to develop a chemical and biological arsenal large enough to wipe out any organism in our whole damn galaxy.

I just want you to know that Germany was in development of nuclear weapons right along with the US. If it hadn't been for a successful bombardment of a German heavy-water plant, they quite possibly could have had a mission-ready nuclear weapon for use against other European countries. Also, remember it was defecting GERMAN scientists that got the nuclear weapons and missle projects going in the US. I dare not think what would have happened if Hitler was able to use a nuclear weapon. He had a penchant for new, state of the art weapons and for putting them to use. Anyone recall the V-rocket attacks against London? Yeah...think if one of those bad-boys had a nuclear warhead attached.

M.A.D. : Mutually Assured Destruction. We build up stockpiles of weapons to show other countries that we will win. They build up theirs to show they can counter. Welcome to the Cold War ladies and gentleman. Russia had weapons too, and we didn't build 'um for 'um. The US wasn't the only country in the world capable of sending it to heck in a handbasket.

[The Baron]

OK, Saddam ain't a nice guy. We all agree on that.

Now is NOT the time to take him out, and a full-scale invasion is NOT the way to do it.

Saddam is NOT a threat. Sorry Homes, but he's not. He's got very few missiles (yes, say all you want about underground bases and all that crap, but you'd think that you'd have to ship missile parts to an underground base which could pretty easily be made out via satellite photography). He has chemical weapons and MAYBE bio weapons. But remember, Japanese terrorists have chemical weapons (sarin on a Tokyo subway several years back).

Fix Al-Qaeda. Don't make the rest of the world hate us in the process.

And has anyone else noticed that NO MATTER WHAT the UN or Saddam does, despite our original rhetoric ("We want inspections!" Iraq: "Damnit, fine" US: "No, wait, on second thought, we want to blow up Iraq! YAY!"), we're just going to blow the crap out of them anyway?

Hah.

Turn Saddam into a martyr. That's a fine-****ing-idea.

[intercede007]

Originally posted by DaveW
Besides, didn't the USA test the effects of radiation on its own people (all blacks) by giving them radioactive iron pills?


That was Syphillis in southern Alabama, and don't change the subject, its bad logic skills.

And who cares what Bush's motives are? For all the misguided ones he may have, there are several darn good ones.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by netviper13


Jeezum dude, could you possibly be more overtly racist? You may consider Middle Eastern nations as lower class, but I praise them. The United States started what will proably be the end of the world with the development and use of the atom bomb. But being able to destroy the world with atomic radiation wasn't enough, so we had to develop a chemical and biological arsenal large enough to wipe out any organism in our whole damn galaxy. Oh yes, the US has made so many great contributions to the scheme of humanity. :rolleyes:

Hmm... I guess I am a racist now? I never said that I considered Middle Eastern nations lower class, don't put words in my mouth, I am an IMMIGRANT! Thanks for your stupidity. Anyways, I guess you forgot about all the vaccines that we have come up with, I guess you don't appreciate the fact that you are not crippled or even alive. You can thank our country for that, and please, think before you post son.

[netviper13]

Sadam is not a nice guy, but Bush isn't wanting power to bomb Iraq just to get him out of power. Bush obviously doesn't care about the Iraqi people, or we would have lifted the sanctions that kill over 1 million Iraqi civillians annually. Imagine that, we get all pissy over 3,000 one time, and they have to live with 1 million ever freaking year. The sanctions won't even let Iraq import the chemicals necessary to purify water.

If any action takes place, it should be a quick hit with a Special Forces team like the SEALS or Delta Force; not the bombing campaign that Bush would run. Not that I think it would do any good though.

[The Baron]

Anyways, I guess you forgot about all the vaccines that we have come up with

Both the US and the Soviet Union worked for years to mix ebola and smallpox--that much is known. Did they succeed? Nobody's really sure. But do you honestly think they have a vaccine for that? THAT is the real killer. That actually has the possibility to wipe out 95% of humanity.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by =SSC=The Baron
OK, Saddam ain't a nice guy. We all agree on that.

Now is NOTAnd has anyone else noticed that NO MATTER WHAT the UN or Saddam does, despite our original rhetoric ("We want inspections!" Iraq: "Damnit, fine" US: "No, wait, on second thought, we want to blow up Iraq! YAY!"), we're just going to blow the crap out of them anyway?

Hah.

Turn Saddam into a martyr. That's a fine-****ing-idea.

It was the democrats that asked for inspections, even went as far as wanting military action, Sadam lied, and nothing happened. Now that there is a republican president in office asking for the same thing, democrats are refusing, hmm... double standard?

[The Baron]

Two Bush quotes to ponder, btw...

After all, this is the guy who tried to kill my dad.

Okay... yeah, fantastic. He was President, people usually try to assinate Presidents. JFK, Fidel, Yitzhak Rabin, Lincoln... it happens.

Fool me once, shame on... .... .. shame on you. Fool me twice.... wontgetcantgetfoolmeagain.

Yeah. This guy's our President.

Aw crap.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Originally posted by netviper13
Sadam is not a nice guy, but Bush isn't wanting power to bomb Iraq just to get him out of power. Bush obviously doesn't care about the Iraqi people, or we would have lifted the sanctions that kill over 1 million Iraqi civillians annually. Imagine that, we get all pissy over 3,000 one time, and they have to live with 1 million ever freaking year. The sanctions won't even let Iraq import the chemicals necessary to purify water.

If any action takes place, it should be a quick hit with a Special Forces team like the SEALS or Delta Force; not the bombing campaign that Bush would run. Not that I think it would do any good though.

Those 1 million a year, where did they come from? anyways, the Iraqi people suffer due to the fact the Hussein takes all the funds that come in to help the people and puts them into the development of weapons and military. So don't try and shift the blame.