Nvidia could have been demonstrating nV40 "16 pipes" to "selected groups"

[Brick_Top]

Look at this posts:

The Baron wrote:
Yeah, see. There's working 16-pipe NV40 silicon. Devrel has apparently been sending out benchmarks of the new chip, too.



the Baron wrote:
No, I'm not using the existence of PR benchmark scores as the proof of the actual sillicon's existence.



The Baron wrote:
That David Kirk has been travelling and giving demonstrations of the NV40 to selected developers (and I think a few members of the press)? I doubt that such presentations would be possible if there was no NV40 silicon; I can't imagine NVIDIA telling developers how cool and fast NV40 will be after they did exactly that with NV30, which everyone remembers.


PaulS wrote:
Because there have been presentations since the 16 pipe news broke.

Worth noting that the bench numbers Baron mentions could be nothing more than guesstimates, but similarly they could be based on actual figures they've gotten. Really no way of knowing at this point. Certainly not unusual for IHVs to let developers know of the performance ballparks.


PaulS wrote:
Definitely been presentations to select groups, silicon or no silicon. Quite close to home, you could speculate :cool:


MrGaribaldi wrote:

Reverend wrote:He actually performs these tasks? Gosh. I woulda thought there's a solid DevRel dept at NVIDIA...


But wouldn't sending Kirk out lend more credibility to what they're saying, since I would guess most Dev's are taking everything Nvidia says about their nextgen card with a pinch of salt.
Ie. A dev thinking "This DevRel guy says the NV40 will rock and blow ATI out of the water. But that's what he said about the NV30 in 2002, so why should I believe him?" compared to "Man, Kirk says the NV40 will rock and blow ATI out of the water. Had it been a DevRel guy I might not have believed it, but Kirk should know..."




http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10845&start=60&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

[nForceMan]

There will be a presentation at GDC 2004 as well.

[zakelwe]

Anand's weblog said yesterday

" It's just one of those weeks where everything is due. I'll be freer after Thursday, and yes that long promised Macdate is coming. "

So Anandtech must have been reviewing something this week in preparation for first day of Cebit, AMD FX 53 ? Ati / Nvidia ? He says everything is due so it might be more than one thing.

Maybe an FX 5500 bench on Thursday :)

Regards

Andy

[Paul]

Baron made the "silicon exists" assumption based on what I told him, and it was just that - an assumption, at best. The presentations have definitely taken place, however.

Doesn't look as though the silicon was at those presentations though - the early ones at least. Not sure about the most recent ones.

[MUYA]

Originally posted by Paul
Baron made the "silicon exists" assumption based on what I told him, and it was just that - an assumption, at best. The presentations have definitely taken place, however.

Doesn't look as though the silicon was at those presentations though - the early ones at least. Not sure about the most recent ones.

got any more intersting stuff then?

/me slips Paul a nV News Forum $1000 note!

:naughty:

I wonder how many samples they do have that are well final speced etc?

Or do u think they are still working on the specs?
memory is well 1ghz (ddr) or more..but core clock is I presume taking extra amount of qualifying?

so paul, mainstream of nv4X gen will have 8 pipelines ?? I hope so! :D been stuck with the 4xa thing for too long :D

Mainstream cards should be able to deliver at least AA and AF as well instead of having to turn them off for the games to come...maybe

[zakelwe]

Do you ever go to bed Muya ? :D

I'd be quite interested to know, if the nv40 is 16x1, why nvidia chose to go from their somethingx2 format to apeing Ati with somethingx1

I thought the twin textures was supposed to be quite good for current highly textured games ?

Regards

Andy

[MUYA]

Originally posted by zakelwe
Do you ever go to bed Muya ? :D

I'd be quite interested to know, if the nv40 is 16x1, why nvidia chose to go from their somethingx2 format to apeing Ati with somethingx1

I thought the twin textures was supposed to be quite good for current highly textured games ?

Regards

Andy

LOL yes I do :D I am in Hong Kong mate! ;) Thats why it probbaly seems I am always on? :D

yeah multi texturing is nifty! erm I think. Maybe the 16X1 can re-arange itself to a 8X2.. as they aren't really a strict rigid pipeline with TMUs if I read right what the tech boyz have been saying. Instead its about qorking on quads....and that maybe its me talking out of me butt. Paul or Mufu can enlighten us on that. Still the radeon with 8X1 did all right on multi textured games like F1 challenge 99-02 ..speaking from experience

[Dazz]

I heard the NV40 was going to be an 8x1 part but then they heard ATI was doing an 12x1 so they have scrapped the NV40 or make it a cheap part and move onto the NV45 which is a 16x1.

[rwolf]

Originally posted by MUYA
LOL yes I do :D I am in Hong Kong mate! ;) Thats why it probbaly seems I am always on? :D

yeah multi texturing is nifty! erm I think. Maybe the 16X1 can re-arange itself to a 8X2.. as they aren't really a strict rigid pipeline with TMUs if I read right what the tech boyz have been saying. Instead its about qorking on quads....and that maybe its me talking out of me butt. Paul or Mufu can enlighten us on that. Still the radeon with 8X1 did all right on multi textured games like F1 challenge 99-02 ..speaking from experience

I think Mufu has been talking out of his butt too. Unless of course the R420 has eight pipelines.

[Geforce4ti4200]

the r420 is gonna need 12 pipes and higher clocks than the nv40 or itll get badly owned

[Evildeus]

Nv40 is already shown at Cebit :)
http://www.hardware.fr/news/lire/18-03-2004/Nous avons cependant pu voir tourner un exemplaire de leur prochaine génération de GPU.

[Paul]

Originally posted by Geforce4ti4200
the r420 is gonna need 12 pipes and higher clocks than the nv40 or itll get badly owned

Yeah?

[Real_Nforce_Man]

Originally posted by Geforce4ti4200
the r420 is gonna need 12 pipes and higher clocks than the nv40 or itll get badly owned

Rumors, rumors, rumors

[vampireuk]

Originally posted by Real_Nforce_Man
Rumors, rumors, rumors

Bye bye goofer

[MUYA]

Originally posted by vampireuk
Bye bye goofer

I 2nd that

[zakelwe]

Originally posted by Paul
Yeah?

Well, owned in 3dmark and aquamark we think ( both me and Gf4ti200 think )

Well what about games I hear you say, well to be honest 100 fps v 60 fps doesn't make much difference when you are running about shooting ..so it's all bragging rights on sped in benches is it not ?

The IQ is what is important in games, ie AA in this case and also bandwidth. nvidia will have top bandwidth but Ati will make better use of their reduced bandwidth, so it depends on nvidia's new AA ...

Regards

Andy

[vampireDE]

Originally posted by zakelwe
Well, owned in 3dmark and aquamark we think ( both me and Gf4ti200 think )

Well what about games I hear you say, well to be honest 100 fps v 60 fps doesn't make much difference when you are running about shooting ..so it's all bragging rights on sped in benches is it not ?

The IQ is what is important in games, ie AA in this case and also bandwidth. nvidia will have top bandwidth but Ati will make better use of their reduced bandwidth, so it depends on nvidia's new AA ...

Regards

Andy

Ati will improve it's AA. So forget about the NV40. It's crap.

[Paul]

Where are all the 1 post trolls coming from?

[Geforce4ti4200]

Originally posted by Paul
Where are all the 1 post trolls coming from?



huh? I only saw one troll who got banned for saying "rumors, rumors rumors"


" nvidia will have top bandwidth but Ati will make better use of their reduced bandwidth"


ati's core does not need as much bandwith and it does not benefit very much from alot of bandwith either. Nvidia may be more bandwith hungry though. I still am very curious about clock speeds, as far as we know, the r420 will be 450/900 while the new nv40 will be 550/1200 so if the new nv40 is 16 pipes, it will totally dominate, ati's refresh, the r450 will also be 16 pipes and higher clocks to get closer to the new nv40

[vampireNL]

Originally posted by Paul
Where are all the 1 post trolls coming from?

Please refrain from any insults...:rolleyes:

BTW: Nice avatar. Bit depressed it seems?

[OWA]

Yeah, it's a little annoying. They're hitting all the threads.

[-=DVS=-]

Adding pipes and shrinking core can go only so far , how mutch longer till we have full tile based cards , only then we gonna have real monster cards ;)

PowerVr is sleedping i guess :(

[ragejg]

no, not sleeping... ;)

http://tinyurl.com/yrrvo

[Toaster]

Originally posted by Geforce4ti4200
huh? I only saw one troll who got banned for saying "rumors, rumors rumors"


" nvidia will have top bandwidth but Ati will make better use of their reduced bandwidth"


ati's core does not need as much bandwith and it does not benefit very much from alot of bandwith either. Nvidia may be more bandwith hungry though. I still am very curious about clock speeds, as far as we know, the r420 will be 450/900 while the new nv40 will be 550/1200 so if the new nv40 is 16 pipes, it will totally dominate, ati's refresh, the r450 will also be 16 pipes and higher clocks to get closer to the new nv40

~550 core for the nv40 might be pushing it a bit ;) 500 if they are lucky. as for r420, I'd guess they'll get higher clock speeds than nv since it uses far less transistors.

[gstanford]

The probable reason nVidia has gone for a 16x1 setup over an 8x2 is because thisgives them an advantage when pixel shading.

With 16x1 you can do 16 pixel shading ops per cycle, with 8x2 you can only do 8.

Thats about the only advantage. If you ignore GF-FX pixel shading performance, it keeps up with r300 quite nicely in most other situations (multi-texturing). Given that Pixel shading is the most glaring weakness of nVidia's current chips its only natural that they want to comprehensively address it with the next gen.