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Brian3DGPU
04-15-04, 11:54 AM
Just for fun, I installed the 6800 Ultra into my BioStar IDEQ 200T SFF system last night and ran a couple of loops of 3DMark03 just to see what would happen. As I understand it, if the card wasn't getting enough power, I would get a message stating so from the drivers. I did not get that from boot, or during testing.

The scores I got were consistent with what I should get with a P4 3.2, around 11950marks, and it seemed to run fine. I will be doing some more in-depth testing over the next few nights and I talked to my contacts at NVIDIA to see what they had to say and they are going to look into it as well.

That is one hell of a 200watt PS if it works...

EMunEeE
04-15-04, 11:56 AM
Just for fun, I installed the 6800 Ultra into my BioStar IDEQ 200T SFF system last night and ran a couple of loops of 3DMark03 just to see what would happen. As I understand it, if the card wasn't getting enough power, I would get a message stating so from the drivers. I did not get that from boot, or during testing.

The scores I got were consistent with what I should get with a P4 3.2, around 11950marks, and it seemed to run fine. I will be doing some more in-depth testing over the next few nights and I talked to my contacts at NVIDIA to see what they had to say and they are going to look into it as well.

That is one hell of a 200watt PS if it works...

LOL...coo, what other components did you have in there? You can send it to me and I can test it in my rig... :p

Brian3DGPU
04-15-04, 11:57 AM
Full rig stats....

Biostar IDEQ 200T
P4 3.2GHz Processor
1GB Corsair RAM
250GB Maxtor SATA Hard Drive
52x Plextor CD/RW
6800 Ultra

Blacklash
04-15-04, 11:58 AM
A man truly on the line for the consumer,

Good show. The 480 rec probably is a bit overboard. That being said I needed to upgrade my PSU anywho.

Let us know how this developes.

Brian3DGPU
04-15-04, 12:00 PM
A man truly on the line for the consumer,

Good show. The 480 rec probably is a bit overboard. That being said I needed to upgrade my PSU anywho.

Let us know how this developes.

I am not worried about the 6800U, it will just throttle down the GPU...I am worried about the HD...Oh well, it's under warranty

I will torture test it tonight and log the PS Rails using Motherboard Monitor and see what happens...

stncttr908
04-15-04, 12:02 PM
I'll be eagerly awaiting these torture test results!

Cheers.

Brian3DGPU
04-15-04, 12:11 PM
Any EE's here able to tell me how a 200watt PS can push theses systems...check these out Tom's Power Consumption graphs (http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040414/geforce_6800-19.html) .

The 9800XT uses more on idle and not much less under load. How can these small PS do it?

MUYA
04-15-04, 12:22 PM
Brian whats the funny (burning) smell coming out of yer SFF PC? :p

Face Stabber
04-15-04, 12:28 PM
Oh man! If you have a digital camera, could you take a picture of the opening BIOS of the card when you start up your computer? And would you possibly comment on this (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=300606#post300606) thread?

Brian3DGPU
04-15-04, 01:10 PM
Commented on in that thread....I happen to think that they first spun silicon on the cards and then binned them for the 6800 and non ultra and since these are A1 revs, they just put them on the same pcb's...

JAV
04-15-04, 05:30 PM
Nice Brian. :cool:

Plz keep this thread updated w/your voltage readings, PSU rails, etc. as it is being read by many ppl all across the web. :super:

I'm particulary inrerested in which rail(s) has the highest draw in GPU intensive (3DM03?) & GPU/CPU intensive apps (Farcry?). 12v, 5v &/or 3.3v. If you could check Intel vs AMD (swap the PSU into an AMD rig) that would be icing on the cake. :thumbsup:

Thanx for your efforts.

JBark
04-15-04, 05:35 PM
Any EE's here able to tell me how a 200watt PS can push theses systems...check these out Tom's Power Consumption graphs (http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040414/geforce_6800-19.html) .

The 9800XT uses more on idle and not much less under load. How can these small PS do it?


If you look at his numbers, his power supply has a 69% efficiency rating.
288 Watts * 0.69 = 198 Watts of power provided by the power supply during peak load.

Look at that, a whole 2 watts to spare :) It could be that the 200W figure quoted on the power supply is low. As long as you keep the supply cooled, it sure work ok under high loads. But if the temps start going up, the effic

Now I've got a question:
Can you put the cover on the 200T while the 6800U is installed? If I remember right, in the Biostar boxes the AGP slot is the innermost slot, which is opposite the setup on a shuttle box. I don't care if it actually works with the cover on, just wondering if it actually fits.

Geforce4ti4200
04-15-04, 05:39 PM
strange, you may be overloading it by 200% is it true some psus can be overloaded for short periods of time? I killed my 350w psu when I oced my cpu far, it overloaded the psu!

GlowStick
04-15-04, 06:00 PM
This dosent really suprize me much!

muzz
04-15-04, 07:47 PM
Those switching transistors must be roasting.
Either that is a very well made supply ( heatsinks- overkill transistors), or it must be ready to burst....
And probably would after awhile..
100 W is alot of power ( 110W MAX. is what toms mentioned NV quoted) to dump on a 200W supply......

Of course for short durations it will probably handle it just fine, but I wouldn't run it like that all the time thats for sure.

Brian3DGPU
04-16-04, 07:54 AM
Ok guys...I ran 3Dmark03 for almost 11 hours last night. I checked the log of the rails this morning. The 12v was running 11.5, within spec. the 5v at 4.7, barely out of spec, and the 3.3 at 2.7, which is definitely out of spec. HOWEVER, I checked older logs, and the rails have been running at close to the same levels with a 9800 Pro as well. No burning smells, or anything else. The PS is warm, but doesnt seem to be any hotter than it ran with the 9800 Pro. I was looking at GlowSticks sig, and he is running a 9800 Pro AIW in his Shuttle which has a 200-250watt PS on it. I have to believe it draws a ton of power as well, if a 9800 Pro alone draws almost as much as the 6800U as stated in Tom's charts.

I do have the case cover on, and the IDEQ series do have the AGP slot on the inside vs. the outside like the Shuttles, one of the reasons I went with a BioStar.

Also, my case is modified. The right hand panel (not the side with the vid card) is almost all plexi, and has an 80mm blowhole with a fan running at half speed using a resistor, so I am bringing a large amount of extra cool air into the case.

I am continuing to loop it today, and if it is still going strong tonight, I asm going to try and use this as is, and play some games and see how it does. Some rounds of UT2004 and BF: Vietnam should let me know how the stability is in RL.

Give me your ideas and suggestions and I'll keep everyone updated.

poursoul
04-16-04, 09:04 AM
this certainly puts my mind more at ease about the whole power issue.

Riptide
04-16-04, 09:27 AM
Agreed. Maybe it's a whole lot of nothing to worry about then.. My 430W truepower should do the trick even w/my SCSI drives with any luck.

GlowStick
04-16-04, 06:53 PM
Ok guys...I ran 3Dmark03 for almost 11 hours last night. I checked the log of the rails this morning. The 12v was running 11.5, within spec. the 5v at 4.7, barely out of spec, and the 3.3 at 2.7, which is definitely out of spec. HOWEVER, I checked older logs, and the rails have been running at close to the same levels with a 9800 Pro as well. No burning smells, or anything else. The PS is warm, but doesnt seem to be any hotter than it ran with the 9800 Pro. I was looking at GlowSticks sig, and he is running a 9800 Pro AIW in his Shuttle which has a 200-250watt PS on it. I have to believe it draws a ton of power as well, if a 9800 Pro alone draws almost as much as the 6800U as stated in Tom's charts.

I do have the case cover on, and the IDEQ series do have the AGP slot on the inside vs. the outside like the Shuttles, one of the reasons I went with a BioStar.

Also, my case is modified. The right hand panel (not the side with the vid card) is almost all plexi, and has an 80mm blowhole with a fan running at half speed using a resistor, so I am bringing a large amount of extra cool air into the case.

I am continuing to loop it today, and if it is still going strong tonight, I asm going to try and use this as is, and play some games and see how it does. Some rounds of UT2004 and BF: Vietnam should let me know how the stability is in RL.

Give me your ideas and suggestions and I'll keep everyone updated.
Great results, we need to get your test more published, because people are still spreading FUD.

But only one thing, im actually useing a enermax 350W powrsupply on my PVR machine, never had a single problem with it, i even usto run Dual Athlon MP's off it, and those suck power like there is no tomrow : ) that was with 3 hard drives too heh, one of them scsi.

SuLinUX
04-16-04, 07:01 PM
Yes it's like the old and still suggestion that you need a 400WATT PSU for a new CPU, what BS. Nvidia fueling PSU sales?

JAV
04-16-04, 07:39 PM
Ok guys...I ran 3Dmark03 for almost 11 hours last night. I checked the log of the rails this morning. The 12v was running 11.5, within spec. the 5v at 4.7, barely out of spec, and the 3.3 at 2.7, which is definitely out of spec. HOWEVER, I checked older logs, and the rails have been running at close to the same levels with a 9800 Pro as well. No burning smells, or anything else. The PS is warm, but doesnt seem to be any hotter than it ran with the 9800 Pro.

Give me your ideas and suggestions and I'll keep everyone updated.

Thnx again Brian. :)

That +5v rail looks suspect. W/a 9800Pro in my AMD rig & a cheap 400w PSU my +5v ran ~4.84v & stability was awful. AMD's use the +5v rail more than the 12v rail like Intel rigs do & a low +5v rail is a stability killer, IME.

The 12v @ 11.5v is passable & I'll bet the 2.7v you get for your +3.3v rail is actually vdimm. There are a number of mobo's that read that way & I wouldn't be surprised if the BioStar is one of them.

I take it you're not overclocking &/or running more than stock voltages, seeing as how it is an SFF. I think I can imagine if you increased vcore, vagp, vdimm & clocked the card up some. ;) 3DM03 while it is very GPU intensive (I know the purpose is to see what the card can run on) it isn't taxing the CPU & other components. Gaming for hrs might show a different result in stability.

While your particular setup is running a 6800U w/a 200W PSU & nV 'recommends' a 480W > maybe a 'middle ground' is more realistic for a gaming rig + a little more if the user is overclocking? :eek2:

:smoking:

Kihlberg
04-17-04, 05:18 PM
Hey Brian, I might have missed it, but have you tried running the card with only one 4pin cable connected?

jAkUp
04-17-04, 05:54 PM
If it runs good on a 200W, why does NV recommend a 480? Strange...

Diamond_G
04-17-04, 06:25 PM
pure speculation, but they could be holding back real clock speeds.... it has been posted that some card makers are "overclocking" their ulra parts, but something tells me that the ultra we were shown might have been underclocked.... otherwise nvidia would have had no real reason to use 2 molex connectors and tell us to get 480watt psu's...

Nutty
04-17-04, 06:26 PM
I have an enermax 350. My voltages according to my mobo monitor are;

+5 @ 5.00
+3.3 @ 3.3
+12 @ 11.6