ATI's west coast design team is far better than the east coast one

[lokeshray]

We all knw that ATI has 2 design teams.

West coast team
1.mostly former artx employees
2.developed the gamecube flipper chip(or something like that)
3.developed the r300
4.was working on r500 or is still working on r500(not sure)

East coast team
1.little or no artx employees
2.developed the original radeon, the radeon 8500
3.located at Marlborough, Mass
4.was working on r400, now working on r500(not sure)

with the east coast team,the r400 was cancelled. The performance of the radeon and radeon 8500 was good but not good enuff,
on the other hand, with the west coast team, the gamecube did work well.
the r300 was a runaway success.
we can see that the west coast team has a better track record.

the east coast team seems to prefer adding features to a graphics card tht seem awesome on paper, but no one will want to use
.for example, the original radeon had 3 texture units per pipe
the radeon 8500(r200) had a hardware truform unit.
no one wants to use the hardware truform unit.
there are hardly 3 or 4 games that use truform.
truform is a waste of transistors.
if truform wasnt implemented, then the radeon 8500 would have had a shorter development time. die space would have been saved. since the number of transsistors would have been much lesser, ATI could have clocked the r200 at 300-325 mhz, bringing it almost on par with the geforce 4 ti series.

was it the same habit that led to the demise of r400?
according to my knowledge, the purchase of artx roughly took place a short while after the purchase of 3dfx.
clearly, artx was the better buy.

now, ati is part of the xbox2 project as well as the gamecube project.
they r making motherboards.
as well asgraphics processor for mobile phones.
along with tv chips..
several refreshes are being released...the r300 had 2 refreshes,
the radeon had only one
the radeon 8500 had no refresh.
with so much work to do, it is unlikely that 2 design teams are enough.
ATI has to have more than 2 design teams.

the same team that worked on a particular architecture has to work on its refreshes.
the west coast team was busy with r360 till q4 2003
ithe team that made the rv350/360 is the same team that has designed the r420

[Geforce4ti4200]

I think omitting ps 3.0 in the r420 is a wise choice despite what some think otherwise. sure its not as useless as trueform, but there is not enough importance in ps 3.0 to implement it just yet. Instead, ati's card has 50m less transistors than nvidia plus higher clocks

[***CENSORED***]

From what I heard the East Coast team has always been working on the r500.

[austincraig23]

i dont know... since games are NOW using ps3.0 aka farcry.... not having this and only being 96 percision is not helping me go ati at all.

kinda reminds me of the old 3dfx trying to say 32 bit color is unwanted.

all nvidia has to do is market this and show that current games are using it and its going to be hard to convince someone to go ati.

if we all just waned speed we would turn off AA, and reduce color to 8 bit.
but we dont.

so speed is no longer as important as it used to be.

[retsam]

i thought p.s 3.0 was more effciant then p.s 2.0...and is easier to code and impliment in games then ps.20. this is why more developers are jumping right on that bandwagon so early in the game... no .....

[lokeshray]

From what I heard the East Coast team has always been working on the r500.

then r500 is doomed

[bkswaney]

I hate for a company to try and cover there non support by saying it's not worth it bla bla bla.

[tazdevl]

then r500 is doomed

Nothing worse that a kid commenting on business topics he knows nothing about.

I still have yet to see anything that vaguely borders on proof or a logical point worth discussing.

FYI not all ArtX employees are in Santa Clara. A fair bunch dispersed to other offices... Mass, Marham Ont etc...

[-=DVS=-]

i dont know... since games are NOW using ps3.0 aka farcry.... not having this and only being 96 percision is not helping me go ati at all.

kinda reminds me of the old 3dfx trying to say 32 bit color is unwanted.

all nvidia has to do is market this and show that current games are using it and its going to be hard to convince someone to go ati.

if we all just waned speed we would turn off AA, and reduce color to 8 bit.
but we dont.

so speed is no longer as important as it used to be.

Actually no game uses it yet , not even FarCry you need DirectX 9.0c for it work ... (mag)

[eesa]

is it just me or does anyone else find the topic of this thread extremely arrogant?

[Clay]

I suppose so, sort of *shrug*. Considering that you worked for ATI (or perhaps still are) that may have something to do with your take on this. I found the initial post interesting (if it's all true that is) but that's about it. :)

[-=Gib-McFragger=-]

is it just me or does anyone else find the topic of this thread extremely arrogant?

Nope, just you :retard: :angel2:

[volkskrant]

then r500 is doomed

:rofl

[volkskrant]

Nope, just you :retard: :angel2:

You just pissed someone off
:angel2:

[Dazz]

i dont know... since games are NOW using ps3.0 aka farcry.... not having this and only being 96 percision is not helping me go ati at all.

kinda reminds me of the old 3dfx trying to say 32 bit color is unwanted.

all nvidia has to do is market this and show that current games are using it and its going to be hard to convince someone to go ati.

if we all just waned speed we would turn off AA, and reduce color to 8 bit.
but we dont.

so speed is no longer as important as it used to be.Not really 3DFX said the peformance cost was too great at the moment besides 3DFX's cards used 24bit colour. Sure it was a form of 16bit but i can tell you it looked a hell of alot better then ATi's or nVIDIA's 16bit rendering a hell of a lot better.

[eesa]

Yeah.. maybe I'm a little biased..

I would have to disagree with the accuracy of a lot of the content that's posted here, but that wasn't why I finally replied. This is after all the rumor mill so I couldn't care less if ppl spit out BS that they don't know anything about.

It's just something about criticizing a person or a group of people that you would do well to achieve half as much as they did in your lifetime. If I was an expert in ASIC architecture and design, then perhaps I might venture to make such a comment. Otherwise, it's it more like some dumb ignorant kid trying to say that the special theory of relativity is garbage and einstein is an idiot. Of course I'm exaggerating here, but I'm just hoping you get the gist of what I'm talking about? Basically, I don't like to criticise someone if I could be put to shame with a simple "lets see you do better"

and no, I'm from canada, there's really nothing you can do to me to p!ss me off. Not online in a forum anyway. How shallow do you think I am? ;)

[eesa]

You just pissed someone off
:angel2:

Nah, gib is still bitter from the time I laid the smack down on him in UT... :spank:

or was it the other way around... I don't remember ;)

[-=Gib-McFragger=-]

Nah, gib is still bitter from the time I laid the smack down on him in UT... :spank:

or was it the other way around... I don't remember ;)

Hrm, I think you pwnd me at UT, but then I wasn't trying. :kill: :retard:

[Clay]

Yeah.. maybe I'm a little biased..

I would have to disagree with the accuracy of a lot of the content that's posted here, but that wasn't why I finally replied. This is after all the rumor mill so I couldn't care less if ppl spit out BS that they don't know anything about.

It's just something about criticizing a person or a group of people that you would do well to achieve half as much as they did in your lifetime. If I was an expert in ASIC architecture and design, then perhaps I might venture to make such a comment. Otherwise, it's it more like some dumb ignorant kid trying to say that the special theory of relativity is garbage and einstein is an idiot. Of course I'm exaggerating here, but I'm just hoping you get the gist of what I'm talking about? Basically, I don't like to criticise someone if I could be put to shame with a simple "lets see you do better"

and no, I'm from canada, there's really nothing you can do to me to p!ss me off. Not online in a forum anyway. How shallow do you think I am? ;)
This is an excellent post eesa. Seriously, I'm not being sarcastic. I think this is something that every new forum member should read before being allowed to post...and even then I think we should all read it once or twice a year just to check ourselves. Once again, very nice post!. :) :clap2: