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oqvist
04-23-04, 07:38 AM
Because it was let down by it's shader performance and now people seem to think based on that, the R420 will be faster than the NV40, which is not the way to look at it at all.

And why not? It´s always easier to build on a good design then reinvent the wheel? Of course it´s easier for the one with less hardware to look what the opponent is doing and copy their work but that inself isn´t enough to actually surpass them.

For example look at the 6800 ULTRAS antialiasing and anisotrophic. Suspiciously similar to ATI:s. Coincidence? The structure of the NV40 has a lot more in common with the R300 structure than the NV30. Coincidence?

Seeing that ATI have had superior shaders since the 8500 what says that the 6800 ULTRA would outperform it?

Of the same reason most and even ATI themself thought the NV30 would outperform the R300 according to some stories I read based on what nVidia delivered in the past.

It´s much more reasonable to think the R420 will outperform the NV40 than the other way around if you look at where they where technology wise.

And yes The Inquirer was quite accurate on the NV40 why not on the R420 ;)

Me I will think the R420 will outperform the NV40 in general sense but I would never preorder it without seeing it in action of course.

SuLinUX
04-23-04, 07:19 PM
People talk as if ATI's shader perfomance is built in stone to be the fastest and nvidia simply could'nt beat it. If the opposition is "blazzingly" fast then lets make them think ours is faster, even though we have no proof. :rolleyes:

nobie
04-23-04, 07:43 PM
People are forgetting the advantage that ATi has in more VS units. This will play a LARGE part in future games a well.


Actually both NV40 and R420 have 6 VS units. But R420 will be clocked higher, and Nvidia uses the VS units for some extra work besides just VS, so R420 should still have an advantage in VS.

retsam
04-23-04, 11:10 PM
Nvidia uses the VS units for some extra work besides just VS, so R420 should still have an advantage in VS. i thought there wasnt any abuse of the vs units ???? i thought dave at b3d had cleared that up ??

oqvist
04-24-04, 09:09 AM
People talk as if ATI's shader perfomance is built in stone to be the fastest and nvidia simply could'nt beat it. If the opposition is "blazzingly" fast then lets make them think ours is faster, even though we have no proof. :rolleyes:

No but if you have the lead in technology you always have a head start with the next video card ;)

nvidia have to work harder than ATI to catch up ;)

oqvist
04-24-04, 09:10 AM
i thought there wasnt any abuse of the vs units ???? i thought dave at b3d had cleared that up ??

nvidia use them for creating some extra pipelines too for z stencil operations I have heard.

Spiritwalker
04-24-04, 01:19 PM
Actually both NV40 and R420 have 6 VS units. But R420 will be clocked higher, and Nvidia uses the VS units for some extra work besides just VS, so R420 should still have an advantage in VS.

AFAIK the 420 has 2 VS units per quad meaning that the 4 quad one will have 8 total. But that could be wrong. We will have to see.

oqvist
04-24-04, 02:29 PM
hopefully we will know the 26th of April...

SuLinUX
04-26-04, 01:40 PM
If ATI pull out a lead on the 6800 as people 'claimed' then they will shorly get a pat on the back from me, but I would'nt buy one because of there piss poor driver support in Linux.

Brick_Top
04-28-04, 05:20 AM
So you are assuming ATI will not increase the shader speed in the R420? :angel2:

If Mufu comments are right the x800xt should be around 100% faster than the 6800 under some shader situations. :)

volkskrant
04-28-04, 12:20 PM
If Mufu comments are right the x800xt should be around 100% faster than the 6800 under some shader situations. :)
:drooling:

halduemilauno
04-29-04, 10:08 AM
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=15617

:) :)

zakelwe
04-29-04, 12:17 PM
If Mufu comments are right the x800xt should be around 100% faster than the 6800 under some shader situations. :)


Is that when nvidia is running 8xAA and Ati is running 4xT AA ?

Regards

Andy

SuLinUX
04-29-04, 12:22 PM
If Mufu comments are right the x800xt should be around 100% faster than the 6800 under some shader situations. :)

You do understand your dreaming dont you. :lol2:

Dazz
04-29-04, 01:48 PM
Yeah you are right..... if NV's cheats an't disabled http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/lol2.gif