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Jarred
05-17-04, 04:11 PM
LAtely I've been more of an Intel proc buyer, I've got 5 machines between my wife an I with Intel procs in them, and we've been very happy with them,

I'm going to get a new computer in june, and was considering an AMD, because I hear they're better running most games, but...I do a lot of Maya/Lightwave rendering too, so I need something thats kinda good at both.

then theres also PCI express, ...when will procs and mobo's come out that support PCI express and does the Nv40 support it?

I was also wondering, doesn't Nvidia make motherboards? (i've already decided on the nv40 becasue of the Maya driver support) if so, whats a good one?

I just don't want to rush out and buy everything now if next gen stuff is like a month away, I'd like to time it all so I get PCI express support.

I'm looking to spend roughly 2200 on a new machine around June....

Harnagel
05-17-04, 07:04 PM
I believe that the Athon64 is pretty good at rendering, that would be your best bet if you want to go AMD. I would wait a little bit though, as the 939 pin procs should be coming out soon and they will be dual channel(right now Opteron is dual channel but it requires regestered memory). Dual channel tends to help out the AMD64 architecture in rendering from what I've seen so go Opteron or wait for the 939 pin Athlon64.

Yes, nvidia makes chipsets and they're very good, especially the NForce3 250 Pro. When the 939 pin Athlon 64 comes out there should be motherboards supporting PCI-Express, if I'm not mistaken.

So, basically, in couple months everything should come together.

Jarred
05-17-04, 07:10 PM
I believe that the Athon64 is pretty good at rendering, that would be your best bet if you want to go AMD. I would wait a little bit though, as the 939 pin procs should be coming out soon and they will be dual channel(right now Opteron is dual channel but it requires regestered memory). Dual channel tends to help out the AMD64 architecture in rendering from what I've seen so go Opteron or wait for the 939 pin Athlon64.

Yes, nvidia makes chipsets and they're very good, especially the NForce3 250 Pro. When the 939 pin Athlon 64 comes out there should be motherboards supporting PCI-Express, if I'm not mistaken.

So, basically, in couple months everything should come together.

sweet thats what I'm hoping for... :)

Cota
05-17-04, 11:00 PM
AFAIK not nvidia, nor via or AMD have plans to release PCI express chipsets for at least a year or until AMD releases an Athlon64 with DDR2 support.

Still, the athlon 64 is a great choice for games and rendering applications, and will get much better once Windows 64bit is released.

Viral
05-18-04, 06:15 AM
The A64 is actually quite good in Lightwave, definitely performs to it's rating.

When the 939pin dual channel unbuffered A64's hit i think that performance should mimmic that of the current FX's.

{Sniping}Waste
05-18-04, 11:13 AM
AFAIK not nvidia, nor via or AMD have plans to release PCI express chipsets for at least a year or until AMD releases an Athlon64 with DDR2 support.

Still, the athlon 64 is a great choice for games and rendering applications, and will get much better once Windows 64bit is released.
SiS already has a PCI express chipset so I think it will come out when the S939 come out.

Jarred
05-18-04, 01:46 PM
hmmm....when will we see the benifits of PCI express?

and when will windows 64 come out? !!?

because if were gonna see PCIexpress benifits before windows 64 I'll go with Intel, but if not I think I'm going with AMD this time...

and where can I find differences between the A643400 and the 64fx ?

Gator
05-18-04, 02:35 PM
Well you can download WinXP64 for free right now, but it's still in beta. Personally I'd just stick with WinXP regular for now. And don't worry it runs great on the Athlon64. And yes Athlon64 runs all games and applications excellent. About the only thing P4 marginally does better is encoding video with Intel codecs, but that doesn't make A64 slow at it by any means.

And as far as Athlon64 vs FX... FX doesn't appear to be worth it. Just overclock your A64 to or near FX levels and it's just as good ;). And even without the overclock, a stock speed A64 of ANY rating is plentyfast for everything out there... you can't lose :)

And PCI-E does not impress me considering hardly anything takes advantage of the bandwidth AGP8x provides. Just take a look t AGP4x vs AGP8x benchmarks and you'll see what I mean, it only seems to benefit you at REALLY REALLY high resolutions with high textures.

Jarred
05-18-04, 02:48 PM
okay and now the last question, whats a good nvidia motherboard for the 3400?

Gator
05-18-04, 03:56 PM
okay and now the last question, whats a good nvidia motherboard for the 3400?

GIGABYTE "GA-K8NS PRO" nForce3 250 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754 CPU

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=13-128-241&depa=1

Jarred
05-18-04, 04:07 PM
GIGABYTE "GA-K8NS PRO" nForce3 250 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754 CPU

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=13-128-241&depa=1

SWEET, thanx a bunch dude.

Jarred
05-18-04, 04:46 PM
are they planning on releasing a new mobo before june 15tH?

Gator
05-18-04, 05:40 PM
are they planning on releasing a new mobo before june 15tH?

no clue... I mean socket939 is expected soon, but no definite date on that yet. If I had to guess I'd say no, it won't be out before June 15, but I'm just not sure. The only advantage of the socket939 version is it had dual channel memory support. The socket754 does not. It's not a big deal, but it's worth mentioning.

However socket754 Athlon64's do have one advantage, the 3200 & 3400 models have 1meg L2 cache. The socket939 versions will only have 512K L2 cache.

Jarred
05-18-04, 07:18 PM
no clue... I mean socket939 is expected soon, but no definite date on that yet. If I had to guess I'd say no, it won't be out before June 15, but I'm just not sure. The only advantage of the socket939 version is it had dual channel memory support. The socket754 does not. It's not a big deal, but it's worth mentioning.

However socket754 Athlon64's do have one advantage, the 3200 & 3400 models have 1meg L2 cache. The socket939 versions will only have 512K L2 cache.

sweet, thanx again dude.

jAkUp
05-18-04, 08:52 PM
I thought the K8T800 was a better overall motherboard?
http://www.abit.com.tw/page/en/news/newspop.php?pDOCNO=en_0405041

|JuiceZ|
05-18-04, 10:38 PM
I thought the K8T800 was a better overall motherboard?
http://www.abit.com.tw/page/en/news/newspop.php?pDOCNO=en_0405041

It was the best overall for the "first" generation socket 754 boards, now NF3 250GB is the king of "second" gen with all its added features. The K8T800 Pro (Via's followup chipset) is by far no slouch though.

btw, guys stay away from that particular gigabyte board, its missing many of the features that make the nForce3 250 chipset great, mainly hardware firewall. Matter-of-fact, that may not even be the plan model not the nForce3 250 "Gb" which would explain it. Wait for MSI & ASUS' K8N mb's.

btw, for all you guys waiting for socket 939 mb's, make sure you're ready to drop some serious cash down for an a64 FX-- proc to go w/ it. Think I'll settle for a 3200+ (1meg cache) & single channel setup.

Jarred
05-18-04, 11:37 PM
It was the best overall for the "first" generation socket 754 boards, now NF3 250GB is the king of "second" gen with all its added features. The K8T800 Pro (Via's followup chipset) is by far no slouch though.

btw, guys stay away from that particular gigabyte board, its missing many of the features that make the nForce3 250 chipset great, mainly hardware firewall. Matter-of-fact, that may not even be the plan model not the nForce3 250 "Gb" which would explain it. Wait for MSI & ASUS' K8N mb's.

btw, for all you guys waiting for socket 939 mb's, make sure you're ready to drop some serious cash down for an a64 FX-- proc to go w/ it. Think I'll settle for a 3200+ (1meg cache) & single channel setup.

still no news as to when the 939's are commin out? cause man I've been savin for this machine since last year, money is becoming abundant.

Gator
05-19-04, 06:38 AM
It was the best overall for the "first" generation socket 754 boards, now NF3 250GB is the king of "second" gen with all its added features. The K8T800 Pro (Via's followup chipset) is by far no slouch though.

btw, guys stay away from that particular gigabyte board, its missing many of the features that make the nForce3 250 chipset great, mainly hardware firewall. Matter-of-fact, that may not even be the plan model not the nForce3 250 "Gb" which would explain it. Wait for MSI & ASUS' K8N mb's.

btw, for all you guys waiting for socket 939 mb's, make sure you're ready to drop some serious cash down for an a64 FX-- proc to go w/ it. Think I'll settle for a 3200+ (1meg cache) & single channel setup.

Alright, my bad, I didn't realize the Gigabyte did not have the builtin firewall. But if you have a seperate hardware firewall like me, and are running BlackICE in the background too, then this should be of no concern. I do know for a fact that the Gigabyte does have a working AGP/PCI lock so thats the important thing: someone at Rage3d is overclocking their A64 3200 2ghz to 2.3ghz! And he's even had it as high as 2.4ghz! That's a damn fine overclock, so this Gigabyte Nforce3 250 is not a bad board. Socket939 will mean big bucks, so I think the A64 + Gigabyte NF3 250 is still your best bet. But if you really want that dual channel memory, then I estimate socket939 to be released in the US by the end of June into July.
Here is a review of a socket 939 motherboard to be released in Japan by the end of this month (http://www.cooltechzone.com/reviews/motherboards/mobonewsstory_003.php). It's not an Nforce3 250 though, I definetly beleive you should look for NF3 instead of VIA.

|JuiceZ|
05-19-04, 08:45 AM
Alright, my bad, I didn't realize the Gigabyte did not have the builtin firewall. But if you have a seperate hardware firewall like me, and are running BlackICE in the background too, then this should be of no concern. I do know for a fact that the Gigabyte does have a working AGP/PCI lock so thats the important thing: someone at Rage3d is overclocking their A64 3200 2ghz to 2.3ghz! And he's even had it as high as 2.4ghz! That's a damn fine overclock, so this Gigabyte Nforce3 250 is not a bad board. Socket939 will mean big bucks, so I think the A64 + Gigabyte NF3 250 is still your best bet. But if you really want that dual channel memory, then I estimate socket939 to be released in the US by the end of June into July.
Here is a review of a socket 939 motherboard to be released in Japan by the end of this month (http://www.cooltechzone.com/reviews/motherboards/mobonewsstory_003.php). It's not an Nforce3 250 though, I definetly beleive you should look for NF3 instead of VIA.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that its a bad board and some ppl are reporting good o'cs with it, just want to keep in mind that it is the "non-gb" version so feature-wise it will be a bit lacking. Also might wanna check out some comments (http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=29&threadid=1309007&enterthread=y) from Anand's review.

From everything I've read, still recommend Asus, Epox & MSI's K8N mbs for enthusiasts, especially since they like to cater specifically to o'cers. btw, latest reports are late May to mid-June for those boards be availible in US (mag)

Jarred
05-19-04, 03:14 PM
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that its a bad board and some ppl are reporting good o'cs with it, just want to keep in mind that it is the "non-gb" version so feature-wise it will be a bit lacking. Also might wanna check out some comments (http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=29&threadid=1309007&enterthread=y) from Anand's review.

From everything I've read, still recommend Asus, Epox & MSI's K8N mbs for enthusiasts, especially since they like to cater specifically to o'cers. btw, latest reports are late May to mid-June for those boards be availible in US (mag)

you got a link to any of the boards you recommend?

Hari Seldon
05-20-04, 03:47 AM
Well, if you aren't in a hurry, I'd recommend waiting until autumn.
Then I'd get a computer with a BTX compliant case/mobo.

Also, if you want a really powerful workstation/gaming rigg, buy a dual Opteron system.

If you don't want to spend as much money on a workstation, you might consider an ordinary Athlon 64 (socket 939), or a dual workstation with only 1 cpu, and add the second later...

Hari Seldon
05-20-04, 04:37 AM
you got a link to any of the boards you recommend?
A good place to find info and reviews of computer equipment is Neoseeker (http://www.neoseeker.com/Hardware/index.html)

Gator
05-20-04, 05:33 AM
Well, if you aren't in a hurry, I'd recommend waiting until autumn.
Then I'd get a computer with a BTX compliant case/mobo.

Also, if you want a really powerful workstation/gaming rigg, buy a dual Opteron system.

If you don't want to spend as much money on a workstation, you might consider an ordinary Athlon 64 (socket 939), or a dual workstation with only 1 cpu, and add the second later...

BTX means he'd need a whole new case, the A64 already runs very cool so it wouldn't be necessary anyway, and since it's Intel that's pushing the BTX movement it's debateable if we'll see any AMD variants of the BTX for awhile. So I think waiting for BTX would be bad advice. :nono:

Hari Seldon
05-20-04, 05:59 AM
BTX means he'd need a whole new case, the A64 already runs very cool so it wouldn't be necessary anyway, and since it's Intel that's pushing the BTX movement it's debateable if we'll see any AMD variants of the BTX for awhile. So I think waiting for BTX would be bad advice. :nono:
Because he's buying a new computer, he might as well buy a BTX compliant computer. However, you might be right that it only concerns Intel, but as it's the mobo manufacturs and case manufacturs that decides that, they might start making AMD mobos in BTX format, so they don't have to support 2 different standards.

I haven't really looked into it, but I don't think AMD have to do any changes for their cpu's to be able to be BTX compliant.

Gator
05-20-04, 03:38 PM
Because he's buying a new computer, he might as well buy a BTX compliant computer. However, you might be right that it only concerns Intel, but as it's the mobo manufacturs and case manufacturs that decides that, they might start making AMD mobos in BTX format, so they don't have to support 2 different standards.

I haven't really looked into it, but I don't think AMD have to do any changes for their cpu's to be able to be BTX compliant.

But what I'm saying is he'd have to wait even LONGER for an AMD BTX board probably. BTX for Intel isn't even available for sale yet, let alone BTX for AMD which will likely take a little longer. So what I'm saying is why wait when the Athlon64 really doesn't need the benefits of BTX anyway.