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UDawg
06-28-04, 04:21 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/26/opinion/26BROO.html

All Hail Moore

By DAVID BROOKS

Published: June 26, 2004

n years past, American liberals have had to settle for intellectual and moral leadership from the likes of John Dewey, Reinhold Niebuhr and Martin Luther King Jr. But now, a grander beacon has appeared on the mountaintop, and from sea to shining sea, tens of thousands have joined in the adulation.

So it is worth taking a moment to study the metaphysics of Michael Moore. For Moore is not only a filmmaker; he is a man of ideas, and his work is based on an actual worldview.

Like Hemingway, Moore does his boldest thinking while abroad. For example, it was during an interview with the British paper The Mirror that Moore unfurled what is perhaps the central insight of his oeuvre, that Americans are kind of crappy.

"They are possibly the dumbest people on the planet . . . in thrall to conniving, thieving smug [pieces of the human anatomy]," Moore intoned. "We Americans suffer from an enforced ignorance. We don't know about anything that's happening outside our country. Our stupidity is embarrassing."

It transpires that Europeans are quite excited to hear this supple description of the American mind. And Moore has been kind enough to crisscross the continent, speaking to packed lecture halls, explicating the general vapidity and crassness of his countrymen. "That's why we're smiling all the time," he told a rapturous throng in Munich. "You can see us coming down the street. You know, `Hey! Hi! How's it going?' We've got that big [expletive] grin on our face all the time because our brains aren't loaded down."

Naturally, the people from the continent that brought us Descartes, Kant and Goethe are fascinated by these insights. Moore's books have sold faster there than at home. No American intellectual is taken so seriously in Europe, save perhaps the great Chomsky.

Before a delighted Cambridge crowd, Moore reflected on the tragedy of human existence: "You're stuck with being connected to this country of mine, which is known for bringing sadness and misery to places around the globe." In Liverpool, he paused to contemplate the epicenters of evil in the modern world: "It's all part of the same ball of wax, right? The oil companies, Israel, Halliburton."

In the days after Sept. 11, while others were disoriented, Moore was able to see clearly: "We, the United States of America, are culpable in committing so many acts of terror and bloodshed that we had better get a clue about the culture of violence in which we have been active participants."

This leads to Michael Moore's global plan of action. "Don't be like us," he told a crowd in Berlin. "You've got to stand up, right? You've got to be brave."

In an open letter to the German people in Die Zeit, Moore asked, "Should such an ignorant people lead the world?" Then he began to reflect on things economic. His central insight here is that the American economy, like its people, is pretty crappy, too: "Don't go the American way when it comes to economics, jobs and services for the poor and immigrants. It is the wrong way."

In an interview with a Japanese newspaper, Moore helped citizens of that country understand why the United States went to war in Iraq: "The motivation for war is simple. The U.S. government started the war with Iraq in order to make it easy for U.S. corporations to do business in other countries. They intend to use cheap labor in those countries, which will make Americans rich."

But venality doesn't come up when he writes about those who are killing Americans in Iraq: "The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not `insurgents' or `terrorists' or `The Enemy.' They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow — and they will win." Until then, few social observers had made the connection between Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and Paul Revere.

So we have our Sartre. And the liberal grandees Arthur Schlesinger, Ted Sorenson, Tom Harkin and Barbara Boxer flock to his openings. In Washington, a Senate vote was delayed because so many Democrats wanted to see his movie.

The standards of socially acceptable liberal opinion have shifted. We're a long way from John Dewey.

Perhaps inspired by Moore, I got a fact wrong in my previous column. Bill Clinton did not win the evangelical vote in 1992 and 1996. I had relied on a report that was later corrected.

evilchris
06-28-04, 04:24 PM
Champion of the left, Michael Moore. He obvsiouly HATES America. But he'll take your money! Good job moviegoers! This one is specifically FOR the moviegoers and ticket buyers, and anyone who supports this world class asshole:

They are possibly the dumbest people on the planet

Clay
06-28-04, 04:26 PM
In Washington, a Senate vote was delayed because so many Democrats wanted to see his movie.:eek: Man, that speaks volumes...what a bad sign.

I'd say the same if the movie were "The Passion of Christ" or "Saving Private Ryan"...the topic of the movie is irrelevant.

evilchris
06-28-04, 04:29 PM
Remember, in all those speeches abroad, he is talking about AMERICANS, not the right or left. Thats what he thinks of his countrymen whom he just made some nice change off of. Nice!

DivotMaker
06-28-04, 04:30 PM
He obvsiouly HATES America.

Well, it is not like he is an American...he is a Canadian.

evilchris
06-28-04, 04:31 PM
Yes, but he profiteers in and lives in America. Why doesn't he GET THE HELL OUT? Oh....I remember why... we support his lavish lifestyle!

DivotMaker
06-28-04, 04:34 PM
1. Yes, but he profiteers in and lives in America.

2. Why doesn't he GET THE HELL OUT?

3. Oh....I remember why... we support his lavish lifestyle!

1. Yeah, that is one thing that burns my arse about this moron.

2. I would give anything to show him the way...

3. Not a freaking penny from me....EVER.

UDawg
06-28-04, 04:36 PM
But venality doesn't come up when he writes about those who are killing Americans in Iraq: "The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not `insurgents' or `terrorists' or `The Enemy.' They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow — and they will win." Until then, few social observers had made the connection between Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and Paul Revere.

Glad he wants our side to win.

evilchris
06-28-04, 04:44 PM
The left will say that he is being "patriotic" though... right? Dissenting from the government? Yeah, going around the world enraging and further aligning foreigners against us is PATRIOTIC and SUPPORTIVE of your country! It HELPS us!

His statements about the Iraq insurgency though...hm. Those statements can possibly be considered treason. Supporting the enemy is flat out illegal, period.

Riptide
06-28-04, 04:45 PM
I was wondering that myself steeda. Could you make a case for sedition there with his statements about them being minutemen?

netviper13
06-28-04, 04:49 PM
Just propose to the man already! You people on the right, for how much you say Moore doesn't matter, sure seem to spend quite a bit of time attempting to discredit him. That means, essentially, you're giving weight to his arguments. And by whining, crying, or even cracking jokes, you all have helped propel Michael Moore to the top!

His books couldn't have sold the copies they did without your help causing all the controversy, his movies wouldn't have earned a whole lot either. There is a liberal fanbase in this nation that already felt the way expressed by all of Moore's content, so he certainly wasn't writing and producing for them.

So, in my first and last post to grace the threads with Moore love than others, I would just like to say thanks. Thanks for helping make Michael Moore the famous man he is! I salute you. (salute)

UDawg
06-28-04, 04:53 PM
That means, essentially, you're giving weight to his arguments.

No it doesn't. You cannot just sit and let this type of propaganda go by with out a counter argument. His film right now is too big to just let go with out answering it. Putting up a counter argument is different than just boycotting the film.

Active debate is how you persuade people to your idea. If no one said anything about Moore then they would just take what he said as the truth.

I don't mind if Moore is on top at selling his movie. If he make a butt load of money then more power to him. I want to have a answer to his film. I don't want to stop anyone from watching it but only to bebate the ideas with in it to persuade them Moore is lying.

So basically you have NOTHING to say about the article. That is called thread crapping. I challenge you to tell me that Moore is patriotic and loves America by the quotes in this article.

Jarred
06-28-04, 04:55 PM
There's no such thing as bad publicity.

Ninja Prime
06-29-04, 12:11 AM
But venality doesn't come up when he writes about those who are killing Americans in Iraq: "The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not `insurgents' or `terrorists' or `The Enemy.' They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow — and they will win." Until then, few social observers had made the connection between Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and Paul Revere.

Wait wait wait, so right in the middle of all his crying and bitching and moaning about "our poor soldiers dying" he's saying he supports the people killing them and hopes they win? WTF? FFS, I wish this was 1942, he would be deported (or worse) for such bullsh*t. :mad:

evilchris
06-29-04, 12:14 AM
There's no such thing as bad publicity.

What about Abu Graib

UDawg
06-29-04, 12:16 AM
Oh that one kinda hurt. Ya had to bring that one up eh.

Se-Rag
06-29-04, 12:57 PM
Well, it is not like he is an American...he is a Canadian.

Micheal Moore is an American...
Taken from his website.

Q: My wife is convinced you're Canadian. I say you're American. Which is it?
A: People often think I'm Canadian, probably because of Canadian Bacon. Lots of people also seem to think my name is Roger Moore. Well, I'm not Canadian, and, sadly, I'm not James Bond either. I'm just an all-American Michigan kid, and proud of it. Sure, Canada has a lot to teach us--universal health care, lower crime, funny accents--and Canadians are great to work with, but the nearly deceased Bald Eagle on the American quarter is always going to be cooler than the beaver on the Canadian nickel.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/faq/

vampireuk
06-29-04, 01:02 PM
Come on guys we all know he is French

DivotMaker
06-29-04, 04:42 PM
Micheal Moore is an American...
Taken from his website.

I do not believe a word he says. Plus, my source is somewhere OTHER than his website...

Saint Lucifer
06-29-04, 04:46 PM
I guess you know his place of birth better than he.

DivotMaker
06-29-04, 06:03 PM
I guess you know his place of birth better than he.

No, I am saying according to official documents, he is a liar. :rolleyes:

UDawg
06-29-04, 06:08 PM
All I know is that Moore was not born in Flint Michigan. He potrays him self as if he was but that is Moore for you. Trying to be something he isn't

Rakeesh
06-29-04, 08:30 PM
Speak of that, in the whole bowling for columbine movie, I could only make one strong conclusion with everything he showed: only whackos are raised in Flint Michigan.

He revealed in that movie that himself, the columbine shooters, and two other nutcases were raised there.

netviper13
06-30-04, 02:11 AM
All I know is that Moore was not born in Flint Michigan. He potrays him self as if he was but that is Moore for you. Trying to be something he isn't

Do you have proof of that? Real, actual proof; not some guy spouting off on his theory website.

sytaylor
06-30-04, 02:44 AM
"We Americans suffer from an enforced ignorance. We don't know about anything that's happening outside our country.

I'd say thats true, and again an example of how every now and then he sparks up with quite a socialogical issue. To call Americans stupid as a result is unfair, to call a nation idiots is again unfair. To back it up with half truths and emotive edited versions of events *is* stupid...