Do you believe in stronger gun control?

[nin_fragile14]

With the recent sniper attacks, a lot of my relatives and friends have been discussing a need for tougher gun control. But do you really think "gun control" would have stopped this man from doing what he's doing?

[Smokey]

Well I guess this is mainly for people of the US? I think the clamping down as such maybe a little too late IMO. You have a law "the right to bare arms"!! You dont have to go to a gun shop, any shop will do they all sell guns dont they? :rolleyes: Im sure there is a waiting period and all, but these guns make it into the wrong hands as we all know. Guns are always going to be a problem I think, just like drugs!!

[vampireuk]

You can get rid of the majority of guns unlike drugs however. To say the recent sniper killings dont call for new gun controls is pure ignorance.

[intercede007]

For every freedom there is, there are going to be whacko's that use it for a purpose other then it was intended for. The framers of the constitution knew it would be quite some time before America could muster a powerful, standing army, so they allowed militia's and private citizens to bare arms for protection of themselves and the fledgling nation.

While the average citizen DOES NOT need an M-16 to protect himself anymore, hand guns will do, and rifles are still used for hunting purposes.

Sick individuals will find a way to carry out their fantasy's. Look at Ted Kaczynski. Lowes and Home Depot provided his ammunition, and for 5 dollars the United States Postal Service would deliver it to the poor souls doorstep or office. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

[Feanor]

Originally posted by intercede007
Sick individuals will find a way to carry out their fantasy's. Look at Ted Kaczynski. Lowes and Home Depot provided his ammunition, and for 5 dollars the United States Postal Service would deliver it to the poor souls doorstep or office. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

If people didn't have guns, they could turn to bomb making and blowing up buildings. I know it sounds harsh, and I'm not un-sympathetic with people having died, but there are other weapons this snipper could have chosen to use which could have inflicted at least as great a death toll. Making a dirty bomb is also something that doesn't necessarily take a lot of know how to complete. Then there's always a what if the person who mailed anthrax around had access to some other virus... Guns are only one weapon some can (and have) employed.

Also, the forefathers might have also been thinking, should the people ever need to protect themselves from a government. Remember, the Bill of Rights was written only a few short decades after the American Revolution...

[styles-T]

Originally posted by intercede007
Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Yes sir. I must agree.

[nin_fragile14]

Originally posted by vampireuk
You can get rid of the majority of guns unlike drugs however. To say the recent sniper killings dont call for new gun controls is pure ignorance.

Drugs are illegal, but does that stop people from getting them? And why would guns be any easier to get rid of than drugs? Look at the millions of guns available and used in third world countries. We can not control any of that, just like we can't with drugs.

I'm sure he would have gotten the guns with or without gun control.

[vampireuk]

Thats a bit short sighted, imagine how much gun crimes would go down if guns were made Illegal and everyone turned them in. This guns dont kill people crap is complete BS, no one has a need for a gun full stop. Criminals will always get a hold of them but over in England where they are illegal shootings where innocents are hurt are very rare now. Its all well and good saying "well it would happen anyway" but that kind of attitude is the damn problem in the first place.

[fishlung]

If you haven't seen the movie Bowling For Columbine (http://www.michaelmoore.com/), you're missing out!

[saturnotaku]

OMFG, I love Michael Moore. I adored TV Nation - that was a hell of a show. Too bad Bowling is only playing in downtown Chicago or else I'd see it. :(

[The Baron]

I think that if rifles were made illegal, things would be a lot better. Yes, it kills hunting. Sorry. The sniper ain't using an AK-74, he's not using a fancy sniper rifle that he stole from the Marines, he's using a standard hunting rifle.

Now, the thing about gun registration--DUH! Why NOT?! Gun locks? Once again, WHY NOT?!

I don't think we need to get rid of guns altogether since there will always be some way to get arms (and sorry Brits, it's a hell of a lot easier to get illegal goods into the US than it is into Britain--we border other countries :p ). But, we do need to have ways to crack down. People with serious mental illness can buy guns even though it is illegal for them to because their medical records cannot be released, making it impossible for those who issue gun permits to know if someone has a serious mental illness (thank you, 60 Minutes! ;) ).

The gun lobby needs to realize that hey, you're not going to need to defend yourself from a hostile government (unless you don't support the war on Iraq, but that's another story altogether... :rolleyes: ). You MAY need to defend yourself or your family from an intruder or mugger or something. A handgun would do fine. But you don't need a hunting rifle or an assault rifle to defend your family.

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by =SSC=The Baron
You MAY need to defend yourself or your family from an intruder or mugger or something. A handgun would do fine. But you don't need a hunting rifle or an assault rifle to defend your family.

But the King of England could show up at my door at any minute! :p

[PsychoSy]

I see your point, Vamp, but I don't think making guns illegal and forcing citizens to turn them in is the right thing to do. If guns were illegal in the US, only outlaws would have guns, and many law abiding Republicans and Democrats would gladly keep their guns and wear the outlaw badge with honor. I don't blame them.

Right now, I have trouble with some Americans who think it would be cool to sue Smith & Wesson, Mossberg, or any gun manufacturer all because of The Beltway Sniper. Neither I, anyone else, or the gun makers are responsible for the actions of this idiot. Period. I mean...that idea makes about as much sense as suing Ford & Budweiser because of the drunk drivers.

When it comes to guns and gun control, I'm convinced the conservative Republicans are right - that cracking down on guns totally would throw this country right back into "prohibition" days, and those weren't good days at all.

As for Micheal Moore, the man is brilliant! :D I loved TV Nation back in my teens (the theme kicked ass) and I can't wait to see what he's got in store with us with this movie. True, many people think he's a political idiot. He even looks like a dullard, but those people are usually the ones that would feel ashamed to admit that he often makes great points that can't be ignored. :p

[jnd3]

"More Guns, Less Crime"

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0226493644/qid=1035221678/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-6558480-4322266?v=glance

"The past century was one of barbarism and mass murder, one in which the world stood by while large populations were exterminated by governments bent on power and possessed of the means of killing."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,65889,00.html

"The United Nations issues statistics on worldwide crime rates through the UN Interregional Crime and Justice Bureau Institute. The figures available on their website showed a few surprising things. For example, you are more likely to be burgled in Canada or England than you are in the United States. You are also more likely to be assaulted or sexually assaulted. In fact, England and Wales are shown to be far ahead of the rest of the western world in terms of overall violent crime."

http://www.unicri.it/icvs/statistics/index_stats.htm

The moral of the story: evil people are going to be evil no matter what laws are passed. I'd rather have guns in the hands of both the "good guys" and the "bad guys" rather than just in the hands of the "bad guys"...

Later,
JND

[intercede007]

I hate Charlot Heston and the zealots in the NRA, but I do agree with one thing he said. During a speech, he held a rifle in his hands and said to the gun control lobbyists "Out of my cold, dead hands!!!". No one will ever convice me that I don't have the right to keep my Glock 36 next to my bed to protect myself.

Hunting is a harmless sport unless you are a deer. Banning rifles is not the way to keep criminals from killing people.

Jeffrey Dahmer didn't use a gun.
Ted Kaczynski didn't use a gun.
Wayne Williams didn't use a gun.
Ted Bundy didn't use a gun.
The Green River Killer didn't use a gun.

Williams, Bundy and the Green River Killer account for approximatly 80 killings between them.

I think its more important to focus on WHY these people did these horrible things, and how to correct that then to go out and ban guns and hope nobody is ever murdered again.

[Darth Rancid]

I don't think tighter gun control would stop maniacs like "the sniper". We had a sniper of our own here in Sweden about ten years ago, and guns are definetely illegal here. (He sniped immigrants, hitting about ten people before the police caught him, as I remember it, all but one of the victims survived.)

BUT, since "innocent" people here doesn't have guns, those criminals who have them does not feel a need to "shoot first and ask later." Because of this, nearly all gun related deaths here are criminals shooting each other. And believe it or not, guns are comparably rare among criminals here as well... since there are so few of them in our society, even they can't get hold of them easily.
I saw a hospital documentary on TV some time ago, where they said that gunshot wounds are so rare in Sweden that we have no way to train our doctors to treat them here. Our doctors get sent to the US to see and learn how to treat gunshot wounds... :)

If there were less guns in the US, there'd be less people shot, I'd say... It seems to work that way when you compare statistics from different countries. (No, I don't have a link to any current statistics right now.)

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by madthumbs
Our Government kills more people. Gun control gives government more control. Less gun control would make us all safer believe it or not.

safer from what exactly?

[vampireuk]

Originally posted by saturnotaku
But the King of England could show up at my door at any minute! :p

Would you want the King of england walking in here and shoving you around? would you?!:D

[saturnotaku]

I remember reading something that says Canada has more guns per capita than any other nation, yet their incidents of death by guns is infintismally small compared to the US.

I don't pretend to have answers to this problem, but I'm certain tighter gun control isn't one of them.

[outriding9800]

I think they should have people take an IQ / responsiblity test before you have the right to own a gun.

NOTHING pisses me off more when i go hiking and see a 100 year old tree, signs or whatever shot to hell.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

Yeah, I beleive in stronger gun control. I want my kids to be safe and I don't want to have to worry about them accidentally finding my gun and getting shot. I don't want another kid to shoot my kid, and I don't want some idiot who shouldn't have a gun to be able to get one and terrorize the community. I think that people who aren't responsible with their weapons should be held accountable to the full extent of the law if their weapon is used in a negligent manner or stored for that manner. The NRA half of me tho really wants to keep my guns. I like them all, and I wouldn't give them up ever, I keep them safe but I don't want to be left unarmed or vulnerable, as the police aren't that good at preventing crimes. If anyone comes into my house trying to harm those that dwell within it, I can assure you, they won't be walking out, at least under their own power. But I really do understand and see the need for stronger gun control and background checks. If someone opposses that, then they obviously have something to hide.;)

[fishlung]

Saturn, Psychosy, you guys will really dig Bowling For Columbine. It's a film that he's managed to make funny, powerful and touching all at once, not to mention raising great questions. Michael Moore is just awesome. I also love his book Stupid White Men... And Other Sorry Excuses For The State Of The Nation.

In the film, I believe they mentioned the various statistics for gun-related killings in several countries in 2001. I think Canada had about 20 or 30. The United States had over 11,000 (one of the only major countries with over a few hundred!). And yes, tons of people in Canada own guns and actively use them at ranges and for hunting. But they don't kill each other with them on a daily basis. And nobody can figure out why the U.S. has such huge numbers in this respect. But a good point is brought up, the idea that we are conditioned by the media and our government to fear, and that leads to a lot of bad things. Anyway... see the film. It's worth a drive.

[PsychoSy]

Originally posted by outriding9800
I think they should have people take an IQ / responsiblity test before you have the right to own a gun.

NOTHING pisses me off more when i go hiking and see a 100 year old tree, signs or whatever shot to hell.

I'll drink to that!! :)

If your IQ is at or below room temperature, a gun is the LAST thing you need! :p

[thcdru2k]

stronger gun control would help, but their's always the illegal part of things, where if you got the money, you can get anything you want. if someone wants to kill someone, and say they don't pass a iq test or whatever, they can still get a gun with the money.

[sbp]

No surprise that with this latest rounds of sniper attacks, rumbles about banning more guns are being heard. Can you say politicizing and taking advantage of a sad situation? http://www.pcabusers.net/forums/images/icons/headshaker.gif

Over the years in the DC area its been made harder for citizens to exercise their 2nd amendment right. Its funny, criminals commit acts and citizens pay the price and are less able to defend themselves. Does this make sense? Heck no.