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MrWho
07-30-04, 06:00 PM
Hello there.

I'm in the process of buying an MSI K8N Neo Platinum with an AMD64 3000+. I've been advised about the "fact" that this particular chipset (nForce3) had some troubles a couple of months ago, but the person who advised me admited he didn't know anything about its current status.

I really don't remember anything about this. Can someone shed some light on this? Could he be making any confusion with other chipset? Did the NF3 really had some troubles in the past and are they solved now? And, if so, can someone tell me some links about it?

Thanks.

Underzenith
07-30-04, 06:40 PM
I have this motherboard with a Athlon 64 3200. It is useable if you don't plan on a massive overclock. It works perfectly with a BFG 6800 GT with everything on.

There are a few minor annoyances:
-- Power light bug (power light likes to turn itself off)
-- Misreported Temperatures (about 20C too high, kicks stock cooler to 5500 rpm sometimes)

I would recommend you to consider another motherboard if you can. You shouldn't have to put up with these problems for that much money.

Riptide
07-30-04, 06:46 PM
Hmmm... They haven't fixed these problems? I wonder what the skt939 version is going to be like then (MSI Neo)..

Underzenith
07-30-04, 07:02 PM
Normally, I wouldn't mind the misreported temps, except its turning cool n' quiet into cool n' loud.

|JuiceZ|
07-31-04, 12:31 AM
There are a few minor annoyances:
-- Power light bug (power light likes to turn itself off)
-- Misreported Temperatures (about 20C too high, kicks stock cooler to 5500 rpm sometimes)

Update your bios, temp problem has been fixed for weeks but the power LED bug still exists.

Also I'm not sure what you mean by a massive o'c but there's several ppl running @ 2.6Ghz & higher w/ water cooling & HTT above 250mhz.

MrWho
07-31-04, 05:44 AM
Thanks for your feedback. But the person who told me mentioned the problem affected the nForce3 in general and not this board in particular. You guys know anything about it?

I'm inclined in buying this mobo, since I always trusted MSI and I believe that all the bugs related to this specific mobo are going to be corrected.

Riptide
07-31-04, 08:03 AM
I recall reading something a while back about how Abit had planned on not producing an nforce3 board due to instability with the chipset. I don't know where they were coming from there though as I haven't heard much from actual users that the nforce3 250 is a unstable POS.. Maybe Abit's engineers were on crack?

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/mainboards/display/20040610112501.html

Underzenith
07-31-04, 09:41 AM
I am not having any stability issues right now with the nForce3 250.

Anyone know what that NV/ATI speed up option in the core cell menu does? It is enabled by default.

Gator
07-31-04, 02:42 PM
Nforce3 is VERY stable, so don't worry about that :). Trust me I have two Nforce3 motherboards in my home and both are rock solid stable. Additionally the Nforce3 250 has working AGP/PCI lock, an essential feature if you wanna overclock. I've always found VIA chipsets to be buggy, and while SIS755 is very stable it does not overclock well.

The minor problems with the MSI Nforce3 250 motherboard are a glitch with the motherboard itself and not the chipset. But rest assured the latest bios has fixed the temperature readings for most people, though not all. I suspect that by the next bios update everything will be fixed, but if you wanna buy right now then don't worry the board is perfectly safe and stable.

If you would feel more comfortable, I can also recommend my motherboard, the Gigabyte K8NS Pro Nforce3 250. Stable, feature filled, and with the latest bios installed I have yet to find a single remaining issue with this board. It's near perfect :)

MrWho
07-31-04, 08:21 PM
Thanks for your feedback, guys. I believe the person who told me about that must be making some kind of confusion, probably related to the problems that affected the new Intel PCI Express chipsets.
Thanks a lot! ;)

Riptide
07-31-04, 09:00 PM
MrWho, if you read that link I posted it isn't just confusion on his part. Abit did make a statement that they don't/didn't intend on creating an Nforce3 250 board due to "stability" issues.

It would seem that there are no stability problems, however. Why they made that statement, I have no idea.

Gator
08-01-04, 08:08 AM
MrWho, if you read that link I posted it isn't just confusion on his part. Abit did make a statement that they don't/didn't intend on creating an Nforce3 250 board due to "stability" issues.

It would seem that there are no stability problems, however. Why they made that statement, I have no idea.

I've mentioned this before, but I believe there is another side to Abit's claims. I've read that Abit currently does not have a good relationship with Nvidia. Within the past year, they decided to abandon all manufacturering of Nvidia video cards, and now it appears Nvidia based motherboards are following this patern. It's surprising to see this when you consider the success of the Abit NF7 Nforce2 motherboards, but apprently this hostility is coming from Abit's side of the fence. I honestly believed Abit is just looking for an excuse not to make Nforce3 boards, claiming stability issues and trying to hurt Nvidia. Meanwhile there are quality motherboard makers like MSI & Gigabyte that don't have any problem with the Nforce3 chipsets. :rolleyes: This is just one of several reasons I've abandon Abit from any PC recommendations I make.

Riptide
08-01-04, 08:22 AM
Abit sucks. I can't wait to dump this POS motherboard. :p

Gator
08-01-04, 09:57 AM
Abit sucks. I can't wait to dump this POS motherboard. :p

:lol2: :clap2:

{Sniping}Waste
08-01-04, 11:30 AM
I've mentioned this before, but I believe there is another side to Abit's claims. I've read that Abit currently does not have a good relationship with Nvidia. Within the past year, they decided to abandon all manufacturering of Nvidia video cards, and now it appears Nvidia based motherboards are following this patern. It's surprising to see this when you consider the success of the Abit NF7 Nforce2 motherboards, but apprently this hostility is coming from Abit's side of the fence. I honestly believed Abit is just looking for an excuse not to make Nforce3 boards, claiming stability issues and trying to hurt Nvidia. Meanwhile there are quality motherboard makers like MSI & Gigabyte that don't have any problem with the Nforce3 chipsets. :rolleyes: This is just one of several reasons I've abandon Abit from any PC recommendations I make.
Gator, stick a scsi raid card in a nforce2 or nforce3 mobo and you will see stability issues. The pci bandwith and lantancy have problems on both Nforce2 and 3 chipsets. Most users will not see this problem but if you load up the PCI bus, then it can cause stability problems. The newer VIA shipset for the A64 looks like have fixed this problems and the SIS chipset never had the problem. The SB sound cards that cracked and popped was caused by the PCI bandwith/lantancy problem and I still hear this problem with nforce2 and the newer nforce 3 150/250 but not the newer VIA chipsets.
The problem is there Gator even if you don't have that problem dosen't mean its not there.

Gator
08-01-04, 12:29 PM
Gator, stick a scsi raid card in a nforce2 or nforce3 mobo and you will see stability issues. The pci bandwith and lantancy have problems on both Nforce2 and 3 chipsets. Most users will not see this problem but if you load up the PCI bus, then it can cause stability problems. The newer VIA shipset for the A64 looks like have fixed this problems and the SIS chipset never had the problem. The SB sound cards that cracked and popped was caused by the PCI bandwith/lantancy problem and I still hear this problem with nforce2 and the newer nforce 3 150/250 but not the newer VIA chipsets.
The problem is there Gator even if you don't have that problem dosen't mean its not there.

I was not aware of that particular issue, thank you for bringing it to my attention. I'll remember that the next time someone asks me if Nforce has any issues. I guess I never realized it since I use onboard IDE and SATA, but if I know if I know someone wants SCSI then the warning alarm will go off in my head and I'll recommend SIS755 :)

One question though, that would only affect SCSI drives connected to the controller, right? Because my father has a SCSI external scanner connected to his Nforce3 150 and he has no problems with it. :confused:

{Sniping}Waste
08-01-04, 12:44 PM
I was not aware of that particular issue, thank you for bringing it to my attention. I'll remember that the next time someone asks me if Nforce has any issues. I guess I never realized it since I use onboard IDE and SATA, but if I know if I know someone wants SCSI then the warning alarm will go off in my head and I'll recommend SIS755 :)

One question though, that would only affect SCSI drives connected to the controller, right? Because my father has a SCSI external scanner connected to his Nforce3 150 and he has no problems with it. :confused:

The scaner should be fine. Its only when you load the PCI bus that the problem will come up. SCSI is the easiest way to load a PCI bus but a sb Soundcard and another heave bandwith PCI card can do the same thing. So if someone is going to have many heave bandwith PCI cards could have trouble with a nforce chipset. In the past with socket a it was the sis and AMD chipset to use if there was heave use of PCI bandwith.

I beleave this is why Abit is dropping the Nforce3 chipset because all the problems in the past with nforce2 and the older via chipset. Abit was flooded with problems with Sound Blaster lives and up, SCSI, and SATA raid cards with under proformans and errors(BSOD). Looks like they just want to doge the whole mess.

Gator
08-01-04, 01:07 PM
The scaner should be fine. Its only when you load the PCI bus that the problem will come up. SCSI is the easiest way to load a PCI bus but a sb Soundcard and another heave bandwith PCI card can do the same thing. So if someone is going to have many heave bandwith PCI cards could have trouble with a nforce chipset. In the past with socket a it was the sis and AMD chipset to use if there was heave use of PCI bandwith.

I beleave this is why Abit is dropping the Nforce3 chipset because all the problems in the past with nforce2 and the older via chipset. Abit was flooded with problems with Sound Blaster lives and up, SCSI, and SATA raid cards with under proformans and errors(BSOD). Looks like they just want to doge the whole mess.

Interesting! But then why did Abit drop the Nvidia video cards too? I've read that it got ugly between the two companies, but I don't know why exactly.

MrWho
08-01-04, 02:15 PM
That thing about SB cards, anyone here using and Audigy card and a nForce3 250 based mobo? I have an Audigy and I'm relutant in ditching it in favour of the on-board audio...

{Sniping}Waste
08-01-04, 02:40 PM
That thing about SB cards, anyone here using and Audigy card and a nForce3 250 based mobo? I have an Audigy and I'm relutant in ditching it in favour of the on-board audio... Are you going to use any other PCI card in this system? If you are then list the PCI cards.

MrWho
08-01-04, 07:14 PM
Are you going to use any other PCI card in this system? If you are then list the PCI cards.

PCI cards:

-SB Audigy
-Pinnacle PCTV Pro (rarely, to capture some video from VHS)
-I also got a 10/100 LAN card, but probably will ditch it in order to use the on-board NIC.

Riptide
08-01-04, 07:53 PM
IMO just one audigy card is not likely enough to saturate your PCI bus.

SCSI host controllers, especially RAID controllers, OTOH are a different story...

{Sniping}Waste
08-01-04, 09:19 PM
PCI cards:

-SB Audigy
-Pinnacle PCTV Pro (rarely, to capture some video from VHS)
-I also got a 10/100 LAN card, but probably will ditch it in order to use the on-board NIC.


It looks 0k. You should not have a problem. You might have to move the SB and the TV card around but Not likely.

Gator
08-02-04, 06:57 AM
If you find yourself worried about PCI bandwidth, I know you were hesitant to remove your SB Audigy, but check out this thread (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=30147). About a month ago I asked people if I should keep my SantaCruz (about on par with your audigy1) or use the onboard Realtek ALC850 audio. Although SantaCruz won the poll, JuiceZ mentioned that he compared the Audigy2zs and found it was only marginally better than Realtek ALC850, so he decided to just use the Realtek instead. I'm using the Realtek as well, and I'm very pleased with it. It's important you use the Realtek drivers and not the ones from Nvidia, and although you may lose some fps using onboard audio, considering how fast the Athlon64 is we're only talking about 5fps or so. But it should help cleanup the PCI bandwidth a little.

Underzenith
08-02-04, 07:46 AM
LOL, anyone affected by that power light bug.

1. Go into the Core Cell Menu in the BIOS.
2. Press Shift+F2
3. Disable NV/ATI Speed Up

I have no idea what that option does but it fixed the damn power light.