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View Full Version : id's next game going to be on the Doom3 engine :(


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Intel17
08-15-04, 04:26 PM
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/doom-3/539049p1.html

Well, I guess its not going to really be new tech :( So I take it no GLSL and 64bit fp support :(

Mr. Hunt
08-15-04, 06:55 PM
So? Oh no... they didn't just work on an engine for a long time just to throw it away and go for something new again. I love the d3 engine and I don't mind it being used for more than 1 game :\.

Intel17
08-15-04, 06:59 PM
Its just it doesnt have flexible shader support. But Carmack did say new renderer, so do you guys think its possible for this renderer to compete with UE3?

Vash
08-15-04, 07:26 PM
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/doom-3/539049p1.html

Well, I guess its not going to really be new tech :( So I take it no GLSL and 64bit fp support :(


Just because it's the Doom 3 engine doesn't mean Carmack isn't going to improve the heck out of it. Should be interesting to see where it goes... and what type of game it ends up being.

Skrot
08-15-04, 07:26 PM
Well isn't UE3 based off of Unreal 1, UT tech? They don't create 'new' engines, they just majorly revamp new ones yeah? What makes you think that id can't do the same with the Doom3 engine? I'm pretty damn sure that Carmack wrote the engine with extensibility in mind, if only because it's common sense that he would do it as such.

Intel17
08-15-04, 07:28 PM
Yeah, I should keep in mind this is TEH CARMACK.

Im sure his new renderer will blow everything away, just like Doom3's engine did (and will for quite a while :) )

Edge
08-15-04, 07:36 PM
Ya know, I almost wonder if some of Doom 3's base code isn't centered on Quake 3 Arena. Some things seem pretty similar between the two, hell turning off specular/bumpmapping/shadows basically makes the game look like Quake 3. And Source seems to have a lot in common with Half-life code...seems like all these "new" engines are really just massive improvements to old ones. And that's not really a bad thing, I mean they optimised things so well back then that they scale really well with new features.

But I think it's obvious that the Doom 3 engine hasn't really been tapped yet. It even has support for Paralox mapping, but the only way to enable it is through a mod. Not all that unlike Farcry, where there engine supports more features than the game actually uses.

Vash
08-15-04, 08:09 PM
IIRC, Edge, Carmack started by modifying the Quake 3 engine and eventually replaced everything as he wrote the new code. I'm not surprised that the engines feels similar at all, considering.

Intel17
08-15-04, 09:51 PM
IIRC, Edge, Carmack started by modifying the Quake 3 engine and eventually replaced everything as he wrote the new code. I'm not surprised that the engines feels similar at all, considering.

he rewrote everything so its really nothing like Q3A

Vash
08-15-04, 10:11 PM
Yes, but he used it as a framework, at least to begin with. I have no idea if there are any similarities in the final product, but at least it's descended from Q3... that might be where Edge was getting that vibe.

Intel17
08-15-04, 10:44 PM
Well, if they rewrote everything then there's no way in hell you could call it a modified Q3 engine :)

I think this new renderer will just be "doom3 style" with unifield lighting :)

Edge
08-15-04, 11:19 PM
Well, just because the code was rewriten doesn't mean it can't have a lot in common with the original engine. I think some people said they found traces of Quake 1 code in the Source alpha leak. Obviously it will most likely be replaced, but the new code will probably function exactly the same as the old code does. So yeah, in a way I think you could say they "based" the engine off of older code. After all, if it functions the same, looks the same, and feels the same, it might as well be the original. They've probably rewritten the entire Unreal engine code several times over by now, but the basic parts of the engine probably function the same as they did in the original Unreal. Seems pretty common for games to start development on older engines before moving over to a more modern one, I think early versions of Starcraft were running on the Warcraft 2 engine before they actually rebuilt the engine for the game. But there's a difference between "modifying" an engine, and basing a new engine off of an old one ;)

But anyway, I am interested in seeing how far the Doom 3 engine can be pushed. Look how far the Quake 3 engine got with games like Heavy Metal: FAKK2 and Medal of Honor: imagine if the Doom 3 engine recieves a similar upgrade. Though considering Doom 3 is already pretty taxing on mid-ranged computers (at least it sure seem to be on my XP2000/GF4ti), I'm wondering what kind of hardware will be needed to really run the engine to it's full potential.

Skrot
08-15-04, 11:32 PM
It's called code reuse. Why rewrite something completely if it fundamentally works well? Like the console command and cvar stuff in the quake games? Why rewrite that completely from scratch? Doesn't make much sense to do so...

holmes
08-15-04, 11:57 PM
I fail to see how a new game using the Doom3 engine is a bad thing.. And designing code to be as modular as possible to allow for future reuse is a very important aspect of software engineering, so no surprise that Carmack will reuse certain pieces of code that don't have to be written from scratch. No need to reinvent the wheel...

killahsin
08-16-04, 12:29 AM
Almost all engines including far cry hehe(except it was never released) are modified or heavily based off the framework of previous engines. Thats just the nature of it all. HL2 so far and doom 3 (in some ways since the core is the lighting/shadowing) are ground up engines. I would not worry about carmacks next version of the doom3 engine yet, you got a long way to go. Also understand that sometimes you get to a point where you realize in order to do somthing you have to go from the ground up again, on certain aspects of the engine.

After all this is carmack, and like tim sweeny, and gabe newell you can always expect their engines to push the limits of certain aspects of technology. So rest easy and know that having 2, 3 or 4 engines that are all stunning, is a beautiful thing for gamers.

jAkUp
08-16-04, 02:14 AM
The next game for id Software will be a departure from anything they've done before, but we did learn a few things. For one thing, it'll focus on single-player, much like DOOM 3. Carmack said that this tended to be a good model -- in a single-player game, framerate isn't quite as important, so a state-of-the-art engine that really pushes systems to the limit isn't as much of a drawback. Then, partner companies can come out with multiplayer-focused games using that same engine shortly thereafter -- much like how Raven Software is doing Quake 4 using the DOOM 3 engine, focusing on multiplayer.

id's next title will be a first-person game, and although it will focus on single-player it'll have a basic multiplayer such as DOOM 3. What will it look like? What will it be about? Sadly, no details were forthcoming. We expect an announcement in the coming months.


.

ClosetFanBoy
08-16-04, 02:35 AM
"much like how Raven Software is doing Quake 4 using the DOOM 3 engine, focusing on multiplayer. "

originally they said it was single player focus. heh, i remember when that was mentioned to the public (single player focus) and the quake 3'ers hit the raven boards hard practically demanding it be mp. hopefully it will be the best of both worlds.

jAkUp
08-16-04, 02:56 AM
I read somewhere that quake4 will be a good balance between single and multiplayer.. much like the older quakes.

ClosetFanBoy
08-16-04, 03:09 AM
I read somewhere that quake4 will be a good balance between single and multiplayer.. much like the older quakes.

i hope so, i enjoyed the sp part of the quake games. be cool to continue on.

Intel17
08-16-04, 07:46 AM
Almost all engines including far cry hehe(except it was never released) are modified or heavily based off the framework of previous engines. Thats just the nature of it all. HL2 so far and doom 3 (in some ways since the core is the lighting/shadowing) are ground up engines. I would not worry about carmacks next version of the doom3 engine yet, you got a long way to go. Also understand that sometimes you get to a point where you realize in order to do somthing you have to go from the ground up again, on certain aspects of the engine.

After all this is carmack, and like tim sweeny, and gabe newell you can always expect their engines to push the limits of certain aspects of technology. So rest easy and know that having 2, 3 or 4 engines that are all stunning, is a beautiful thing for gamers.

Gabe newell doesnt make engines.

Nutty
08-16-04, 07:49 AM
Carmack took the framework of Q3, like the console system, file handling, all the system code, but the renderer was completely re-written.

I dont think its a bad thing that the next id game will be based on the D3 engine. You can pretty much guarantee it will look loads better, as the artists and designers have alot more experience with the technology 2nd time round. You can probably expect higher poly models at least. I reckon it'll still look amazing.

Skrot
08-16-04, 09:23 AM
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/doom-3/539049p1.html

Sounds like Carmack's been having a lot of fun with the engine while it was being made, and still now... yay! :)

killahsin
08-16-04, 12:25 PM
Yes but as carmack is credited for iD engines even though he has other coders who work with him and tim sweeny is credited for unreal tech even though he has coders working for him. Gabe is credited for valve based prodicts even though he has coders who work for him.

Gabe newell doesnt make engines.

Intel17
08-16-04, 02:39 PM
Yes but as carmack is credited for iD engines even though he has other coders who work with him and tim sweeny is credited for unreal tech even though he has coders working for him. Gabe is credited for valve based prodicts even though he has coders who work for him.

John Carmack writes the renderers by himself. Now, other programmers do the game code, tools etc. but i can safely say JC does the renderers by himself.

I dont know about sweeney however :)

Intel17
08-16-04, 02:43 PM
Carmack took the framework of Q3, like the console system, file handling, all the system code, but the renderer was completely re-written.

I dont think its a bad thing that the next id game will be based on the D3 engine. You can pretty much guarantee it will look loads better, as the artists and designers have alot more experience with the technology 2nd time round. You can probably expect higher poly models at least. I reckon it'll still look amazing.

Well he's doing a new renderer so, its probably significantly different from Doom3 engine of today :)