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View Full Version : Gef.6800 series-jerkiness in games->analysis (read it!!!!)


Cutter Slade
08-28-04, 05:27 AM
Hello Guys!
First of all I have to say, that I'm from Germany, so please excuse my possible mistakes.

So back to the problem. Do we really experience random stutterings in games with the Geforce 6800 series and the current Forceware drivers? The answer ist no and yes. It's a fact that some games jerk at some times, but it's not a random jerking. If one really tries to figure out when these stuttering things occour, he will find out, that he will experience them at similar scenes all the time. For the better understanding I will enumber some examples.

1.)UT 2004 -> starting an onslaught game, everybody will see that the screen will heavily stutter as long as the game has to load new textures it did not load at the pre-game loading phase. These are f. example textures of all vehicles, players and so on. But why doesn't it stutter like this in deathmatch games? Very simple answer, it does not have to load that many textures because of the vehicles. You can see that the Geforce6800(GT,UIltra...) has problems loading huge texture blocks quick enough. When you conquer a new energy point (or how they are called) and new vehicles appear, the game will possibly stutter, even when you are at a completly different point on the map at that time. Don't missunderstand me, it does not stutter every time this happens and only at this points (the game also stutters in deathmatches at some times, but not nearly as often), but the chance to experience the stutterings is much higher!

2.)Tiger Woods 2004 ->starting a match, the camera flys from the end of the course to the player quite quickly. You will - in most cases - see at least two stutters here, after that the stuttering will most possibly be gone. Why? Flying over the course quickly forces the graphic card to load many textures that wouldn't completly be loaded in the normal game at nearly the same time. Remeber the texture loading problem? ;)

3.)Codename Panzers ->runs flawless all the time, untill you destroy a buidling that collapses (for example a tower). Then the game will pause for a second at the end of the collapse-animation (better said stutter). I don't exactly see the problem here, but it could be that the many particle effects and thereforce additional textures here stress the graphic card to much.

4.)Freelancer -> just start a new game and look at the introduction. The first stutter will occour when the spacestation (free port 7) explodes, you can see that at the explosions which seem to come to screen a second later than they were supposed to. In the following scenes you will easily see additional stutterings (for example when the little spacship docks right after the first text disappeared). Reducing resolution as well as AA and AF reduces the heaviness of the stutterings as well, but they don't completly disappaer.

5.)Doom3 ->runs like the marine you play has pakinson in some way. It runs at over 130 FPS some times for me (disbaled the 60FPS barrier with autoexec and fixed_Tic "-1") but still doesn't fell completly smooth. Don't misunderstand me, the game runs well (no bigger stutters), but it doesn't run perfect, it's like the engine has a sip up.

There are many more examples I could write down, just tell my if you missed some special games.

The thing I wanted to make clear with this is, that the stuttering we all (!!!) do encounter is not random! It reminds me of the old "Radeon 9700pro stuttering bug" with older Catalyst drivers (had that problem till Catalyst 4.3 or so...)


I would like you all to raise your voice and sho NVidia that we do care about this problem, which keeps us from experiencing games the way "they are ment to be played". This worked at ATI some time ago to!

Finally, don't get me wrong, I like my new Geforce6800GT a lot, but not as much as I should concerning it's great overall performance!

My System:
Athlon 3400+
K8V deluxe (bios 1.6)
1024MB DDR400
Geforce 6800GT
Audigy 2
2x120GB Maxtor Diamond 9 p
WinXP prof.
.....

pharma
08-28-04, 06:12 AM
Try changing your AGP Aperture in your system bios to match the memory on your graphics card -- set it to 256 if your card has this amount. In my installation instructions, BFGTech recommends it be set to the amount of memory on your graphics card. Also saw another thread where someone with slight stutter issues called BFG and they made this recommendation -- his problems went away.

Also check your graphics drivers. If you think it might be related to drivers then try others. There is a new WHQL driver (65.73) that is not officially released but came available yesterday and seems to fix may issues and are extremely good. You can get it at guru3d.com, but here is the thread on the driver:

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?threadid=103752



Hope this helps. :)

Pharma

Cutter Slade
08-28-04, 06:22 AM
Nonono..... I should have said, that I really know quite a lot about hardware and software related issues (First problems of this kind appeared with my Athlon 1 - 700Mhz and it's Chipset-drivers). Of course I tried all the "standart" things like changing the AGP-Aperture size, FastWrites, IRQ, prerendered frames, V-Sync and so on.

Thanks for your reply anyway! ;)

superklye
08-28-04, 08:47 AM
I'm getting the 65.73 drivers...It's funny how unbloated they are. 10MB vs. 20 or so for 61.77.

Skinner
08-28-04, 04:23 PM
You found a way to avoid the 60 fps cap?!

fixed_Tic "-1" can I add this line in the doom3cfg?

Where is the autoexec located?

Cutter Slade
08-28-04, 05:31 PM
Create a .cfg file called "autoexec" (without " of course ;) ) and write:
seta com_fixedTic "-1"

into it. That's it, very simple isn't it?! The autoexec has to be in the "base" directory of course...

DivotMaker
08-28-04, 05:39 PM
2.)Tiger Woods 2004 ->starting a match, the camera flys from the end of the course to the player quite quickly. You will - in most cases - see at least two stutters here, after that the stuttering will most possibly be gone. Why? Flying over the course quickly forces the graphic card to load many textures that wouldn't completly be loaded in the normal game at nearly the same time. Remeber the texture loading problem? ;)
.....

In TW 2004, the flyby is rendering a great many 3D trees which are utilizing vertex shaders. The 3D grass is rendering as well with vertex shaders. when there are holes in the flyby with water, you have pixel shaders being rendered. At then end of the day, TW2004 puts a huge stress on the fill rate because it is rendering a dynamic and moving environment with real-time cameras.

I believe once we see 512 MB cards, issues like these will be minimized...

Skinner
08-28-04, 07:07 PM
Create a .cfg file called "autoexec" (without " of course ;) ) and write:
seta com_fixedTic "-1"

into it. That's it, very simple isn't it?! The autoexec has to be in the "base" directory of course...

Thanx!

habicht
08-28-04, 10:05 PM
i realize the jerks in doom3 when i strafe around ... so i have the feeling that my marine stamples over his own feeds ... i tried ervything to avoid this:

- all drivers around from 61.xx - 66.xx
- all "standard" settings in bios etc.
- all ingame and driver settings

nothing helps ... i have read about this problem in several boards ([H], ...) and it seems that all gf 6800 owner have this problem ... i can only confirm this for d3 ... haven't played everything else yet ;-) ...

so it is not a big problem ... but for this money i think that i can expect a perfect gameplay ... especially if the fps are beyond 60 ...

maybe any ati user here that can check this d3-problem with his card??

Lezmaka
08-28-04, 10:07 PM
it seems that all gf 6800 owner have this problem

Nope, I don't notice anything out of the ordinary.

habicht
08-28-04, 10:37 PM
Nope, I don't notice anything out of the ordinary.

yes ... i know ... it is the same with vsync ... when >I< play it without it seems >for me< that the screen tear apart .... a friend of mine have the same system as mine and didn't realize this ... when I sit at his machine I see exactly the same effect ... but he not ... even with the jerkiness in d3 ... i see the same jerks as on my machine but my friend didn't realize this ...

i don't want to attack you, so pls don't missunderstand me ... but perhaps i see on your machine this effect and for me it is very disturbend and for you not ...

... the other side is that there are a lot of users out there who have the same problem! ... so i think it is a problem and hope that it can be eliminated by a patch from id or a new driver from nvidia .....


my system for comparison:

Athlon64 3.0
GF 6800 GT (Leadtek) [66.00]
1 gig ram (Corsair)
all @ stock speed

newest drivers for the via chipset
(only if some funny man comes around and tell me i should install the newest drivers and correct my bios settings :lol2: )

Killall
08-29-04, 05:53 PM
Well i can confirm doom 3 has serious frame rate problems. Im getting like 50 fps in a open room but when i look from left to right it stutters a bit, like theres durt under my mouse. Then i loaded a new (usermade) singleplayer map entered a open room with virtually nothing moving or complex stuff around, no shadows just some square blocks in there, i still get those stutters. Other games r fine btw.. i play ut2004 with uber fps, Farcry runs great and stutterless as wel.
Doom 3 needs to be patched, thats it.

Lindy
08-29-04, 06:21 PM
PNY GT, No AA or AF ever used.....No problems at all with the following games at 1280x1024/960:

Doom3
Fary Cry
BF42/VIETNAM/POE Mod
Lock On
UT 2004......when I play it....rarely.
Rise of Nations
Call of Duty

I have an actual Intel 875mobo.....latest bios, lastest vendor posted drivers (61.77) Nothing overclocked, nice cool case with 53C/67C temps on my GT.

Fx-Rat
08-29-04, 08:35 PM
Create a .cfg file called "autoexec" (without " of course ;) ) and write:
seta com_fixedTic "-1"

into it. That's it, very simple isn't it?! The autoexec has to be in the "base" directory of course...


I know what you mean I have had the stuttering in doom 3, but I put com_fix..... and added set r_displayrefresh "85" and mine ran perfectly smooth with the 65.62 beta drivers and I think 61.77. And added some of these tweaks http://www.viperlair.com/articles/howto/software/tweakd3/index.shtml and I hate viewbobbing, or weapon swaying or what ever they call it because it makes me motion sick and he fixed this. I kept putting in the refresh fix but it kept stuttering I think because I run 100mhz refresh rate on my 21inch monitor.ut2004 stutters just a little, I notice it when I am next to walls moving.Just like my counterstrike and CS-CZ stutters untill you add fps_max 100 in the console and then it runs perfectly smooth with ATI and Nvidia cards if you are running a monitor at 100mhz.I don't know if people have this problem with LCD monitors,do you use one??? Beware some people don't notice this stuttering, I showed farcry to my wife when you walk down hallways in the boat in inside houses or huts and can see the jerking as you walk along the walls or by rocks, she doesn't notice this because it doesn't bother her and it doesn't bother my brother, so some of us are picky about our games while others aren't. After I get my AX800-XT my next part will be a LCD monitor but I dont know if I can handle the ghosting, I read where some people can;t stand the ghosting on a certain LCD monitor but others dont notice this on the same monitor with the same games,some people don't mind the ghosting.I just try to find the best drivers that make my games run the smoothest with the games I am playing, don't know about your ATI 9700pro but my 9800 pro I had was these smoothest running videocard I ever had except 2 driving games and you had to turn off certain things in the game and them they ran pretty smooth.

francisD
09-22-04, 09:21 PM
I am getting this jerkiness as well, far cry and doom3, I have tried all fixes, and it's not smooth.

odin20
09-22-04, 11:29 PM
weird im overclocked out the wazoo and get no stuttering. Ii do have my 2d and 3d the same.

red_star
09-23-04, 01:30 PM
I was having the same problem, than I changed the system. I went from agp 4x to agp8x and jerkiness has gone. Only Doom 3 has a strange behaviour, where frames drop too much (it's not stuttering) for no reason. Somebody said Doom 3 has to be patch, I agree!!!!!!!

My bro has a Radeon 9800XT. For me, Doom 3 is unplayable with ATI cards. It runs like crap, unless you set everything to low. Those guys over rage3d had to smoke something weird, since they are running in high details with Radeon 9800XT. I checked out X800Pro as well, runs crappy as Radeon 9800XT...not big difference for me.
Geforce 6 runs perfectly with forceware 65.76, no stuttering, just a frame drop in certain areas, and it shouldn't have. As far as I saw in Doom 3, this game is not for huge areas like Far Cry. In those big levels Doom 3 would not run more than 5FPS....

Elvin Presler
09-23-04, 02:18 PM
I'm getting the 65.73 drivers...It's funny how unbloated they are. 10MB vs. 20 or so for 61.77.

Oh they're just as bloated, give or take. It just depends on how they're packaged and compressed.

I have the 6177 and the 6753's on my backup drive. After unpacking them from how they were when I got them, then zipping them for storage, the zip files are:

6177 = 11.8 MB (12,459,816 bytes)
6753 = 15.3 MB (16,095,365 bytes)

You know how sometimes the file extensions are weird like "nv4_disp.dl_" instead of "nv4_disp.dll". Those are compressed I believe. I don't remember how, it's been so long, but you can "expand" them. Anyone know how to do that? I forgot. It's a command prompt thing. "expand target something something".

Edit: Ah. Here (http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;314958) it is. I still can't figure out how to get the names back normal without specifying every one of them. (IE: .dl_ should be .dll but what if it's an extension you're unsure of?)

dpagan
09-23-04, 02:57 PM
well i know this might not help but i have a bfg 6800gt and i was getting some studering so i removed the heatsink and guess what the thermal past was dry, so i cleaned it and added some AS5 and now i get 4c less on my temps and i haven't had any studering since, maybe this only applys to my case in particular but it won't hurt to see if it's your temps on your card, by the way don't trust the temps on your driver much cause mine where reasonable before i added AS5, but taking a look at the core it was obvious that the thermal past wasn't doing it's job correctly

kc7wai
10-19-04, 05:04 PM
I have no problems with jerking the hardware i am running is pny geforce 6800 ultra, 1gb of ddr 400MHZ ram, abit kd7a motherboard, amd Athlon XP 2800@2.1GHZ, 120,160GB Maxtor HD 7200RPM 8MB cache

PikachuMan
10-19-04, 05:41 PM
I have a weird problekm with it, in Farcry everything runs fine, but walking up to the pier where the guy is fishing on the first level will give me a sort of "warp", that's the only time I see it in that game.
I can walk back, and do it again, same warp/stutter effect, walk facing the other direction, nothing.