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View Full Version : [Rant] Accelerating 3D, Deccelerating 2D


eL_PuSHeR
08-31-04, 02:38 PM
Hi. It has been a long time now since I noticed how bad nVIDIA cards perform under Windows XP (and maybe ATi ones, too) as far as 2D acceleration is concerned. I have a GeForce Ti4200 card running APG4X on an ASUS mainboard. I have all eye-candy disabled under Windows and my desktop is set at 1024x768x16bpp (85Hz) (not a great deal for a modern 64MB+ nowadays card, huh?). Funny thing is that my eyes are fast enough to see noticeable screen drawing/redrawing even when closing a dialog is performed. This is just awful. I can see the dialog being erased by three consecutive layers/band. WTF? What kind of crappy 2D does windows have? Or, maybe it isn't windows fault but driver crappy 2D support. Who knows. I remember when i had some Trident PCI card which performed a lot better, even for watching video. This sucks. :
nanahump:

Well, sorry for the long boring post. I needed to vent a little... :rolleyes:

-=DVS=-
08-31-04, 02:55 PM
I think its time to reformat and reinstall windows for you :eek:

eL_PuSHeR
08-31-04, 02:57 PM
Hmm. I think this is not the case. Windows XP is running as always. Pretty well and rock-stable. It's been like this since day 1. It's just i find modern videocards somewhat 2D lackluster. :ORDER:

Thank you for your input, though.

aaahhh52
08-31-04, 03:15 PM
or maybe a new vid card, cause i dont think your eyes are fast enough to notice that :retard:

eL_PuSHeR
08-31-04, 03:18 PM
Yes, you may be right. My card has always been great as 3D is concerned but a little crappy at the 2D department. :lol2:

mezkal
08-31-04, 03:25 PM
I find your statements about the "lacklustre" performance of a modern video (say, my NV FX 5900XT 128MB AGP 8X) versus an older generation card (say, my GF4 Ti4200 64MB AGP 4X) to be rather nebulous and ill-researched.

I've recently upgraded from the Ti4200 so I know quite well how they compare. Put it this way....The Ti4200 is approximately 2 to 4 x S-L-O-W-E-R than the FX 5900XT. My guess is the faster RAM and Higher Bus Speed (AGP 8X vs 4X) gives me faster overall 2D experience. Take this for example. I use NVIEW. I use it's desktop features. I have two 19" monitors. It's therefore very useful too me. One of it's nicer features is "transparency-while-dragging". Any window I drag and drop is made semi-transparent (that, 50% Opaque). Now on my ti4200 with the exact same drivers (and I've tested with GF4 relevant Det's too) the windows that are 1600x1200 and transparent when dragged will slow my poor ti4200 to a CRAWL. Effectively the window being dragged will either dissapear only to reappear when dropped or *skip* it's laggy way to it's destination whilst being ENTIRELY UNTRANSPARENT. This is reflective of the ti4200's GPU not being able to keep up (running out buffers, Alpha channel not kicking in quick enough etc etc). My FX 5900 XT never misses a window. Then you can add the CineFX motion compensation and image clarity features that leave my old friend the Ti4200 out of the proverbial race.

Overall and comparitively the FX 5900 XT is the clear winner. But then so it damn well should, it's one generation (and lots of painful R & D) later. I can only imagine a 6800 trouncing my card. Imagine quite easily. Imagine what it would make your Ti4200 look like....

OLD TECHNOLOGY :P

Get with the program man. :)

Bah!
08-31-04, 04:20 PM
Hi. It has been a long time now since I noticed how bad nVIDIA cards perform under Windows XP (and maybe ATi ones, too) as far as 2D acceleration is concerned. I have a GeForce Ti4200 card running APG4X on an ASUS mainboard. I have all eye-candy disabled under Windows and my desktop is set at 1024x768x16bpp (85Hz) (not a great deal for a modern 64MB+ nowadays card, huh?). Funny thing is that my eyes are fast enough to see noticeable screen drawing/redrawing even when closing a dialog is performed. This is just awful. I can see the dialog being erased by three consecutive layers/band. WTF? What kind of crappy 2D does windows have? Or, maybe it isn't windows fault but driver crappy 2D support. Who knows. I remember when i had some Trident PCI card which performed a lot better, even for watching video. This sucks. :
nanahump:

Well, sorry for the long boring post. I needed to vent a little... :rolleyes:


Why are you running your desktop in 16bit color?

Sounds to me like issues with your particular card and windows. I had a 4200 before i got my 6800 and what you are describing has never happened to me. Then again people are always coming up with new and strange behavior that their cards manage to have that i have never seen before.

Lezmaka
08-31-04, 09:01 PM
Sounds like drivers aren't installed right to me. That's the only time I've ever had problems with things seeming so slow in Windows you could see things being drawn.

-=DVS=-
08-31-04, 09:16 PM
But he said 3d games run good :bleh: id still go by idea of total rework :D

ynnek
08-31-04, 10:55 PM
as other people have said, something is probably wrong.. and since you have your desktop in 16bit mode, I kinda thing you set something wrong, cause thats just silly..

make sure your hardware accel is set to FULL btw too..

eL_PuSHeR
09-01-04, 03:09 PM
Well, entered bios setup and put some settings to their default value. Enabled write combining both in bios and windows xp and now everything is fast and smooth. Cool.

XanderF
09-05-04, 09:55 PM
Odd that would have any effect. Did you have to reinstall drivers or anything when windows booted up after making that change?

eL_PuSHeR
09-06-04, 11:18 AM
No. I didn't have to.

Leech
09-06-04, 11:32 AM
I'm not entirely sure about nVidia's cards, but I recall that the Matrox cards are actually SLOWER at 16bit color than they are at 32bit color. So that might also be a problem. Why on earth would you leave your desktop in 16bit color unless you have a >4mb of ram?

Leech

undercover
09-06-04, 06:05 PM
Well, sorry for the long boring post. I needed to vent a little... :rolleyes:


I agree 100% ! I think my 6800GT is great but in 2D it's not as snappy as the 9800Pro it replaced. Window redraw is noticably slower.

Mine you, I can't watch 100Hz TV because of the artifacts that other people swear aren't there!

Fast Eyes :)

AthlonXP1800
09-08-04, 02:47 AM
eL_PuSHeR, I have the same issue on the same motherboard, it happened everytime I uninstall the Forceware driver. It very likely that your anti-virus software had blocked the driver installed properly, anti-virus need to be disabled first before install Forceware driver properly. :D

sgio2
09-10-04, 10:25 PM
I have noticed the same thing. My machine is tweaked to the absoloute max and I still notice slight redraw in Windows , while surfing the net or minimising or maximising Windows. I have tried different driver sets and they all do the same thing. I upgraded from a Ti 4200 and it did not suffer from this problem. The 3D is to die for tho. I also wish they would work this quirk out.

AnimaliX
09-13-04, 01:08 PM
yes, yes... i have same problem... :/ any idea ?