Geforce FX+HL2

[fraggenstien]

Do no other nvidia geforce FX owners care but me that their cards wont be able to play Half Life 2 with all the DX9 effects turned on, after we spent our hard earned cash on these NEXT GEN supposedly DX 9 cards. After all we got them to play doom 3 and HL 2 on did'nt we?. Have we been ripped off?, will nvidia release drivers so we will get all the effects(at good speeds) before the game is released?,is any one else P***ed off?.

[nVidiaGuru]

im not pissed cuz the dx9 effects in hl2 arent that big of a difference from what ive seen, and i dont care about hl2 i want cs (mag)

[Cota]

If halflife 2 was released a over year ago as promised, I would be very pissed.

Now I'm getting a 6800gt anyway (and no half life 2 on stores yet) so I don't care at all.

[Lfctony]

Nice 1st post, did you register just to start a flame war?

[ragejg]

I got my binoculars on this thread...

And yeah, it does look like a sad attempt at starting a flamewar...

but ya know what, we can actually glean a decent disussion out of this wrt nv3x usage of DX8 class shaders, and the associated small IQ differences, and large amount of performance increase present with the DX8 code usage... hmm, add all that up and it really does look like Valve is actually helping nv3x card owners maintain usability of their cards in the new engine...

[Kev1]

I'm pretty sure that eventually people with 5700 Ultra's or 5900 cards will play HL2 fine with DX9 effects. I have no basis for this belief other than these cards are much better than people give them credit for :)

[Lfctony]

If I still had my 5900, I'd just play in DX8.1 mode. Even if the GeforceFX would play it acceptably in DX9 mode, almost as a 9600 Pro would, the performance advantage offered by running in DX8.1 mode is simply impossible to ignore. Expecially for that small of an IQ difference.

[morbias]

It looks like Geforce FX cards won't be that compatible with much of the new dX9 software coming out due to an issue in the pixel shader hardware. There is a flaw in nVidia's pixel shader 2.0 architecture and consequently causes a cascade effect in certain dX8 games because of backward compatibility problems with pixel shader 1.2 based code.
Certain dX9 shader code is also incompatible with these chips which means a lot of new software will not work correctly. This problem looks set to be present in nVidia's PS3.0 technology as well, so the 6800 has the dX8 cascade problem, and will most likely have problems with upcoming dX9 releases as well.

there is no fix for this - it is a hardware problem

[Gator]

(me shrugs) I couldn't care less, give me acceptable frame rates at 1024x768 and I'm happy :lol2:

[ragejg]

It looks like Geforce FX cards won't be that compatible with much of the new dX9 software coming out due to an issue in the pixel shader hardware. There is a flaw in nVidia's pixel shader 2.0 architecture and consequently causes a cascade effect in certain dX8 games because of backward compatibility problems with pixel shader 1.2 based code.
Certain dX9 shader code is also incompatible with these chips which means a lot of new software will not work correctly. This problem looks set to be present in nVidia's PS3.0 technology as well, so the 6800 has the dX8 cascade problem, and will most likely have problems with upcoming dX9 releases as well.

there is no fix for this - it is a hardware problem


I'd like to see a link to that claim, esp. something re: nv40's "cascade problem".

[morbias]

the problem is only present in certain 3d engines, so it will only effect certain implementations of the shader.

i used the term 'cascade effect' to illustrate the fact that once the problem occurs, it will only get worse and can only be fixed by a reboot.

an example of this effect in asheron's call 2 on an ac2 forum: http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:B_5vHKUGR0wJ:forums.ac2.turbinegame s.com/showthread.php%3Fgoto%3Dlastpost%26t%3D375+geforce +fx+corruption+AC2&hl=en]forum
i have read that the 6800 will display the same corruption, unless pixel shaders are turned off, but i don't have the link for that. try searching on google

[zoomy942]

i think all nv3x users should :hug: :hug: their cards before the war starts.

[Gator]

i think all nv3x users should :hug: :hug: their cards before the war starts.

True... considering HL2 isn't even available yet it's pretty silly to start complaining about it's performance with the FX already :retard:

[morbias]

performance isn't the issue; the HL2 beta runs more than fast enough on my 5900, but there are shader problems which cause crashes and degrade image quality

[Pandora's Box]

It looks like Geforce FX cards won't be that compatible with much of the new dX9 software coming out due to an issue in the pixel shader hardware. There is a flaw in nVidia's pixel shader 2.0 architecture and consequently causes a cascade effect in certain dX8 games because of backward compatibility problems with pixel shader 1.2 based code.
Certain dX9 shader code is also incompatible with these chips which means a lot of new software will not work correctly. This problem looks set to be present in nVidia's PS3.0 technology as well, so the 6800 has the dX8 cascade problem, and will most likely have problems with upcoming dX9 releases as well.

there is no fix for this - it is a hardware problem


whats that smell? smells like grade A bullsh!t to me.

[zoomy942]

whats that smell? smells like grade A bullsh!t to me.


i am heading for cover!! that was the first shot of the war! :surrender

[Pandora's Box]

i am heading for cover!! that was the first shot of the war! :surrender


*reloads rifle*

also i remember a week ago that ati got caught by microsoft about its implementations of instancing. i believe microsoft has thoroughly checked out shader model 3.0 as implemented by nvidia to see if it checks out as far as standards go. and since microsoft hasnt told nvidia to change anything they seem to be doing everything according to specs.


btw when we say links, we dont want links to some unknown person on a forum no one has heard of stating that nvidias implementation is fooked. give us a link to a respectable site. (btw that eliminates the inquirer as well :bash: )

[morbias]

i didn't come here to get into an argument, you can believe what i said or not, i don't give a **** - but the problem exists (it is more apparent on slower cpus).
pandora's box - number of posts is not proportionate to iq, thankyou for proving that. :lame:

maybe in a years time i will be posting 'i told you so' on this board, but i sincerely hope not because i want the 6800 to kick ass, ok?

but for now, there's nothing you can say that will change the fact that there are major issues with the current FX family

[Pandora's Box]

i didn't come here to get into an argument, you can believe what i said or not, i don't give a **** - but the problem exists (it is more apparent on slower cpus).
pandora's box - number of posts is not proportionate to iq, thankyou for proving that. :lame:

maybe in a years time i will be posting 'i told you so' on this board, but i sincerely hope not because i want the 6800 to kick ass, ok?

but for now, there's nothing you can say that will change the fact that there are major issues with the current FX family


im not calling bs on the fact that the FX line has problems. just that when u stated it also applied to the 6xxx line i have a problem.

[ragejg]

morbias, you said you didnt come in here to argue, yet the point you brought up is very obviously flameworthy material...

No personal attacks though. Got it?

/me moves on... only to pop back in later to make sure no threadclowns have deteriorated this thread...

[morbias]

fair enough, but the 6800 shaders would appear to have been built along the same line as the version 2.0s, as in certain instances they display the same slowdowns and corruption when running dX8 code as the current FXs, which may culminate in similar dX9 shader support issues.

[morbias]

LOOK the details i posted were to help people out who may have been having those problems.
the idea that ppl come to a discussion forum but don't discuss problems because someone might disagree is a little thin imo.

btw, i heard last year sometime that 5900s have 3.0 support also, but there is no software or driver that activates it. does anyone know more about this?

[Pandora's Box]

fair enough, but the 6800 shaders would appear to have been built along the same line as the version 2.0s, as in certain instances they display the same slowdowns and corruption when running dX8 code as the current FXs, which may culminate in similar dX9 shader support issues.


yet again you dont provide any proof that the 6800 shaders appear to be built along the same line as 2.0's. where are they showing slowdowns and corruption?

[morbias]

try running a 6800 on a 2Ghz cpu, in games such as Asherons call 2, nfs underground, or f1 2002.

i can't provide proof, as i have only read of these problems in forums and obviously forum links aren't always solid. nVidia has not released any information on the problem - but then why would they if there was a serious flaw in their hardware.

please realise that these corruptions and slowdowns happen seemingly randomly and so are hard to replicate on certain setups. a slower cpu does however seem to increase the probability of it happening

[Pandora's Box]

try running a 6800 on a 2Ghz cpu, in games such as Asherons call 2, nfs underground, or f1 2002.

i can't provide proof, as i have only read of these problems in forums and obviously forum links aren't always solid. nVidia has not released any information on the problem - but then why would they if there was a serious flaw in their hardware.

please realise that these corruptions and slowdowns happen seemingly randomly and so are hard to replicate on certain setups. a slower cpu does however seem to increase the probability of it happening


check my sig mate. 2.17ghz all games run fine for me. what the hell is your point?