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View Full Version : Creative and their Ego.. We are better than MS.


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Fluke
11-06-02, 09:03 AM
Anyone try and download the Audigy drivers from the Asia site... ?You get a nice little pop up that Creative claims that their drivers will not make you system unstable or create any problem and therefore they are not committed to getting MS Certification on the drivers....

Obviously Creative doesn't see the mass of complaints in the newsgroups or forums in Europe, or just plainly doesn't care. Just find they have a lot of balls to put up a screenshot explaining WHQL and how Creative is above MS for certifying them...

Maybe if they did get them certified they would realize their drivers aren't as good as they want to believe.

I actually choked on laughter when I saw that and thought it would make a funny news post, but guess not. At least we have that "way over used" man on the moon story... :rolleyes:

FastM
11-06-02, 09:11 AM
what, you think the man on the moon was a fake to?

DaveW
11-06-02, 09:18 AM
I know Creative's drivers have issues, but I don't think WHQL certification would improve their quality.

The whole WHQL thing is just a money making scheme for Microsoft anyway. "buy this certificate from us or our new OS will display a FUD warning message to your customers when they try to install your drivers".

Microsoft held a conference on security last year, it was at a time when there was a lot of fuss over the security in Microsofts new OS (Win XP). They took a lot of flack over making the OS vulnerable to being used for DoS attacks. Microsoft tried to convince the audience that DoS attacks are a major problem, that preventing malicious programs from being installed on a users machine in the first place (with WinXPs personal firewall) is the main issue. As an example, they said that someone could download and install drivers without knowing if they were really downloading malicious code. Someone in the audience, I think it was Steve Gibson asked "I thought the WHQL certification was supposed to prevent that" and the MS employee said something along the lines of "Oh, anyone can get a WHQL license".

Fluke
11-06-02, 10:17 AM
Well I care about it. It's MS OS, they know what is and isn't good and if Creative is as positive about their drivers as they lead everyone to believe, then I see no reason why they don't go through the formalities the rest of my hardware goes thru.

As far as I'm concerned Creative drivers are BETA if they don't have that certification. Until MS stamps them with approval that they tested it to work with the "WHOLE" operating system, then Creatives assurances mean nothing. As such, Creative should mark their drivers like other vendors do, Nvidia for example, as BETA. If they don't have the WHQL then they are BETA. If Creative isn't interested then maybe they should take their hardware and only provide drivers for Linux, then they don't have to worry about certification.

Maybe Dave you should cruise on to the newsgroups and to their Forum in Europe and open your eyes to the realities of Creative and their driver qualities. There is more problems than happiness on Creative sites.

Also how can you not tell me that the problems I have with Audigy in my machine isn't because of a problem with Creative drivers that Creative is reluctant to have MS inform them of?

I have heard through various MCSE sources that Creative drivers are crap and they always have hassles with MS because Creative is always breaking the rules. Thus, explains their reluctance. It's Creative assurances of qulity over MS. Sorry, I'd rather MS assurances that the hardware in my machine meets the spec's Microsoft set out for their OS.

saturnotaku
11-06-02, 10:20 AM
Fluke, will you drop it already? Everyone knows you don't like Creative. I don't either, but I know I'm getting tired of your constant ranting against them.

DaveW
11-06-02, 10:57 AM
Fluke, my point is that Microsoft does not put drivers through the strenuous QA testing that you imagine they do. The main requirement for getting drivers certified by M$ is simply paying the fee. If Creative did get them certified they would still be as buggy as before and the only difference would be an extra gold brick for Bill Gates to pave his driveway with.

Fluke
11-06-02, 12:16 PM
I have an reasonable thread here which identifies the obvious problems Creative has with MS and their ability to provide their consumers with proper certified drivers like most every other vendor is doing. This is backed up by the complaints and hundreds of other complaints about drivers chopping in music playback, hissing and popping and lag in games. And still the problems persist. Now how much you want to bet that if they were MS certified they wouldn't do the above?

DaveW are you Microsoft certified? I don't think so. I'm talking to certified MS persons. This isn't an insult either. It's just a point. Your misbeliefs of how MS does business is your own issue.

FastM
11-06-02, 02:27 PM
sorry but MCSE = Bookworm

Matthyahuw
11-06-02, 02:37 PM
An MCSE doesn't know crap about Creative drivers, other than they just don't work on some setups...that's all, they can't change Creative, nor make MS do something about it...

Fluke
11-06-02, 02:40 PM
Whatever, hahahaha. They have certifications and knowledge of how MS and it's products work. For one to make assumptions on how MS works is not a valid piece of proof in my book. The fact is clear. If Creative wanted to give value to their customers and a comfort of knowing their drivers were certified by MS then one could say these are final drivers. In their current state without this certification then these drivers are BETA. If they aren't certified then there is no guarantee from MS that these drivers will work with their XP OS. I'm sorry, in light of all the problems Creative has with drivers and people with problems clearly evident in their forums and newsgroups these drivers are garbage. For Creative to say that they 'certify' these drivers will not cause instability is a farce. I rather have MS say whether they work or not. But that is the issue and Creative obviously has little care for it's customers to give them this assurance rather than the "required" process of going to MS.

Fluke
11-06-02, 02:53 PM
Whether you care or not, these drivers are not certified for a reason. They are beta. Until they say CERTIFIED BY MICROSOFT as stated in XP and on MS support sites, they are BETA and MS wont care if you complain. Take it up with Creative. And you think Creative cares?! Muahahahaha....Creative is a bad company. Too bad not enough people care. releasing products is one thing, support is another thing. Creative has no support and no integrity in anything they sell or support.

I had BSOD as an example, after submitting my crash report to MS, it came back and told me to get in contact with Creative Labs as their drivers were accessing DX components incorrectly, I "called" Creative. What did they say? They said the problem is with Microsoft, call Microsoft. I went back and forth to both companies(MS even pointed out exactly what was happening)with BSOD for nearly a year before Creative released new drivers. Wow! and guess what!? it fixed the blue screens! Wow!? how interesting, considering Creative said the problem was MS, yet new Creative drivers after a year of owning the Audigy fixed the problem. This led me to buy the Hercules card. Geee, wonder why!?

Then you say WHQL means nothing? Sorry, but I think you guys don't have a clue what you are talking about.

This is all I have to say.

thcdru2k
11-06-02, 05:39 PM
good for you man! you could've just saved your self time by just saying creative sucks man. its practically what you say in every post.

The Baron
11-06-02, 05:58 PM
Well I care about it. It's MS OS, they know what is and isn't good

Everything you say is now COMPLETELY UTTERLY INVALID. ;)

Fluke
11-06-02, 06:20 PM
thcdru2k

They do suck, one day you will realize.



=SSC=The Baron

Hehehe, you got me...

thcdru2k
11-06-02, 06:23 PM
thanks for proving me correct :) post number 100 something in a row about creative sucks.

ReDeeMeR
11-06-02, 06:56 PM
Yep, all I see from fluke is 'creative sucks' , he's probably very upset by the product he spent money on so he's bitchin now and I think I'd also be bitching to, if I'd get serious problems with audigy card.

thcdru2k
11-06-02, 07:07 PM
you work for hercules or what ? :D

ReDeeMeR
11-06-02, 07:23 PM
Originally posted by thcdru2k
you work for hercules or what ? :D

rofl

ShyguyMX6
11-06-02, 08:07 PM
The whole WHQL certification thing is a CROCK OF SH**, FLUKE get off your high horse and listen to what everyone is saying, just because a given driver is WHQL certified does not mean it is of high qaulity, it is like stated at the beginning of this post by DaveW a money making scheme by Microsoft, you also stated Until MS stamps them with approval that they tested it to work with the "WHOLE" operating system, then Creatives assurances mean nothing. so what your saying is that with Microsofts own drivers that are WHQL certified I shouldn't have any problem using them in, say, Windows ME or 98 or XP, well gee I must have had the wrong OS on my computer for the last 2 years, and all this time i thought I was running ME, damn. Well my point is, is that even Microsoft's own WHQL certified drivers don't always work seemlessly with its own OS, now according to you being these are certified they aren't beta's, but my experience had always been that if the drivers don't work exactly the way they are supposed to then they would be considered beta, hell being Windows itself doesn't always run the way its supposed to then technically its beta too, I my self have used dozens of drivers on my sysytems in the past that were WHQL certified and were buggy as hell, whereas I've used uncertified drivers on the same systems and have had little problems with them, besides I'd trust creatives drivers even if they weren't WHQL certified, because creative has been in the hardware business a hell of a long time, ive been using the SBlive drivers for 2 whole years only updating them once & haven't had a single problem yet, thats not including the Creative Mpeg2 card I have in my system also of which Ive never had a single problem with, also take in to consideration that the audigy has only been around for like, what, only a year or so, & being that theyve just come out with the audigy2, i'd say that there is still some bugs to be worked out of the drivers, that is the most likely problem with them. Another thing that you HAVE TO take into consideration is that it may not be the drivers for said device per say, but another device or device driver interacting with said drivers in an unpredictable way, this would not be creatives fault at all, but just bad luck, the new drivers may have just simply resolved this conflict?

Besides if your that DAMN disatisfied with Creative products then stop using them, its not like their the only game in town & buy a competitor's product like Hercules's products I believe there products are on par if not in some instances higher quality than some of Creatives. Also consider that not all creative products are as "bad" as the audigy & the like, remember that Creative Labs also purchased 3DLabs, yeah you know the high-end CAD\CAM graphics card company, I doubt that their drivers are as "bad" as creatives!!!

ShyguyMX6
11-06-02, 08:30 PM
Just curious is every single, last, little piece of hardware on your system MS certified, be honest, also does it, your system, work seemlessly without a single problem, because for someone so hung up on having your hardware MS "certified" I should hope your system is as solid as a rock.
You also stated, It's MS OS, they know what is and isn't good... , sure its true about the OS being theirs, but if you havent been keeping up with the news in the states, part of the whole justice department court case is that MS isn't giving up all the specs on windows to allow other companies the ability to make software that much more compatible with windows, also if MS had to do this then there would be no need for WHQL.

F**K, That's it I'm sick of typing this crap, DUDE JUST GIVE IT UP ON THE WHOLE WHQL CRAP & DON"T BUY ANY MORE HARDWARE THAT ISN"T WHQL CERTIFIED.

thcdru2k
11-06-02, 08:45 PM
anyway


I GOT 10 BUCKS ON FLUKES NEXT POST HAVING TO DO WITH SOMETHING ON THE LINES OF CREATIVE SUCKS! :D

netviper13
11-06-02, 08:52 PM
Hercules sucks!!!!!!

*runs and hides behind a large rock*

:D


(note: those of you who don't get the totally facetious nature of that, please ignore this)

The Baron
11-06-02, 09:37 PM
Creative sucks... but not as much as Fluke's mom ;)

I'm sorry, it was so obvious, I couldn't resist... :p

ShyguyMX6
11-06-02, 09:39 PM
Either that or something about all that crap I just posted above, defending MS or something?

Switch
11-07-02, 02:09 AM
I'm not seeing the point to all this. Fluke, you make it sound like Creative is the only sound card, or any hardware for that matter, manufacture that doesn't get WHQL certified drivers... I tell you this, my Hercules Fortisimo II's drivers aren't WHQL certified and they are very sound. My Nvidia Dets aren't WHQL certified and again no problems. In fact as far as video cards go, I find that the WHQL drivers from nvidia have more problems than the non-whql; just a personal experience though. I think the only WHQL certified driver in my whole machine is my Dlink NIC card. Give it a break, and stop wining about WHQL, it means nothing.

You want your problem fixed? Throw your card in the garbage, spend the relatively low amount of money and get a different brand. If you do that and still have trouble, then we might listen to you, be it you don't continue this foolish ranting.