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View Full Version : On Shadow Ops Athlon 64 gets 64 bits booty!


MUYA
09-19-04, 12:29 PM
http://pc.ign.com/articles/549/549020p1.html

September 17, 2004 - Atari announced today that it will be delivering a special 64-bit edition of Shadow Ops: Red Mercury for the PC, in addition to the 32-bit version, which they state will provide "improved textures, better image quality, faster game performance and an enhanced gameplay experience."

Monica Behncke, director of Customer Centric Marketing for AMD says, "AMD and Atari have collaborated extensively to optimize a version of Shadow Ops: Red Mercury specifically for the AMD 64-bit processor to bring the cinematic elements of the game to life in a way not possible in a 32-bit computing environment. Gamers who use AMD64 processors and install the 64-bit version of Shadow Ops: Red Mercury, get access to the 64-bit only level of detail, with mind-blowing texture quality, enormous map sizes and amazingly enhanced artificial intelligence, creating an exceptional game play experience."

According to the release, the PC version will also include expanded multiplayer with more maps and more modes including deathmatch, team deathmatch, CTF, and "Escort the V.I.P." Shadow Ops is slated for a September 21st release.


Interesting.....

CaptNKILL
09-19-04, 01:47 PM
Why the hell would a 64bit processor effect texture quality? Map size is a bit of a stretch too...

Artificial inteligence I guess makes sense... Id have to see it to believe it.

Sazar
09-19-04, 01:53 PM
wrt texture and image quality... might just be PR...

I spose I'll have to run the beta winxp-64 to play this demo :(

nVestor
09-19-04, 04:25 PM
Kinda old, but did anyone notice the difference it made?

http://www.atari.com/shadowops/us/amd.html

Did anyone see the vids from GDC04 come to think of it?

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/DevelopWithAMD/0,,30_2252_7451_10892,00.html

And no, it doesn't require a 64bit OS in order to run the game in 64bit. :)

Star_Hunter
09-19-04, 04:26 PM
Why the hell would a 64bit processor effect texture quality? Map size is a bit of a stretch too...

Artificial inteligence I guess makes sense... Id have to see it to believe it.

Thats cuz they did add more detail ect in the 64-bit ver not just because its 64-bit.... pretty simple 64-bit ver runs faster so they decide to add more detail.

nVestor
09-19-04, 04:37 PM
Here is the official press release:

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_543~90324,00.html

ynnek
09-19-04, 04:59 PM
sounds like a publicity stunt

revbatboy
09-19-04, 06:37 PM
Nice, Finally get use of the 64 in my A64

CaptNKILL
09-19-04, 06:52 PM
Thats cuz they did add more detail ect in the 64-bit ver not just because its 64-bit.... pretty simple 64-bit ver runs faster so they decide to add more detail.
The processor has nothing to do with textures and rendering, thats all based on the GPU and memory bandwidth. Having a CPU thats 32bit, 64bit or 82349234bit wont change your GPUs ability to map and filter textures.

And 64bit doesnt run faster. As far as I know, it just allows more instructions to be used... if they can make something take advantage of that in a way that speeds things up, then it will run faster. But it wont help in GPU limited cases. Not one bit.

-=DVS=-
09-19-04, 08:26 PM
Tried the demo , game is very arcade like mehh not interested.

CaptNKILL
09-19-04, 10:16 PM
Kinda old, but did anyone notice the difference it made?

http://www.atari.com/shadowops/us/amd.html

Did anyone see the vids from GDC04 come to think of it?

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/DevelopWithAMD/0,,30_2252_7451_10892,00.html

And no, it doesn't require a 64bit OS in order to run the game in 64bit. :)
Bah, thats deffinitely PR crap.

The 32bit shots look like crap, the 64bit shots look up to par with most other games coming out now. Its their own damn fault if they disabled high texture\shadow details for people who dont buy Athlon 64s. I wont buy it if it looks like those first shots, no way. Not many people have Athlon 64s... they are shooting themselves in the foot by saying the game looks bad without one.

Cheimison
09-20-04, 12:29 AM
Why the hell would a 64bit processor effect texture quality? Map size is a bit of a stretch too...
64 bit processors compute 64 instructions at a time. Thus a 128 instruction count is processed in two passes, as opposed to 4 with a 32 bit processor. Thus it is 'faster'. This frees up resources, thus more can be spent on graphics processing (which is still done partially by CPU) and map volume information.

CaptNKILL
09-20-04, 03:01 AM
64 bit processors compute 64 instructions at a time. Thus a 128 instruction count is processed in two passes, as opposed to 4 with a 32 bit processor. Thus it is 'faster'. This frees up resources, thus more can be spent on graphics processing (which is still done partially by CPU) and map volume information.
I dont think CPUs do that much for texturing... they have more than enough to do with AI, physics and geometry... i dont think the little resources that might be used for texturing could possibly warrent doubling or trippling the texture resolution as shown in those screen shots.

Besides, textures are stored in video memory (usually), if the CPU needed to do anything with them, youd be constantly swapping over the AGP bus to system memory. Im pretty sure it doesnt work that way.

Star_Hunter
09-20-04, 06:30 AM
The processor has nothing to do with textures and rendering, thats all based on the GPU and memory bandwidth. Having a CPU thats 32bit, 64bit or 82349234bit wont change your GPUs ability to map and filter textures.

And 64bit doesnt run faster. As far as I know, it just allows more instructions to be used... if they can make something take advantage of that in a way that speeds things up, then it will run faster. But it wont help in GPU limited cases. Not one bit.

The Athlon 64 has more registers when in 64-bit mode, in 32-bit mode the extra ones are off. That is where the performance difference comes from. Due to that performance they can add in more. (although I am sure the performance would be find anyways, its also a PR type deal.)

Nutty
09-20-04, 08:42 AM
64 bit processors compute 64 instructions at a time. Thus a 128 instruction count is processed in two passes, as opposed to 4 with a 32 bit processor. Thus it is 'faster'. This frees up resources, thus more can be spent on graphics processing (which is still done partially by CPU) and map volume information.


Completely and utterly wrong.

64bit cpu's excute instructions 64bits long as opposed to 32bits long. (When running in native 64bit mode). Their register widths are 64bit, as opposed to 32bit, so maths on very big integer numbers can be done more efficiently. The amount of instructions it performs at the same time is do with the pipeline depth, which has very little basis on the size of instructions it executes.

Also the A64 has alot more general purpose registers, so an .exe specifically compiled for it, can potentially create better code in areas that are very variable heavy. Instead of storing variables on the stack, it can keep more data in registers, which is faster.

CaptNKILL
09-20-04, 09:46 AM
I think we need to see some benchmarks :p

Im still skeptical... Ive never heard of CPUs having anything to do with texturing, so unless 32bit CPUs are limiting texture resolution somehow, why does a 64bit get better textures? I understand, speeding up the whole thing means you can add more details, but if the details arent something the CPU controls anyway, then you can increase texture resolution regardless of the CPU's power.

I honestly dont know what to think of this, I dont think we have had any 64bit games yet. Id love to see some benchmarks... it really doesnt make sense to me though.

Holy Smoke
09-20-04, 04:12 PM
The whole point of 3d accelerators to begin with was to offload ALL texture-processing OFF the cpu, and the point of implementing pixel shaders was because the cpu CAN'T access the textures once they've been transferred to the graphics card.

So, no... this is pure PR bs. I don't know if I'm right about this part, but the only case (that I can imagine) where a 64-bit processor would have any *major* effect on texture size performance is in a case where the textures exceed a 32-bit processor's 4gb limit. And, well, a 2048x2048x32 texture only takes 16 MEGAbytes, so we're a good ways off until it becomes a limiting factor.

Of course, 64-bit optimizations should be able to help in other cases, like geometry, AI, and physics.

Nitz Walsh
09-20-04, 04:30 PM
The whole point of 3d accelerators to begin with was to offload ALL texture-processing OFF the cpu, and the point of implementing pixel shaders was because the cpu CAN'T access the textures once they've been transferred to the graphics card.

So, no... this is pure PR bs. I don't know if I'm right about this part, but the only case (that I can imagine) where a 64-bit processor would have any *major* effect on texture size performance is in a case where the textures exceed a 32-bit processor's 4gb limit. And, well, a 2048x2048x32 texture only takes 16 MEGAbytes, so we're a good ways off until it becomes a limiting factor.

Of course, 64-bit optimizations should be able to help in other cases, like geometry, AI, and physics.
Exactly. This is strictly a promo deal, the PR is...well, it's PR. Nuff said.

Not that the 64-bit version won't have additional performance - it might simply due to the added registers in the A64 - but it has absolutely bunk to do with increasing the texture quality. The shots provided indicate the 32-bit version has been crippled, rather than the A64 version being propelled forward due to "64 BITZ OF POWER11!!".

Leech
09-20-04, 07:28 PM
This isn't even the first 64bit game. There is a port of Unreal Tournament 2004 to 64-bit linux. Icculus (Ryan Gordan) did the port, anyone interested in if the 64-bit would help textures, etc. would do well to send him an email. http://icculus.org

Leech

CaptNKILL
09-21-04, 07:08 AM
They are sort of milking the thing the console market did a few years ago...

Remember when everything was 16bit, 32bit or 64bit? That had squat to do with the actual power of the system, and I almost wonder if the "bit" thing was made up entirely (just as a way to gauge the consoles power in compairison to others).

I mean, people thought the Gameboy Advance had the power of a Playstation because it was "32bit". When the PS2 and XBox came around, no one even mention bits because it didnt mean anything any more (it never really did, but i guess people got smarter).

Heh, sorry for the OT... i realize A64s are beasts, im not downplaying 64bit CPUs (though their performance advantage is probably 90% related to the integrated memory controler, not that they are 64bit) :D

jbirney
09-21-04, 10:26 AM
This isn't even the first 64bit game. There is a port of Unreal Tournament 2004 to 64-bit linux. Icculus (Ryan Gordan) did the port, anyone interested in if the 64-bit would help textures, etc. would do well to send him an email. http://icculus.org

Leech

Since this is built off the unreal engine, I wounder how much of his 64 bit work is used (granted opengl vrs d3d so not all of it...)

nVestor
09-21-04, 10:51 AM
And no, it doesn't require a 64bit OS in order to run the game in 64bit. :)
I'm sorry, I was wrong apparently. I could have sworn I was watching a video of behind the game that said it wasn't necessary to have a 64bit OS in order to run the game in 64bit.
After purchasing "Shadow Ops: Red Mercury," gamers can immediately take advantage of the game by installing a public trial version of Microsoft® Windows® XP Pro x86 Edition on an AMD64 platform and installing relevant 64-bit drivers. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/64bit/evaluation/upgrade.mspx
Again, I am sorry for the apparent misinformation. :|

Holy Smoke
09-21-04, 02:19 PM
Here's a few bench comparisons between 64-bit and 32-bit (among other things), including Quake3 and what I presume to be a 64-bit optimized version of UT2004.

http://www.linuxhardware.org/article.pl?sid=04/09/17/1453239&mode=thread

CaptNKILL
09-21-04, 03:31 PM
Here's a few bench comparisons between 64-bit and 32-bit (among other things), including Quake3 and what I presume to be a 64-bit optimized version of UT2004.

http://www.linuxhardware.org/article.pl?sid=04/09/17/1453239&mode=thread
Seeing how the performance barely increased in those games, I really doubt this 64bit edition will be more than a PR stunt.