All 3dmark05 test to utilize SM3.0

[Omega53]

http://discuss.futuremark.com/forum/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=monext3dmark&Number=4388693&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0&fpart=1

[jbirney]

http://discuss.futuremark.com/forum/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=monext3dmark&Number=4388693&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0&fpart=1

Thats cool. I also hope it lets the user run on other PS versions if the card can (PS2.0, PS2.0a, PS2.0b) so we can see how each version works on the said hardware...

[Nick[FM]]

Thats cool. I also hope it lets the user run on other PS versions if the card can (PS2.0, PS2.0a, PS2.0b) so we can see how each version works on the said hardware...
In the Pro version of 3DMark05 you can choose between (of course depending on what your hardware is capable of) SM3.0 and SM2.0 (PS2.a, VS2.a, PS2.b, PS2.0, VS2.0).

[jbirney]

Worm,

cool except for the wording "pro version"....no comparision for us cheap skates eh? :) :) :)

[jAkUp]

New screenshot!!!!

http://img29.exs.cx/img29/4715/3dmark05_ship_big1.jpg

[Shamrock]

how do I fly that thing? WSAD, with spacebar as boost? what about my cannons! ;)

[Pandora's Box]

hmmm. it doesnt utilize sm3.0. it uses fp16/fp32. not full fp32 which is a requirement of sm3.0

[Omega53]

hmmm. it doesnt utilize sm3.0. it uses fp16/fp32. not full fp32 which is a requirement of sm3.0

True, but you have to option to run Full FP32 if you want.

[Pandora's Box]

i wonder what the default test will be though. will it use fp32 all the time or will it use fp16 calls.

[Pandora's Box]

this is what im trying to say:

"If FP 16 is going to give the same image quality results as FP24 and up, then that would be a clear advantage for Nvidia hardware if they are allowed to use mixed mode. Also Because ATI only supports up to FP24 as of this time, you can't develop a shader that would require FP32 to retain full image quality on ATI hardware. So FP24 by default has to be the standard precision.

I guess this does make it quite difficult to come up with a fair and unbiased benchmark."

[fivefeet8]

hmmm. it doesnt utilize sm3.0. it uses fp16/fp32. not full fp32 which is a requirement of sm3.0

Partial precision has been a part of SM2/3 since the Dx9 was released. It's not a question of being SM3, but a question of precision.

SM3 requires FP32 to be Full Precision and anything lower to be partial precision. SM2 requires atleast FP24 to be FUll Precision. Anything lower is partial precision. Partial precision or Full precision, it's still SM3 or SM2.

3dmark2k5 is suppose to have options to test it in pure FP32 or Partial Precision.

[Nick[FM]]

True, but you have to option to run Full FP32 if you want.
Yes, that is true but only in the Pro version.

i wonder what the default test will be though. will it use fp32 all the time or will it use fp16 calls.
The deafult is a mixed setting with 16/32. We use 16bit where it doesn't affect the rendering quality.

[Pandora's Box]

and how often is it that it doesnt affect the rendering quality (using fp16 that is)

[Nick[FM]]

and how often is it that it doesnt affect the rendering quality (using fp16 that is)
It would be best to ask our lead programmer for a more detailed answer, but as far as I know there are some operations which can be calculated/done in 16bit which doesn't affect the rendering quality.

[rellingsen]

hmmm. it doesnt utilize sm3.0. it uses fp16/fp32. not full fp32 which is a requirement of sm3.0

A SM3.0 card only has to be able to do FP32, not use it all the time. Partial precision FP16 is allowed in the DX9.0c spec's for SM3.0. So using both FP16/32 is still fully SM3.0 compliant.
This is a cut and paste from the SDK.

Shader Model 3

Specifying Full or Partial Precision

ps_3_0 (and ps_2_x) provides support for 2 levels of precision:


ps_3_0
Full fp32 or higher
Partial precision fp16=s10e5

ps_2_0
Full fp24=s16e7 or higher
Partial precision fp16=s10e5

ps_3_0 supports more presision than ps_2_0 does. By default all operations occur at the full precision level.

Partial precision (see Modifiers for ps_2_0 and Above) is requested by adding the _pp modifier to shader code (provided that the underlying implementation supports it). Implementations are always free to ignore the modifier and perform the affected operations in full precision.

[Pandora's Box]

']It would be best to ask our lead programmer for a more detailed answer, but as far as I know there are some operations which can be calculated/done in 16bit which doesn't affect the rendering quality.


Can you ask him on my behalf? I have really no idea who he is.


Dont suppose you have any idea what scores the 6800 Ultra and X800 XT PE are getting in your tests do you?

[Nick[FM]]

Can you ask him on my behalf? I have really no idea who he is.


Dont suppose you have any idea what scores the 6800 Ultra and X800 XT PE are getting in your tests do you?
I will as soon as I see him around!

I know the results of most cards/systems, but can't talk about them just yet! :)

[ChrisRay]

hmmm. it doesnt utilize sm3.0. it uses fp16/fp32. not full fp32 which is a requirement of sm3.0

No Fp32 is required to be supported by SM 3.0. However Partial Precision (Fp16) Can still be utilized by SM 3.0 as well.


SM 3.0 Has two precisions flags.


(Full Precision) Fp32, And Partial Precision (FP24, FP16), Anything under FP32 is recognised as partial precision.

[Danhill]

Will there be some sort of a test that runs all the ps shader models like
PS 2.0 - 50 fps
PS 2.0a - 55 fps
PS 2.0b - 54 fps
PS 3.0 - 60 fps

[Nick[FM]]

Will there be some sort of a test that runs all the ps shader models like
PS 2.0 - 50 fps
PS 2.0a - 55 fps
PS 2.0b - 54 fps
PS 3.0 - 60 fps
In 3DMark05 Pro you can choose whatever shader model your graphics card supports (minimum 2.0 and higher), but it defaults to the highest possible.

[Danhill]

']In 3DMark05 Pro you can choose whatever shader model your graphics card supports (minimum 2.0 and higher), but it defaults to the highest possible.

Tack Nicklas,

I was thinking of such a thing would be intresting to compare the shaders between the cards;

ATI XXXX

PS 2.0 - 50 fps
PS 2.0a - 55 fps
PS 2.0b - 54 fps
PS 3.0 - N/A :firedevil

Nvidia 6800 XXXX
PS 2.0 - 50 fps
PS 2.0a - 55 fps
PS 2.0b - 54 fps
PS 3.0 - 60 fps :clap2:

Would be intresting to see what card has best performance in each shader, like for example shader 2,0b