NV48 coming soon?

[Domell]

Hmmm.Maybe -Yes but thought about improvements like NV20->NV25 no more....
Improvements which can slightly increase performance (about 5-10%)..
These improvements and increase clock speed to 475 mhz can give 20% performance hit....But as i said- this is only my opinion......

[Graphicmaniac]

the thread has been opened the 28th september, now is the 3rd november and the answer to the topic question "NV48 coming soon?" then was definetively "NO" lol :(

[msxyz]

6800U are just starting to appear in decent quantities, there's no point in introducing another core. A die shrink (as well as the transition to native PCIe interface) is on the horizon but, for now, only 12 pipeline variants are interested. I suspect that IBM manufacturing process, despite many source claimed the contrary, is still the best NVidia can afford for such a complex chip. The real setback for NVidia is probably that IBM plants are mostly used for its own chips leaving little room for high volume runs of 3rd party cores.

[Graphicmaniac]

wel.. but keep in mind that nv48 was into the .inf of the latest drivers

[Domell]

I think that NV48 will be realeased in December this year or January next year...
There is no point to introduce a new core????I think NVIDIA must indroduce a new core because their arch-rival-ATI-will realease their new core r480 and NVIDIA must have competitor to r480 but NV48 is more likely to be introduce December this year because(according to rumours)NV47 is likely to be realeased in Q2 next year(i think April or May)
Of course NV50 will appear in November or December 2005....
Maybe i `m wrong..........

[retsam]

have you guys every thought that maybe just maybe the nv48 was shelved.... look at all the rumors floating about the r500 coming in q1 ... nv cant release an nv48 and there next gen all in the same quarter .....

[Domell]

But NVIDIA MUST release their refresh(NV48) because ATI will indroduce their r480 and then may grab NVIDIAs position....NVIDIA must have competitor to r480.However, they may cancel NV47 and introduce NV50 in Q3 2005 to compete ATIs r520 which will be released in Q2 2005....

[Daneel Olivaw]

I believe NV will only release refreshes in the next year. And I do not believe this to be a bad thing. Remember, Ati's biggest problem is availability.

[Domell]

Hmmm..probably YES..NVIDIA will only refresh in January 2005..Maybe NV48 is delayed because it is made in 110nm technology...
As you know NV47 is likely to have 24 pipes...Maybe NV48 will be NV47 and ``real``NV47 will be cancelled????
This version which said that NV48 could have 24 pipes(or 16x2???) explaines information that NV48 is said to be 2x more efficient than NV40..

http://www.vr-zone.com/?i=941&s=1

[Subtestube]

But NVIDIA MUST release their refresh(NV48) because ATI will indroduce their r480 and then may grab NVIDIAs position....NVIDIA must have competitor to r480.However, they may cancel NV47 and introduce NV50 in Q3 2005 to compete ATIs r520 which will be released in Q2 2005....

Bad move by nVIDIA if they do (in my opinion)... if they really can push the NV40 architecture to rival the R500 through the NV47, that'd be BY FAR the best thing for them. Introducing an entirely new architecture is expensive, and assuming that the R520 is actually SM 3.0 and nothing more (apart from pure speed), I can't see a good reason for them to introduce an entirely fresh architecture. It'd be a massive expense, and possibly quite unnecessary.

Edit: Also, 16x2 is 32, not 16. I'd imagine if the NV47 really is ultra-wide (24 pipes) it really will be a genuine 24x1 (48x0) architecture. (At my guess).

[Domell]

Maybe YES that NVIDIA do bad move with push NV47 to battle with r520 bau they must introduce it because their new graphic core based on NV50 will be finished in Q3 2005 and without strong high-end product in first half of 2005 ATI may grab some part of market...
I think when NV47 will have 24 pipes clocked at ~500mhz 8-10 Vertex pipelines and memory clocked about 1,6 ghz+some core improvements can outperform ATIs r520

[gamerpro28]

According to the Inquirer, in a word, no.

For more words, here's the whole article:

Nvidia has canned NV48

No point making 20 MHz faster card


By Fuad Abazovic: Wednesday 01 December 2004, 22:01

ATI's RADEON X850XT PE is the last speed refresh that we will see this winter. Usually ATI's announcement comes close to Nvidia announcement but this time it won't happen.
Nvidia decided to cancel its NV48 project and reliable sources are claiming that you won't see those cards at all. According to the original plan we were supposed to see those cards in Q1 2005 but Nvidia realised that it made no sense at all to push a 20 to 30 MHz faster card.

NV40 and R420 chips will be known forever as the ones that companies pushed to their limits and Nvidia didn’t want to disappoint its customers with a marginally faster card. All it could manage was a 20-30MHz push, hardly anything to scream home about.

Nvidia will make NV45 cards available to market to fill PCIe high end market and that’s how it will remain until the new chip walks down the red carpet.

Nvidia has a good workhorse and a colt to beat X850, it's called SLI and includes two graphic cards working together. X850 XT PE can not match two NV45, 6800 Ultra cards in action.

We are in the dark about Nvidia's next move but it does count a lot of SLI. Who knows, it may be in the dark too? µ

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=19992

[Daneel Olivaw]

If NVidia makes SLI setups available and affordable, making single 6800GT cheaper and Ultra more available, that's gonna crush ATI a lot more than releasing a half-assed 'top' unavailable card.

Selling is what counts.

[gamerpro28]

The small speed bump of the canned nv48 shows that nvidia has not gone to the higher frequencies of the low-k process that ATI has achieved at TSMC.

Until they can use low-k, expect small increases unless they redesign the architecture. This could involve something along the lines of ATI's use of computer memory that has been talked about on the INQ, or multiple GPU's on one board.

[JoKeRr]

The small speed bump of the canned nv48 shows that nvidia has not gone to the higher frequencies of the low-k process that ATI has achieved at TSMC.

Until they can use low-k, expect small increases unless they redesign the architecture. This could involve something along the lines of ATI's use of computer memory that has been talked about on the INQ, or multiple GPU's on one board.

NV40 is manufactured by IBM, NV never had the intention of Using Low-K from TSMC. The next chip is prob. going to be manufactured with 110nm process or even better, 90nm. Check your facts b4 posting.

[gamerpro28]

TSMC had been nvidia's choice of fab for many years.

See the link below to catch up on the news from Digitimes on TSMC and nvidia's relationship. The 110 nm chip has been produced for some time.

http://www.digitimes.com/Tornado/V4/SearchEnd.asp

IBM's foundry was chosen for the NV40 early release as TSMC really bungled the FX5x series a couple of years ago. I was at Comdex that year and spent a lot of time with nvidia exec's. Expectations did not meet reality by a wide margin for the FX5x series and nvidia realized they had to give IBM a try until TSMC got their act together. From the looks of ATI's success with using low-k in their newest chips, nvidia will be evenutually using the process in future chips.

[gamerpro28]

"NV40 is manufactured by IBM, NV never had the intention of Using Low-K from TSMC. The next chip is prob. going to be manufactured with 110nm process or even better, 90nm. Check your facts b4 posting."


http://www.beyond3d.com/previews/nvidia/nv43agp/

The Graphics Chip
Before we take a detailed look at the NVIDIA reference board itself, we'll take a refresher of some of the key properties and specifications of the NV43 chip that is at the core of the 6600 GT.

Chip Specifications
Chipset NV43

Silicon Process 110nm (TSMC)

Transistors ~143 Million
Die Size 150mm2
Packaging Flipchip
Pipeline Configuration 8 / 4 / 8
(Textures / Pixels / Z Samples per clock)
Memory Interface 128-bit DDR/GDDR-2/GDDR-3 interface
Display 2x 400MHz 10-bit DAC's
165 MHz TMDS transmitter (DVI 1.0 compliant) and TV Out
Interface Standard PEG x16


The NV43 chip itself does not differ on the AGP board to the PCI Express versions since it is up to the job of the HSI bridge chip to facilitate the translation of the different interface types.

The NV43 chip is fully derived from the NV4x architecture and as such it inherits the same features, albeit at an expected lower performance, as the high end GeForce 6800 Series.

(More information from link given above)

.................................................. .................................................. ..
http://www.beyond3d.com/misc/chipcomp/?view=chipdetails&id=71&orderby=release_date&order=Order&cname=

NV43 Based Boards:
NVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT 128MB
NVIDIA GeForce 6600 128MB
NVIDIA GeForce 6200 128MB
NVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT 128MB

[Graphicmaniac]

Nv48 has not been canned

has just been delayed



also if nvidia said nv50 should come before end of 2005 ...

[AthlonXP1800]

Nvidia had NV48 A1 revision back in September clocked at 500MHz, when R480 launched and Nvidia see no pointed to launched NV48 and decided that NV48 will be target at R520. Nvidia have 7 months plenty of times to make NV48 as powerful or more powerful than R520, I think Nvidia will receive NV48 A2 revision by now or in the New Year 2005 clocked at 600MHz then tweaked, tuned, fix bug and sent the final design to TSMC 0.11nm and bring out a final NV48 A3 revision clocked at 700MHz in time for Q2 2005. :D

[superklye]

Nvidia had NV48 A1 revision back in September clocked at 500MHz, when R480 launched and Nvidia see no pointed to launched NV48 and decided that NV48 will be target at R520. Nvidia have 7 months plenty of times to make NV48 as powerful or more powerful than R520, I think Nvidia will receive NV48 A2 revision by now or in the New Year 2005 clocked at 600MHz then tweaked, tuned, fix bug and sent the final design to TSMC 0.11nm and bring out a final NV48 A3 revision clocked at 700MHz in time for Q2 2005. :D
That would be insanely ridiculous.

[AthlonXP1800]

That would be insanely ridiculous.

lol no it not ridiculous, you would said "Thatt would be insanely overclocked". Look at NV43 - Geforce 6600 clocked at 300Mhz, many people and reviewers overclocked it to 600Mhz without issues and all are very impressed with 0.11nm, they called it "insanely overclocked". I think R520 will be launch at 600Mhz for top end PE version. (xmasmile)

[superklye]

lol no it not ridiculous, you would said "Thatt would be insanely overclocked". Look at NV43 - Geforce 6600 clocked at 300Mhz, many people and reviewers overclocked it to 600Mhz without issues and all are very impressed with 0.11nm, they called it "insanely overclocked". I think R520 will be launch at 600Mhz for top end PE version. (xmasmile)
I meant it in a good way because that's double the speed of my GT. I want one!

Too bad I'll be out of the step-up time from eVGA.com by the time this comes out. :(

[JoKeRr]

Nvidia had NV48 A1 revision back in September clocked at 500MHz, when R480 launched and Nvidia see no pointed to launched NV48 and decided that NV48 will be target at R520. Nvidia have 7 months plenty of times to make NV48 as powerful or more powerful than R520, I think Nvidia will receive NV48 A2 revision by now or in the New Year 2005 clocked at 600MHz then tweaked, tuned, fix bug and sent the final design to TSMC 0.11nm and bring out a final NV48 A3 revision clocked at 700MHz in time for Q2 2005. :D

0.11nm at 600/700mhz core?? I doubt it. maybe with extra cooling and extra core voltage, but can't promise the yield. I'll be more than happy if NV can clock NV48 beyond 475, even at 400, u wouldn't want to set ur butt on it. (snowlol) (xmassign2

plus each revision costs $$$, and the improvement will be very limited the more revisions you have.

[Graphicmaniac]

i don't think it will be clocket to 700...


i think Nvidia will try double performance

or maybe more coz R520 should provide a really terrific power coz is the next Xbox2 GPU


about this ... how can ATI release R520 in April if Xbox2 is not come out yet?

if they do so they will kill Xbox2 even before its born ...

[Domell]

I suppose NV48 will be clocked MAX about 500mhz when it will be made in 110nm tech. but if NV will decide to produce NV48 in 90nm process then will be possibility to get about 600mhz....