Is this B$?

[Kruno]

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/3/14/133903.shtml

This article seems like B$ to me. What's everyone elses opinion?

[Dazz]

America is big, as such makes alot of enemies.

[vampireuk]

That article is rather worrying =\

Who remembers that big ass china thread we had ages ago? That was one hell of a flame fest:eek:

[Kruno]

Well if we have mature posters it shouldn't be too much of a problem. I just hope someone doesn't come out and mouth off peoples opinions.

[vampireuk]

bleh, it happens in subjects like this someone normally comes out and shouts something like "it will never happen we are too strong" and it goes off from there :rolleyes: :D

[Kruno]

Must give those @ers a boot where the sun don't shine :D
That's just plain arrogant to say something like that anyway. When you think about it, the missile defense is not 100% and any number of nukes can get through. If G.B wants his SDI system to do it's job he will have to go through the loop to make sure scientists are constantly researching ways to make the system more accurate and faster aiming and luanching missiles alot better.

[vampireuk]

I think the missile defence programme would just increase tensions, another thing I cant understand is why the media was making such a fuss over the agreement between Russia and America over the dismantling of nuclear warheads. Its not a great step they still both have thousands left what is the point in having several thousand nuclear weapons?:rolleyes:

I also think bush refused to sign the agreement in one case

the pic says it all ;):D

[Kruno]

What I don't understand is why other countries are peeved at the US over the SDI system?
Also why all the bloody protests?

[vampireuk]

They are not annoyed at the US or its people, just mainly George Bush hes universally not liked. Personally I think hes a war mongering old git whos trying trying to continue daddys legacy especially with him wanting to invade Iraq. The only beef I ever have is when the occasional american thinks that the US is the world and nothing else matters (no one on these boards thank god) :D

I also have a severe dislike for our own leader Tony Blair hes Bushes lap dog who has no interested in his own country and his only working for himself to become the head of the european superstate.

[Kruno]

You are forgetting John Howard (Australia's PM). One politicion called him an ass licker. Howard was supposed to discuss free trade instead he goes to Washington and discusses Iraq. On top of that JH agreed to all US terms and never negotiated once for extra things (cheaper pc parts? :)) or whatever. Australia is G.B best friend. If Bush jumped off a cliff I'm sure Howard will follow.

[vampireuk]

see thats what annoys me about "leaders" they follow someone else and dont really seem to care about the people in their own country:mad:

[Kruno]

Well you see...politics isn't about caring or doing anything for the people. It's all about how much @$$ licking you can do before your term expires.

[vampireuk]

The main thing is if Bush invaded Iraq Blair would commit our troops too which would make everyone pissed off at us too.

Its ok for the Royals and major politicians they get protection from any terrorist attack the queen even gets rapier ground to air missiles. What do we get? nothing:mad:

[Remi]

Originally posted by K.I.L.E.R
This article seems like B$ to me. What's everyone elses opinion? [/B]

It says it all: "In the next 40 years, China will attempt to take its place among the world's superpowers".

They just make sure the world notice.

[vampireuk]

They could already be classed as a world super power, although lets hope everything stays nice and calm, heh:cool:

[DIMA]

Honestly, I have no idea! :confused:

[vampireuk]

*sets up a fort consisting mainly of sofa cushions*

Now im safe from attack:D

[t6_shadow]

First off I would like to say I am NOT American. That being said China is NOT I repeat NOT a threat to America. Say what you want about whatever their war machines contain but if a war did break out it would be China vs NATO. Which they would lose horribly to. NATO is just to large.

[vampireuk]

I think if nukes were used no one would win

[DaveW]

I think if nukes were used no one would win

Actually I think we would win. China only has only a couple of hundred nukes, most of which are short range, unreliable, inaccurate and low yield compared to what NATO has. The missiles also take hours to fuel and get ready, NATO aircraft would probably destroy most of them on the ground before they had chance to launch.

Iraq is a problem that needs to be dealt with, but I am tired on Bush's postering and idle threats when he doesn't seem ready to actually do anything. His father should have done a proper job of it 10 years ago.

[vampireuk]

yeah I think Bush is causing my problems just by threatening all the time, something has to be done about it but I just have a feeling hes gonna screw up

[Feanor]

I personally don't care too much about the Chinese government's complaint here. These are the same people who have committed acts that could be described as genocide against the Tibetans, were ready to mow over their own citizens in 1989 with tanks, and quite frankly is not well liked even in China.

We had some discussions about this when I was taking a Ti Chi class last spring semester. Some people had been to China and from the accounts they told me. There are some real problems with that government (not just in the estimation of foreigners, but in the estimation of people who live there).

As to Tiawan, I don't agree with attempts to make them absolve their independence as a nation (and have not since I heard about this about 1 decade back). The people should be free to chose whether they want to be absorbed into China's system of government or not.

This is also the same government that would make issue because some are willing to listen to the Dalai Lama and even went so far as to kidnap/disappear a 6 year old boy because he is believed to be the next reincarnate of the Penchen Lama. One thing I can say, critisism of many of China's policies and rhetoric is not just some America vs China or Asian thing. There are many in China who are not all to thrilled by their own government or it's policies. From what I've not only seen and read, but also heard from people who have been over there first hand, China's government isn't exactly liked by their own people... I guess it's too late for us to go back and change our responce to the Tianamin Square masacree from "ensure most favored nations trade status at all cost..." to something that might have given the protesters a chance.

[Darth Rancid]

The main reason some people are irritated over the US plans of strategic missile defences is that a nation that could defend itself against a shower of nuke-tipped missiles, could, in both theory and practice, launch a first strike and get away with it.

This was why many western military leaders were worried by the Soviet's Anti-Balistic-Missiles in the 60s or 70s or whatever... that system was defeated by the introduction of MIRVs, the number of incomming warheads would by far to great for the ABMs to handle... If US or any other nation built a system that could stop thousands of nuke-tipped MIRVs comming their way.. the same fear would be valid.

Though personally I don't think any american presiden would be THAT crazy.

As to the china thing, no, they are not a threat right now, they know very well that they'd be just as vaporized themselves if they did a first strike...

And... if America wanted to "deal" with Saddam and Iraq, why couldn't they have done so when they were at it?... Lets not forget that in the early 90s, US, (and oter nations), air and ground forces mad a mess of not only Iraq's military hardware, but much of the civilian infrastructure and such as well... Are they gonna go in there and mess it up for the poor people of Iraq now again, to finish the job they regretted they did not do last time?...
Well, its quite possible that the Iraqis will be quite happy to be rid of Saddam even if it mean another round of bombings... what do I know, I don't live there... but you probably get my meaning....

[netviper13]

IMHO the whole business of the US Government having issues with the Chinese Government is just the US' attempt at making communism look bad.

The US is all about saving face, and PR, so if "we" can make the other superpowers look bad it's all the better.

[Feanor]

Originally posted by netviper13

The US is all about saving face, and PR, so if "we" can make the other superpowers look bad it's all the better.

You know, after seeing the handling of the Tianamin Square masacree, I'd have to say there's some truth in this. When it came to what could be seen as high sounding ideals (spoken by political leaders in the media) and the intent of assuring most favored nations trade status no matter what...that told me a lot for a long time to come.

Yeah there are reasonable issues with the government of China (something many Chinese citizens and I don't mean China's PR machine either will themselves say)...however contrast that... Did people being mowed over by tanks mean nothing?

Among the many things we discussed (well it was actually after we had finished learning the part of the form we were learning for the day) was this American who went to China. He at first thought the Chinese government couldn't be that bad and all these stories of disappearances and the like were just a joke. It couldn't possibly be true. So he, thinking it was a practical joke staged his own disappearance and had the buddy he was traveling with call the Chinese family they were staying with to report the false disappearance.

He laughed afterwards that the Chinese family was so quick to believe that this could even be true, let along left their house in an attempt to intervene at like 2 am. The family was a bit afraid at what could have happened. It was like (after they were found) "I was joking. I can't believe you took this so seriously. These things don't really happen, do they?"

Well they do, and the people weren't too happy to find it was the prank of someone who thought it would make a good prank, not knowing what really goes on over there. Some other people agreed, relating the time they were in China, and one person mentioned some things mentioned (including some of what goes on politically) from friends they have who live over there.

Thing is, if there be issues with the government of China (and there are) the people who live over there are the ones who are the victims of it, and it is they (and not just their government spokespeople who should be listened to before any policy is made). Course I don't expect politicians in any country for that matter to go beyond the PR, and actually do something for those who are under the weight of much of this.