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ppeccin
11-05-04, 12:41 PM
Hello guys. First of all please forget my english. I'm not a native english speaker.

I imagine this kind of question was asked here many times. But I just got my BFG 6800GT OC, and I'm trying to resolve my first issue. Its in DOOM III.

The issue is the following:
- a small hiccup every second. It is NOT a freezing problem, and it is not a constant stutter (like when the card cannot mantain a constant FPS). Is kind if the card does not display the 58th and 59th frame of every 60. No matter the complexity of the scene, its ALWAYS there.
It almost seems like a behavior of the game itself....

I'm using vsync on. Monitor refresh rate at 60Hz.
Fast writes on or off does not make any difference.
Everything at stock speeds, with the latest drivers from nvidia (no beta drivers).

Tried older games in OpenGL (Half life Blue Shift), with vsync on and 60Hz also, NO PROBLEM at all.

Please guys, help me. I've read tons of posts talking about 5 seconds freezes, BSOD, crashing to desktop, etc. My issue is VERY different.

Thank you very much.

------------

AMD A64 3500+ BOX AMD heatsink @ 2300MHz (230x10)
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (BIOS 1.3)
1Gb OCZ 3200 EL Platinum rev 2 (2.5-3-3-10 1T dual channel) @ 230MHz
BFG 6800GT <= arrived!
160Gb Maxtor IDE + 20Gb Samsung IDE
LG 4120B DVD Writer + HP CDRW Writer
Sony 17" Multiscan CRT
Antec TrueControl 550W 24A@12V

jAkUp
11-05-04, 12:55 PM
What quality setting are you using? If you are using ultra quality, set it down to high quality. A 512mb card is recommended for Ultra quality, and looks nearly the same as high quality.

Under ultra quality the game doesnt compress any maps, so you run out of texture memory... causing hiccups when you enter big rooms, when a new monster shows up, etc.

ppeccin
11-05-04, 01:04 PM
What quality setting are you using? If you are using ultra quality, set it down to high quality. A 512mb card is recommended for Ultra quality, and looks nearly the same as high quality.

Under ultra quality the game doesnt compress any maps, so you run out of texture memory... causing hiccups when you enter big rooms, when a new monster shows up, etc.

Thanks. I''m using 1024x768 High quality. But acctualy, it does not matter the resolution or the quality level, the problem is always exactly the same.

Please read my post... I said it does not matter the complexity of the scene. I can be facing a wall in a corridor, with no mosters, nothing. The problems is ALWAYS THERE, like a ticking clock.

Ah, I also do not have any monitoring software active.

I'm curious if everybody has this behavior in DOOM III. It's is SO constant and SO precise that is seems like proposital.

Please help.

red_star
11-05-04, 01:06 PM
It's a Doom 3 engine itself...

jAkUp
11-05-04, 01:15 PM
Never seen that problem before, I would try disabling everything running in the background first, and if that doesnt work try the 66.81 drivers from NV's site here:
http://www.nzone.com/object/nzone_downloads_winxp_2k_66.81.html

ppeccin
11-05-04, 01:16 PM
It's a Doom 3 engine itself...

Really? :)
Do you also have this problem?
So it is not related to my system, and I do not have any trouble with my setup?
That's "good" news...

If so, you mean EVERYBODY gets these hiccups? Strange that people does not complain A LOT about this.
It's a little hiccup, but it bothers me a lot.

Thanks.
Any more thoughts?

ppeccin
11-05-04, 01:18 PM
Never seen that problem before, I would try disabling everything running in the background first, and if that doesnt work try the 66.81 drivers from NV's site here:
http://www.nzone.com/object/nzone_downloads_winxp_2k_66.81.html

I'm NOT running anything in the background.
Of course, I'm still running Windows (SP2), and the essential services.

OK, is it an engine issue or not??? :drooling:

Thanks.

ppeccin
11-05-04, 01:46 PM
Anyone please??? :-(

Zeno
11-05-04, 02:12 PM
Anyone please??? :-(

It's not an engine issue. I don't experience that problem.

My first guess was also that you had some other program running in the background that uses some CPU cycles once per second. You said that isn't the case, though.

Can you turn off sound in Doom3 completely? Try that, maybe it has something to do with your sound card.

It's really hard to diagnose problems like this, unfortunately. You just have to keep fiddling with things until you find out what the cause is. You could try re-formatting and re-installing just windows/drivers/doom, but that's such a pain in the butt I would only recommend it as a last resort. It may not fix your problem either.

Sorry I can't be more help, but I wanted to let you know it's not an engine issue, so keep looking :)

s-flow
11-05-04, 02:31 PM
I posted this back in august..

Just making sure here.. People claim Doom3 running silky
smooth on some systems, but that has to be except the slight
"hickups" every second when walking along straight forward..right?

For me no matter settings this happends. It doesn´t disturb me very
much but I would like to be sure the game was designed like this.
Is it the 60fps limit that make this?

standing still rotating everything is silky smooth.

P4 3.2
6800 GT (61.77 - Aparture 265 - FW+SB=on)
1GB Ram
SB Audigy 2

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=34496

It MUST be the engine.

Iv tried every driverversion and settings I can imagine but the game
behaves the same.. EXCEPT when using "com_fixedTic 1", then it is
smooth but with gamespeed issues.

ppeccin
11-05-04, 02:40 PM
I posted this back in august..



http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=34496

It MUST be the engine.

Iv tried every driverversion and settings I can imagine but the game
behaves the same.. EXCEPT when using "com_fixedTic 1", then it is
smooth but with gamespeed issues.

Hummm.. I get that little hiccup every second EVEN when I'm standing still and rotating. It is like a clock, no matter what is happening in the game. Even if I'm completely still and there is some action in the screen, like a machine moving, I can still see the hiccup...

Any more ideas?
Please: people that have a similar setup as mine, please post your comments.

Thanks.

Kerrysucks
11-05-04, 02:53 PM
Try lowering your AGP to 4X instead of 8X. It's worth a shot and the performance loss is absolutely negligible.

red_star
11-05-04, 03:36 PM
The problem with Doom 3 is related to sound card, and ID Software never sorted out since day 1 in alpha version!!!

Those hiccups are caused by sound. There are some scenes where the frame rate drops for no reason, but in more complex scenes the frame rate is high.

Z stenzil shadow thing is complete crap. J.C. could it done using DX API, and everything would run much faster. Far Cry is way more complex than Doom 3 and runs as twice as better...

ppeccin
11-05-04, 04:14 PM
The problem with Doom 3 is related to sound card, and ID Software never sorted out since day 1 in alpha version!!!

Those hiccups are caused by sound. There are some scenes where the frame rate drops for no reason, but in more complex scenes the frame rate is high.

Z stenzil shadow thing is complete crap. J.C. could it done using DX API, and everything would run much faster. Far Cry is way more complex than Doom 3 and runs as twice as better...

red_star, please understand that my problem IS NOT an FPS drop. The behavior is exactly the same at 640X480 Medim or 1024x768 High Quality. It is also independent on the complexity of the scene, entering new rooms, a lot of monsters, etc. I happens EVEN in empty small corridors.

My gameplay would be completely smooth at 60 FPS EXCEPT for this 1 frame not being rendered every second. Its like my video card is rendering one frame at every 1/60 secs, and then skips every 60th, or maybe also the 59th frame, constantly.

Please take a look in your machine and pay attention to see if it also happens to you.

===>> Turn vsync on and put your monitor at 60Hz. <===

This way, the game SHOULD be as smooth as it could ever be, since its capped at 60FPS, and your monitor is at the exact same scan rate. Like in older games, the image should be rock solid, as the video card would be able to display EVERY frame generated, one at EVERY scan of the monitor.

I think it only happens with vsync on. With vsync off it does not happen, but I find myself the tearing effect much worse. (with monitor at 60Hz).

If I put my monitor at 80Hz with vsync on, for example, the effect is VERY different as expected, as my computer probably cannot generate a constant 80 FPS, and so I'll get many FPS drops to 40 FPS.

That's why I'm using 60Hz on the monitor. To be able to display EVERY frame generated.

But, for no reason, the game refuses to generate 1 or 2 frames at every second. (actually, is more like one hiccup at every 0.7 seconds )

Please, I'm trying to make myself as clear as I can (in english :) ).
Does anybody understand what I'm talking about?

Thanks everybody for your replies.
I'll try 4x AGP and disabling the sound when I get home tonite, and post the results later.

Subtestube
11-05-04, 04:26 PM
Z stenzil shadow thing is complete crap. J.C. could it done using DX API, and everything would run much faster. Far Cry is way more complex than Doom 3 and runs as twice as better...

I'm sorry, I know nothing about this thread, but that's just not true. DX and OpenGL are comparable in speed. Far Cry is (in my understanding) less efficient than Doom 3, it just doesn't have unified lighting, and so 'runs faster'. It's also not as complex as D3.

ppeccin
11-05-04, 04:28 PM
Please guys, lets stay on the initial subject.
Lets not start a fight about OGL x D3D and forget helping this poor little soul :angel2:

parecon
11-05-04, 05:44 PM
Just to add a little help...

Is fastwrites off? Try turning on fast writes, if it's off.

Anything running in the background, antivirus software, spyware, etc....

Try disabling every graphical option in Doom 3 and see if it persist's. If it doesn't happen in any other game, well then it could be sound card related, or something else related. Try standing still and looking at a moving object, like clouds in the sky and see if it skips standing still.

If you can't fix it, a format/clean install with only motherboard and video drivers installed should fix it, or to see if it is video card related. If it's still happening... well... :retard:

dwegner
11-05-04, 07:08 PM
Does this only happen in Doom3?

Its not your monitor dying by any chance?

Have you set the Nvidia driver panel to 'application preference'..remember that is you run D3 in high quality mode it automatically sets the AF at 8x, if say you had the AF settings also being determined by the driver panel it might be causing some kind of conflict re-drawing frames perhaps?

As mentioned try it with no sound and see if it still does it. Have you set the 2d/3d clock speeds of your card to be the same, coolbits will let you get into the card clockspeed options.

Can you run 3d mark '03 without any skipping /freezes or crashes ect?

Also try overriding your refresh rate either in the driver control panel or using REFORCE to do so. Remember D3 uses a tic rate of 60fps..it might be that because you are running your res at 60hz the 'syncing' rate of the game and the monitor might be out a little, overrding the refresh rate might compensate for this out of sync type behaviour by allowing the monitor to accept the game at any frame rate it can produce at any point in the game world.

ppeccin
11-05-04, 07:32 PM
Does this only happen in Doom3?

Its not your monitor dying by any chance?

Have you set the Nvidia driver panel to 'application preference'..remember that is you run D3 in high quality mode it automatically sets the AF at 8x, if say you had the AF settings also being determined by the driver panel it might be causing some kind of conflict re-drawing frames perhaps?

As mentioned try it with no sound and see if it still does it. Have you set the 2d/3d clock speeds of your card to be the same, coolbits will let you get into the card clockspeed options.

Can you run 3d mark '03 without any skipping /freezes or crashes ect?

Also try overriding your refresh rate either in the driver control panel or using REFORCE to do so. Remember D3 uses a tic rate of 60fps..it might be that because you are running your res at 60hz the 'syncing' rate of the game and the monitor might be out a little, overrding the refresh rate might compensate for this out of sync type behaviour by allowing the monitor to accept the game at any frame rate it can produce at any point in the game world.

Thank you.

What you mean by "overrding the refresh rate might compensate"?
I already have my refresh rate forced to 60Hz at 1024x768 (the resolution I'm trying to play).
I can play Half Life 1 (blue shift) with the same setting, VERY SMOOTH like real life...

By the way, I do not understand how people can play D3 (capped at 60FPS) with vsync on, but using a monitor refresh rate other than 60Hz, or 12Hz. :retard:
You would NEVER get a constant frame output. You would always get some "monitor frames" updated, some others not, in an arbitrary way, like yes, yes, no, yes, no, yes, yes, no, yes... That is not vsync..... :)

I can run 3D Mark 03 and 05 with no issues. (of course some tests get slow FPS, like 10 or so, but I think that is normal ). But NO crashes, freezing, etc.

Any more ideas?

Could you test one thing for me?
Try setting your monitor refresh rate to 60Hz and play D3 and see if you get the same hiccup? Stepping sideways facing a wall is good to determine if you get a hiccup every 0.8 seconds or so.
Please?? :angel2:

Thanks.

Subtestube
11-05-04, 08:17 PM
Just wondering, if you're already using RR override, have you tried turning it off...?

Blacklash
11-05-04, 08:25 PM
Try killing fast writes,

Also SP 2 was causing me to blue screen crash when exiting Lineage II to desktop. Some AMD users are having issues with it. I know I put mine over a freshly installed version of WinXP and it did not change a thing. I still had the L2 error. I am glad I took it off my rig. It was fine on my Intel set up and not so here.

Again, I'd try setting your AGP transfer rate to auto, and killing fast writes. As someone else said, keep your driver at application preference. Doom will set 8xAF itself at high settings. Also you can set multisample in game, if I recall correctly.

I know if you have coolbits installed and set your 'prerendered frames' too high that can cause that sort of hitching as well. Default is 3. If you have two hard disks seperate your OS and paging file. Make sure your paging file is not too small. Windows will only use what it needs. After you install a large game like Doom III it is always wise to defrag.

AngelGraves13
11-05-04, 11:10 PM
1. Delete your Doom3 config file. It will make a new one. I think the problem might be the command where textures are round down. If it is set to 0, you will have slight pauses every now and then.

2. Make sure you have your nvidia control panel set to application. And in the Doom3 config file, there are commands to set AF and AA levels. Hell you can have Doom3 set the AA to 16. It looks great, but SLOW!

Give those a shot. I've been playing around with the config file for some time now. Also you might want to try setting the renderer to either cg or arb2. They both look better than "best" and run the same on a 6800 ultra.

hav1x
11-06-04, 05:06 AM
when i first installed my 6800 gt oc it reset my monitor to 60hz. It stuttered like a bitch. once i forced it to 100hz the stutter was gone. this was playing d3

Killall
11-06-04, 05:27 AM
Hi all, this weird "stuttering" thing is happening to me also. I upgraded to a AMD 3500+ and the same thing is STILL there. So it must be a game problem wich J.C. must fix. I can look at a wall or a view with simple object infront of me, pann from left to right, and it seems to drop a few frames at the same spot... Every other game runs excellent. Hope a patch will fix this soon.
On a side note, lots of people cant see this stutter. Running games on a 22" monitor will make every stutter be very clear (not to mention the shimmering on the ground textures :retard: ).

ppeccin
11-06-04, 10:48 PM
Could someone please do the test for me?
Put your monitor ar 60Hz, vsync on, pay attention as you walk sideways in an empty corridor facing the wall.

Please be shure your refresh rate is at 60Hz.

Dou you get a rock solid smooth movement, or you get one dropped frame at EVERY 0.8 secs?

Thanks in advance.