View Full Version : Still no update from Pelly
Joe Cool
11-19-02, 05:25 AM
...About the rumor that he posted on the main news page that ATI had faked their demonstration of using DDR-II memory.
If you may recall, there was a thread here (literally gone now) where it was pointed out to him that an ATI engineer at Rage3d.com had clarified that the demo had indeed been genuine.
I asked when an update might occur to show this new information, and now the entire thread is gone (not locked - gone), with no reply from Pelly.
Pelly, when will we see that update from you? And what happened to that thread? Just a glitch in the database? :(
Joe Cool
11-19-02, 05:29 AM
Ah I found it now - it was MOVED without warning to "Website Related -> Feedback." Where nobody ever looks, of course. :(
Still no reply or update from pelly about what I wrote above though. :(
Lezmaka
11-19-02, 05:47 AM
Why are you posting this here instead of emailing Pelly himself. Seems to me all you want to do is create a bitch-fest.
Joe Cool
11-19-02, 06:32 AM
He posted mere speculation in order to criticize ATI but won't do a correction, even though there's proof that speculation was incorrect. Certainly more solid proof that way than what the initial criticism had.
Note the fact it was just speculation means it *does* fit here....
StealthHawk
11-19-02, 07:01 AM
and did ATI give an official response? or did an ATI representative do that on his own in a specific forum? if ATI wants to clear up the mess they should do so officially by talking to EE Times, or some other publication, sending an email to someone, etc.
Joe Cool
11-19-02, 07:38 AM
Originally posted by StealthHawk
and did ATI give an official response? or did an ATI representative do that on his own in a specific forum? if ATI wants to clear up the mess they should do so officially by talking to EE Times, or some other publication, sending an email to someone, etc.
Except the original information was itself based on an unknown source - even pelly admitted it was just speculation.
If pelly's willing to post such stuff on the main news page, and then criticize ATI for it, then a denial from an actual ATI engineer should at least get the same coverage. But there's been no acknowledgement of this at all.
Fair is fair, after all....
Evildeus
11-19-02, 08:42 AM
Originally posted by Joe Cool
Except the original information was itself based on an unknown source - even pelly admitted it was just speculation.
If pelly's willing to post such stuff on the main news page, and then criticize ATI for it, then a denial from an actual ATI engineer should at least get the same coverage. But there's been no acknowledgement of this at all.
Fair is fair, after all.... Well, ATI can make a clear statement, an ingineer statement is just his words, not the company's one, which is different ;)
thcdru2k
11-19-02, 09:20 AM
shoot..who cares it old news, you know its not true, you don't gotta read it to know that right?
You just answered your own question Joe Cool, "Note the fact it was just speculation means it *does* fit here...."
what more do you want?
jbirney
11-19-02, 09:43 AM
Originally posted by StealthHawk
and did ATI give an official response? or did an ATI representative do that on his own in a specific forum? if ATI wants to clear up the mess they should do so officially by talking to EE Times, or some other publication, sending an email to someone, etc.
Yes they did. See B3D or Rage3D for a reply from ATI.
Maybe this little blurb from nVidia yesterday was a not-so-subtle response:
Tamasi went on to explain how nVidia takes advantage of DDR2:
"There are fundamental differences between DDR1 and DDR2, and if you want to make good use of DDR2, you have to design around longer burst lengths on the memory, because that's how they're going faster. So the entire memory subsystem has to be designed to handle that. You might be able to hook up a chip that's built for DDR1memory to DDR2 memory, and even run it at a high frequency, but you get horrible utilization out of the memory, because that DDR1 memory subsystem is all built around Burst-Length 2 accesses. So you'll get a half the efficiency accessing the Burst-Length 4 memory device."
I am here...sitting on the sidelines chuckling to myself...
How ridiculous this whole thing truly is...
:D
Joe Cool
11-19-02, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by pelly
I am here...sitting on the sidelines chuckling to myself...
How ridiculous this whole thing truly is...
:D
Well I find it interesting that the thread starting this only got moved here well after it had started and you had posted.
I also find it interesting that you basicaly flamed me as a "troll," but have refused to answer any of my substantive queries about it since - in fact all you've seemed to do so far is dodge the issues:
- Are you allowed to flame posters like you did to me? If so, are others allowed to flame you back? What is the official policy regarding this sort of thing?
- Why haven't you updated the original "news" item which now apparently - at the very least - has sufficient counter-speculation showing your news item to be false?
Pelly, do you think you can answer these questions? I believe they're fair ones, in light of your recent conduct.... :(
intercede007
11-19-02, 06:03 PM
If you would have read his post just one thread down from this one, all your questions would be answered. To spare you the effort :
Joe Cool...you won't see an update for a number of reasons....
1) It is old news...it was speculation....labeled as speculation....and ( in everyones case but your own )...treated as speculation.
2) I have been busy covering other topics, such as the introduction of the GeForce FX with true DDR-II implementation ( designed to use it from the start...aka: actually designd around longer burst lengths )
3) You've wasted enough of my time...
Someone, please cart this Dead Horse away...the smell is getting to me...
Unfortunately, I have been foolish enough to waste a great deal of my time trying to "reach" that guy...I think forcing a supermodel to eat a pound of Spam would be an easier task...
Regardless, I'll bring you guys the time of your life...We can and will get this done...and once we do, it'll be an absolute blast!
I'll keep you posted once things get back on track...thanks for understanding guys!
:D
StealthHawk
11-19-02, 08:46 PM
Originally posted by jbirney
Yes they did. See B3D or Rage3D for a reply from ATI.
a post in a forum is an official response?
If pelly's willing to post such stuff on the main news page, and then criticize ATI for it, then a denial from an actual ATI engineer should at least get the same coverage. But there's been no acknowledgement of this at all.
Fair is fair, after all....
one came from a website and the other a forum
thcdru2k
11-20-02, 01:03 AM
joe cool..how would you feel if someone did something similar at rage3d forums. they would get flamed to death. please have the same courtesy.
It's nothing new here. I'm getting used to things getting moved with no traces on this forum. Everything dealing with this subject has been moved where nobody would look and the "Moved To" headers have been deleted to make it even harder to find. Seems to be a common practice here. I'm not trying to be argumentative but pushing things under the rug is just low. If you can't take criticism about your posts then don't post them. I certaintly have to take everything thrown at me.
thcdru2k
11-20-02, 01:33 AM
no..its like placing a topic about videogames in the linux forum. this is website feedback and it belongs there not nvidia graphics or whereever it was.
Oh, come on. I agree, it should be moved to this forum but deleting all the links to it guarantees over 99% of the forum members will never see it. And with the guarantee that the news will not be updated (because it's old...my head hurts...people can find the other side out on their own) with the other side of the story means everyone goes away thinking "ATI=bad! How dare they cheat." This is a classic practice called propaganda.
Joe Cool
11-20-02, 06:24 AM
Originally posted by pelly
Unfortunately, I have been foolish enough to waste a great deal of my time trying to "reach" that guy...I think forcing a supermodel to eat a pound of Spam would be an easier task...
Regardless, I'll bring you guys the time of your life...We can and will get this done...and once we do, it'll be an absolute blast!
I'll keep you posted once things get back on track...thanks for understanding guys!
:D
See? He avoided my points yet again. Nothing about his obligation to update his news post. Nothing about the official policy about flaming. All he did was throw more abuse my way. :(
These are very simple and easy to answer questions pelly - are you going to ever update your erroneous news post or not? And what is the official nvnews policy on flaming in the forums?
Are you going to answer these? Is anyone at NvNews going to answer these?
Or do you guys just duck and run when the going gets hot? :(
Joe Cool
11-20-02, 06:33 AM
Originally posted by StealthHawk
a post in a forum is an official response?
The original news post was itself based on speculation from another place that had an unknown source. That's actually less reliable than the source the update came from.
one came from a website and the other a forum
The original news post was itself based on speculation from an unknown source. That's actually less reliable than the source the update came from.
pelly or someone at nvnews has a journalistic and moral obligation to post an update showing this.
After all, if they're willing to post mere speculation that ATI lied about what they demonstrated, and then are criticized for it, then any information countering this from someone who appears to be an engineer at ATI should get at least the same consideration.
Period.
Joe Cool
11-20-02, 06:39 AM
Originally posted by ChrisW
Oh, come on. I agree, it should be moved to this forum but deleting all the links to it guarantees over 99% of the forum members will never see it. And with the guarantee that the news will not be updated (because it's old...my head hurts...people can find the other side out on their own) with the other side of the story means everyone goes away thinking "ATI=bad! How dare they cheat." This is a classic practice called propaganda.
Don't forget too that for quite a while it stayed in the forum I posted it, and nvnews was quite fine to leave it there as long as pelly was having fun hurling abuse my way.
So the timing as well as the handling of it is very suspicious. :(
StealthHawk
11-20-02, 07:46 AM
give it a rest. the mods aren't up 24/7, maybe they didn't look at the thread until later or something.
you know what? i actually agree with you. there should definitely be an addendum to the post with a link to the engineer's response. however, and this is a big however, you're just taking this way out of context. if you have a problem, why not just email Pelly or Mike and talk to them calmly about it instead of throwing a tantrum in public
Matthyahuw
11-20-02, 09:45 AM
you guys are funny...talk about fanATIcisim, I think some people here need counciling...
He posted something from a reputible site, that's the end, give it a rest...no one here has any moral obligation to do jack squat! Go start your own site if you feel that way...We'll post to the contrary when ATi has a DDR2 card on the shelves...buh-bye
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