The Dawn Effects demo

[Nv40]

i cant hardly imagine a better name for that demo
demostrated in the Nv30 in realtime.

Dawn = the beginning of something, especially a period of time or history . ex..the dawn of the industrial era

it would really be exciting to see one day , games with that kind
of quality ..

and i think Nvidia was not far when claiming Final fantasy graphics in real time , i mean look at the Dawn screenshot
.. the second one :)


http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/02q4/021118/geforcefx-09.html


i dont see there too low polys ? :)

maybe its my monitor but here it it looks good.

and now look at the FInal fantasy real movie shots..

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ff/affw/ffmov/screens/aki_face.jpg

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ff/affw/ffmov/screens/aki_eye.jpg


it is not exactly final fantasy the movie ,and the Nv30 was not was envisioned to do exactly everything in the movie ,there are many millions of Polys in some scenes,specially when there are more than one character or some specialFx like fire or explosions
that require to much CPu power and maybe aditional tricks
that the Nv30 cant do in hardware.
but i think the dawn demo clearly proof that the quality in the Nv30 is there !!.

http://www.hothardware.com/reviews/images/geforce_fx_pr/dawn1.htm

http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/3648/SUPP/large02.jpg

THis is Nv30 in all its Glory , with its powerfull pixel shaders
precision .

as i have said before to match the quality of what we see in CG movies so i think they deserve some credit about this ..
it was not marketing hype at all .. in my book the cinematic quality in realtime have been demostrated.


Give the Nv30 a very powerfull processor something like a "100ghz" procesor with tons of RAm ,and you will not notice the diference between the movie and the demo .

more sceenshots here..

http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?IO=demo_dawn


only Pros get this level of detail
in programs like 3dmax or other 3danimation packages.

http://www.hothardware.com/reviews/images/geforce_fx_pr/time_machine2.htm

http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/3650/SUPP/large02.jpg

like the Dawn ,i think this is a new begining in
Computer graphics .. where is my Xbox 2? :)

[Megatron]

Im really Impressed by the Dawn pics ive seen.
The facial expressions are very lifelike, and the quality of the Fairy is astounding.
Sweet pics, cant wait to see the real demo.

[thcdru2k]

tech demos are nice..but all of them are impressive, even old ones with gf4, gf4, radeons, and especially the r9700 are very nice. but when was the last tech demo that turned into a decent game?

[Megatron]

I agree there totally. They are fun to watch once or twice, or maybe show the friends when they come by for some extra wows..but that about it.

[Uttar]

Problem is, tech demos often ( but not always ) optimize everything to the MAX.

In real world situations, determining very efficiently if a polygon is hidden or not is often kinda hard. However, with those tech demos, a lot is special case. So, in real world situations, more Z culling & vertex processing would be done.
Also, those demos are centered on heavy detail on one character. Games often got more than 10 characters on screen ( example: Morrowind ) - so, if you divide number of power by ten, it looks a lot less impressive :)

So, even if they look great, you just can't make a game looking as good. It's impossible :(


Uttar

[sancheuz]

Dont worry. You see the problem was that high quality video power was not available to the mainstream computer. Most people still have a intel 810, or intel extreme graphics, or geforce2 mx 200 video card, on a 2 ghz machine. But now, that incredible cards are reaching the mainstream, such as the gf4 4200 and 4600, and ati 9000, we are sure to see a major leap in pc graphic quality. Look at Doom 3, without a doubt it will be the game with the best graphics in any system including consoles. That will lead to more games like in the high graphics. Especially now that developers have in their hands tools such a cg. Imagine this, if nvidia incorporates nv30 into nforce chipset. Mainstream nv30.

[Mod]

This is weird... the name of the dmo is more creative than the name of the video card in which it is suposed to run.

I think it would be better that they had named Dawn Fx, instead of GeForce Fx.

[-=DVS=-]

Originally posted by Mod
This is weird... the name of the dmo is more creative than the name of the video card in which it is suposed to run.

I think it would be better that they had named geforce fx of Dawn Fx.

hehe Geforce Fx of Dawn Fx that would sound realy stupid :rolleyes: IMO

Better Force Of Dawn that makes more sense :p

And yeah demo looks sweet , i only hope GF FX will be faster in real games then Radeon 9700 :D becouse waiting 4 months is kinda boreing :eek:

[Nv40]

yeah ,its too late for a name for the Nv30 ..

like Nvidia DAWN-Fx .

the good things about consoles is that all games
use 100% of your graphics card power and harware power.

in Pc world , from 5 - 10% :(


only few developers , like id software or the Aquanox developers
and others optimize their games for the latest technology available .

[Smokey]

Originally posted by thcdru2k
tech demos are nice..but all of them are impressive, even old ones with gf4, gf4, radeons, and especially the r9700 are very nice. but when was the last tech demo that turned into a decent game?

If you havent already done so, go take alot at the launch video stream on Nvidias site. Pay very close attention when they are demoing Everquest2. I kid you not, the player/creature models look like Nvidia demos they look that good. When asked how many of these model could you have on screen at any one time, the answer was....30-50 :eek: When is this game coming out? 2003. If this is one MMOG, which IMO dont always have the best graphics, Im sure there are more on the way where that came from. I think Nvidia can and will get Cg to be used by developers, and we will be seeing our games scale on our systems in a much different way than in the past. The power with these new video cards is in the shaders, Cg will help developers use those shaders in games, remember this is much different from using the saders in DirectX8.

[Uttar]

AFAIK, EQ2 doesn't use shaders for transparent wings or anything even a billionth time as complex. Saying it's the same quality is nothing more than marketing insanity IMO.


Uttar

[Smokey]

I said that they look as good as Nvidia demos, I would find it hard to belive that a game coming out towards the end of 2003, wouldnt use shaders of some sort. There were shaders in DirectX8 and even more in DirectX9. I dont really care how they are made, I just like what I saw and it was from a game coming out next year. Dont you think that the demo of everquest2 was damn nice? ;)

[Mod]

Originally posted by -=DVS=-
hehe Geforce Fx of Dawn Fx that would sound realy stupid :rolleyes: IMO

Better Force Of Dawn that makes more sense :p

And yeah demo looks sweet , i only hope GF FX will be faster in real games then Radeon 9700 :D becouse waiting 4 months is kinda boreing :eek:

Oops, it was not Geforce Fx of Dawn Fx, It's just Dawn Fx. In fact there is a typo in my last paragraph, it should be written :

"I think it would be better that they had named Dawn Fx, instead of GeForceFx".

The way I wrote, I was trying to do this:

"I think it would be better that they had named GeForceFx, of Dawn Fx"

[jbirney]

Cg will help developers use those shaders in games, remember this is much different from using the saders in DirectX8.

Developers wont touch 1/2 of these features until the main stream has DX8 class cards to support them. Which is not going to happen so long as the GF4mx cards still sells.

[alex.burm]

Originally posted by Nv40
i cant hardly imagine a better name for that demo
demostrated in the Nv30 in realtime.

Dawn = the beginning of something, especially a period of time or history . ex..the dawn of the industrial era

it would really be exciting to see one day , games with that kind
of quality ..

and i think Nvidia was not far when claiming Final fantasy graphics in real time , i mean look at the Dawn screenshot
.. the second one :)


http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/02q4/021118/geforcefx-09.html


i dont see there too low polys ? :)

maybe its my monitor but here it it looks good.

and now look at the FInal fantasy real movie shots..

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ff/affw/ffmov/screens/aki_face.jpg

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ff/affw/ffmov/screens/aki_eye.jpg


it is not exactly final fantasy the movie ,and the Nv30 was not was envisioned to do exactly everything in the movie ,there are many millions of Polys in some scenes,specially when there are more than one character or some specialFx like fire or explosions
that require to much CPu power and maybe aditional tricks
that the Nv30 cant do in hardware.
but i think the dawn demo clearly proof that the quality in the Nv30 is there !!.

http://www.hothardware.com/reviews/images/geforce_fx_pr/dawn1.htm

http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/3648/SUPP/large02.jpg

THis is Nv30 in all its Glory , with its powerfull pixel shaders
precision .

as i have said before to match the quality of what we see in CG movies so i think they deserve some credit about this ..
it was not marketing hype at all .. in my book the cinematic quality in realtime have been demostrated.


Give the Nv30 a very powerfull processor something like a "100ghz" procesor with tons of RAm ,and you will not notice the diference between the movie and the demo .

more sceenshots here..

http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?IO=demo_dawn


only Pros get this level of detail
in programs like 3dmax or other 3danimation packages.

http://www.hothardware.com/reviews/images/geforce_fx_pr/time_machine2.htm

http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/3650/SUPP/large02.jpg

like the Dawn ,i think this is a new begining in
Computer graphics .. where is my Xbox 2? :)
yes dawn does indeed look impressive (and dare i say sexy :p)
but 3dstudio max can also do that....

quesiton is, how many fps has that dawn demo got? :confused:

:rolleyes:

[Arrghman]

Indeed, what's the FPS? Is it a real-time lighting solution or is it pre-painted? How much of her skin is texture and how much is actually from a shader? Is there real raytracing going on? Radiosity? How is her animation handled? What kind of collision detection does she have with other objects? If an object touches her skin, does it simply clip through?

Video cards are getting better and better at using tricks to make things look better and the GFX looks like its the best so far. But is it real time Final Fantasy? Not by a long shot...

[imtim83]

I think the Everquest 2 charactors were really good when they showed them in the Geforce FX video from the Comdex. Espically the Dragon. When it blew fire the fire looked very real. Even the Dragon's like skin looked good. Then the armor on some of the charactors looked really good, the material ,etc. These charactors will be in the game Everquest 2. Other games that are not like Everquest 2 that had good graphics to just like that was unreal 2. Its not any gameplay its just a small little walking demo.

[Lezmaka]

Originally posted by Arrghman
What kind of collision detection does she have with other objects? If an object touches her skin, does it simply clip through?


I don't think those two things have anything to do with the video card being used. All that would be done on the cpu

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by Arrghman
What kind of collision detection does she have with other objects? If an object touches her skin, does it simply clip through
yeah, since this is only a tech demo and not a game demo, there doesn't have to be one collision detection ;) it was after all, just one character floating in the woods.

[Arrghman]

Originally posted by StealthHawk
yeah, since this is only a tech demo and not a game demo, there doesn't have to be one collision detection ;) it was after all, just one character floating in the woods.

That is, in fact, my point and is exactly why this demo is not anywhere near Final Fantasy in real time.

[Bigus Dickus]

Not to nitpick, but isn't all collision detection for off line-renderings like FF done during scene and character polygon creation, not during the rendering process?

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by Bigus Dickus
Not to nitpick, but isn't all collision detection for off line-renderings like FF done during scene and character polygon creation, not during the rendering process?

that's what i would imagine...

[alex.burm]

have u seen the nvidia presentation of the nvfx chip?

the ceo of nvidia was ok...but the marketing guys made me sick just listening to them....all they did was give out loads of huge numbers, without actually explaining the technology behind it...well i bet their keeping it secret, but i mean wtf....

"150 million transistors is like having 1 dollar bills from...."
...SHUT THE FUK UP !

:mad:

i hate marketing guys. :mad:

[The Baron]

Originally posted by Bigus Dickus
Not to nitpick, but isn't all collision detection for off line-renderings like FF done during scene and character polygon creation, not during the rendering process?

yes. it is. :p

[Arrghman]

Originally posted by Bigus Dickus
Not to nitpick, but isn't all collision detection for off line-renderings like FF done during scene and character polygon creation, not during the rendering process?

Okay... so perhaps collision detection wasn't the best choice. To be honest, I don't really know; it could be precalculated or done on a frame by frame basis. Either way, if its FF in real time, it would have to be in real time as well...