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Tyr-Sog
01-16-05, 12:40 AM
I may be heading back that way also. The servers are absolute **** and the amount of immature kids to boot is leaving a bad taste in my mouth. I'll give it a bit longer but Blizzard is making SOE look like gods in the mmo catagory.

faraday
01-16-05, 10:23 AM
Deja vu

vampireuk
01-16-05, 05:28 PM
I'm having no server problems at the moment and I've not run into any idiots, those who group like morons get stuck on my ignore list and we leave them to die. I'm currently playing the European final beta as a warrior now and I am enjoying it a lot.

WeReWoLf
01-16-05, 05:50 PM
Warriors do not suck. The people who play warriors suck at playing warriors. There is a small but fundamental difference. I still love my priest.

Warriors are supposed to be the Ultimate Tankers. But they aren't when Paladins have my HPS, healing, invulnerability, higher DPS, a chance for more crits, stun, better Area of Effects AND a free Warhorse! What do warriors get? Rend? Hamstring? Thunderclap? yay... What we need is our HPS back. say at lvl 35 i have 1734 HPS. At lvl 35 a Pally with the same gear has 2.1k HPS. Warriors are supposed to be able to run into battle, take the damage and walk away afterwards. We can run into battle, take damage then recover our body. We also have the worst aggro. Solo we have HUGE aggro, in groups we have very little. My worst complaint is that WARriors don't get a WARhorse, But paladins do. We just get a normal steed, Tiger or Mechanical chicken for alliance, Wolf or skeletal horse for Horde. Worst of all, we have to pay extra for our mount. Pallys and Warlocks get theirs for free, Priests, Druids, Mages and Hunters get theirs for 90 Gold yet Warriors pay 100 Gold for theirs. And you say that we don't suck.

superklye
01-16-05, 06:46 PM
That you Werewolf...that is exactly what I'm talking about. Warriors are underpowered, their skills are laughable and most importantly: they aren't fun to play.

vampireuk
01-16-05, 07:17 PM
That you Werewolf...that is exactly what I'm talking about. Warriors are underpowered, their skills are laughable and most importantly: they aren't fun to play.

I'm having a lot of fun playing my warrior to be honest.

Skrot
01-16-05, 08:26 PM
Maybe stop being a pretentious ass and back up what you're saying, hmm?From what I can see, the point of a Warrior in a group is to get and to keep aggro from multiple mobs. There is a night and day difference between a warrior who plays like a rogue (just trying to be a damage dealer, tanking if he must) and one who plays it with skill. I have a friend on my server (Proudmoore) that simply outshines *all* other warriors that I have grouped with, and he makes my job as a priest much less stressful. Using AoE taunts, defensive stance, demoralising shout etc, he can get a large group of mobs to focus on him, and to keep nearly all of them on him, mostly regardless of how much I am healing. Having to heal one or two players for a higher amount is a lot more mana efficient and safe than having to heal nearly everyone at a reasonable pace. Using greater heals instead of lots of renews and flash heals means that I can keep healing in a fight for longer, which is basically required in higher level instances (I'm level 57 at the moment).

It appears as though a warrior was somewhat designed to be a healer's best friend, if played properly :). Of course, having a druid or paladin for backup healing is always very welcome.

ChrisRay
01-16-05, 08:30 PM
Guys please settle down in your arguments. Theres no reason to lay out insult. Keep it cool. Theres no reason for the thread to degenerate into insult. I admit I have been somewhat lax because I was interested in the class balance discussion. So please settle down.

WeReWoLf
01-16-05, 08:34 PM
Warriors are good at tanking, but nowhere near what the paladins are. Pallys are supposed to be quick strike warriors of holy light. That would mean that they are supposed to get in quick deal alot of damage and get out. They are supposed to take alot more damage than warriors because of lower armour, that's why they got healing. But their armour points are so much more higher than warriors, which means less HPS being taken off when they are hit, and add in the healing. That makes for one invincible tank. Don't get me wrong here though, warriors are fun to play (i can't stand playing anything else, too boring) it's just that they are the most nerfed char in the game. Druids and Priests can kick our ass in PVP and Duels, so that's saying something.

Tyr-Sog
01-16-05, 08:53 PM
Yeah, another waster day of 1 step forward, 2 back. Rollbacks last night, today... At least I'll lose all my SM loot and exp this time, no big deal. :rolleyes:


Knock, knock SOE...

superklye
01-16-05, 09:38 PM
I'm having a lot of fun playing my warrior to be honest.
Well I'm glad. I wasn't having fun. I was sick of being the one to take all the damage. In a group with 2 druids and a warlock, being the only warrior sucked. I was constantly using Rend and Hamstring and one other skill and it just got so repetative. I almost wish I could've set up a macro so that I didn't have to keep doing it. There just doesn't seem to be much depth to playing a warrior and I was disappointed.

And then again, I haven't played in over a month and I've decided to give up. The game is basically unattainable and after the bad Amazon experience with that d-bag not sending me the game, I don't care to play it anymore.

From what I can see, the point of a Warrior in a group is to get and to keep aggro from multiple mobs. There is a night and day difference between a warrior who plays like a rogue (just trying to be a damage dealer, tanking if he must) and one who plays it with skill. I have a friend on my server (Proudmoore) that simply outshines *all* other warriors that I have grouped with, and he makes my job as a priest much less stressful. Using AoE taunts, defensive stance, demoralising shout etc, he can get a large group of mobs to focus on him, and to keep nearly all of them on him, mostly regardless of how much I am healing. Having to heal one or two players for a higher amount is a lot more mana efficient and safe than having to heal nearly everyone at a reasonable pace. Using greater heals instead of lots of renews and flash heals means that I can keep healing in a fight for longer, which is basically required in higher level instances (I'm level 57 at the moment).

It appears as though a warrior was somewhat designed to be a healer's best friend, if played properly :). Of course, having a druid or paladin for backup healing is always very welcome.
Fine. You're right. I'm wrong. I can't play a warrior. I'm a complete ****ing retard. I'm going to go shoot myself in the throat right now, so that I don't have to upset you anymore. Happy?

Skrot
01-16-05, 10:31 PM
Fine. You're right. I'm wrong. I can't play a warrior. I'm a complete ****ing retard. I'm going to go shoot myself in the throat right now, so that I don't have to upset you anymore. Happy?LOL What the..? I'm not upset, and never was.

WeReWoLf
01-16-05, 10:32 PM
That's what i was thinkin...

ChrisRay
01-16-05, 10:43 PM
Guys this is your last warning. Settle down.

MX/MX400
01-16-05, 10:54 PM
U probably get this all the time, but I gotta know, who the hell is that chick in your av chris?

WeReWoLf
01-17-05, 12:43 AM
This video is the reason why warriors got nerfed. A lvl 60 wanted to prove how overpowered the warriors were. Blizzard thought that they were fine. As a result of this video, Blizzard OVERnerfed us. http://www.warcraftmovies.com/download.php?mirror=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.red-guard.com%2FMovies%2FIndalamar.avi&id=24

marqmajere
01-17-05, 12:45 AM
I'm having no server problems at the moment and I've not run into any idiots, those who group like morons get stuck on my ignore list and we leave them to die. I'm currently playing the European final beta as a warrior now and I am enjoying it a lot.


You and I are, apparently, the only two people playing WoW without any problems. Stand tall, friend, for we stand alone. Although, upon further thought, maybe we should quit WoW for another game. Let's not let great gameplay, the ability to solo, tradeskills that are worth doing, superb graphics, a fantastic questing system, a kickass soundtrack, and the overall fun of WoW stop us from going somewhere else. Heaven forbid a company new to this genre make ANY mistakes. *enter sarcasm here*

When S.O.E. first released Everquest, I was there playing it. Most of the time (at least in the beginning) you couldn't stay on the servers for more that 20 minutes without them crashing. Constant nerfs, renerfs, balancing issues and downtime were an almost expected, frequent occurance. As far as I'm concerned, the launch of WoW has been one of the best to date.

You folks complain about WoW every chance you get. Yes, some of the things they do should have been handled in a different way, but I remember playing other games at the beginning as well. Ultima Online. Anarchy Online. Everquest. Dark Age of Camalot. None of them came close to having a fun expierence like WoW when they were first launched.

So let's condem Blizzard for their first mmorpg which, by the way, is one of the best games I've ever played and I'm not alone in this. Let's all stop playing because of a few hiccups in the initial months. Lag issues will be sorted out. Balancing issues will be sorted out. Server issues will be sorted out. I, for one, think they are doing a fine job and will continue to play this game INSPITE of these problems which I don't seem to be having whatsoever.

marqmajere
01-17-05, 01:01 AM
This video is the reason why warriors got nerfed. A lvl 60 wanted to prove how overpowered the warriors were. Blizzard thought that they were fine. As a result of this video, Blizzard OVERnerfed us. http://www.warcraftmovies.com/download.php?mirror=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.red-guard.com%2FMovies%2FIndalamar.avi&id=24


That was just plain awesome. I play a priest and watching that video made me want to log on and start up a warrior. People just get jellous of abilities they don't have. Everyone wants their class to be the best. So when they see another class, like in the video, doing something that their class isn't capable of doing, or they themselves don't have the brainpower to pull it off, they complain. I have no complaints about that video. Let the warriors do it. Let them be able to go out and kill 50 things at once. As a priest, that just makes it more appealing to group with them.

If that persons intent was to make Blizzard aware of the effectivness of warriors, and convince them that they are broken, then that person is an idiot and a whinner. Those types of people take the fun away with their constant bitching and complaining. Even if warriors were the most powerful, lawnmower, deathmachines in the game, let them try to PvP me (or another priest) at level 60. You can't have everything and it sucks they can't learn that.

WeReWoLf
01-17-05, 01:02 AM
The thing is, warriors are no longer capable of doing that because Blizzard removed the Bloodthirst move from the Beta before August. We can never do damage like that again. The person that created this video wanted to point out to constant whiners and bitchers, that constantly spamming the Bloodthirst and Slam moves, it was possible to go on a killing spree. Blizzard found out about the movie, watched it and Overnerfed us. Our max Damage we can give now is no more than 600 standard 1500 crit. Bloodthirst was completely removed from the game and our rage generation was dropped majorly. We now no longer generate rage from misses, dodges and parry's. This has killed our effectiveness on the battlefield, because our moves DEPEND on rage. Also because of the bug that causes missing sprees (3 to 6 times in a row, which shouldn't happen because missing is on a random generator. The odds are supposed to be 10/250000000 to get 3 misses in a row, yet approx 26.7% of our melee attacks are misses.) we cannot generate rage which makes it alot harder to kill something.

ChrisRay
01-17-05, 02:00 AM
You folks complain about WoW every chance you get. Yes, some of the things they do should have been handled in a different way, but I remember playing other games at the beginning as well. Ultima Online. Anarchy Online. Everquest. Dark Age of Camalot. None of them came close to having a fun expierence like WoW when they were first launched.

So let's condem Blizzard for their first mmorpg which, by the way, is one of the best games I've ever played and I'm not alone in this. Let's all stop playing because of a few hiccups in the initial months. Lag issues will be sorted out. Balancing issues will be sorted out. Server issues will be sorted out. I, for one, think they are doing a fine job and will continue to play this game INSPITE of these problems which I don't seem to be having whatsoever.


No one is condemning blizzard. But the company "Needs" to be held accountable for its actions and server quality. Just because its your first MMORPG does not give you a free ride for quality. When EQ 2 was released. I was on Sony's case for its launch being less than what I had hoped for.

You cant expect things to be perfect. But people have a right and the ability to criticise a company. Just because its SOE or Blizzard does not make them immune to criticism. I dont care how good/poor their prior games were. There current games deserve and need to be rated and compared to current competitive games and prior games from said companies.

Just because its Blizzard/SoE. Does not mean their games are perfect. And people dont need to be standing around throwing up there arms saying "OH well. Its (Name company here) and its their first/(or millionth) MMORPG so we should let them off for ((Insert retarded reason here))"

Ninjaman09
01-17-05, 08:42 AM
Just because its Blizzard/SoE. Does not mean their games are perfect. And people dont need to be standing around throwing up there arms saying "OH well. Its (Name company here) and its their first/(or millionth) MMORPG so we should let them off for ((Insert retarded reason here))"
I don't think anyone disagrees with this, but marqmajere made a very good point. He wasn't saying we should let Blizzard off the hook just because they're Blizzard, but because it hasn't been long enough to really call it one way or the other. I agree with him, it seems like a lot of peoples' complaints are things that will be worked out in time. The fact is, World of Warcraft is a fun game despite its issues and it's getting a bum rap from a lot of people, I think, because it's a Blizzard game. It's the same reasoning that drives people to hate Microsoft or nVidia. I enjoy the game very much, I know thousands of other people do as well, and none of us are "retarded" as you so kindly put it.

|MaguS|
01-17-05, 08:59 AM
http://www.warcraftmovies.com/download.php?mirror=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.red-guard.com%2FMovies%2FIndalamar.avi&id=24

This video so would make me quit, Blizzard can be kings of RTS games but this shows how poorly they went into the MMORPG field. I mean WTF? He's slaughtering enemies only 4 levels below him... thats just stupid balancing...

Ninjaman09
01-17-05, 09:36 AM
This video so would make me quit, Blizzard can be kings of RTS games but this shows how poorly they went into the MMORPG field. I mean WTF? He's slaughtering enemies only 4 levels below him... thats just stupid balancing...
Yes, which is why those abilities are not in the game anymore. That was from the closed beta, and warriors can't do that anymore. In fact, warriors suck so bad now, I can waste them with my Rogue no problem even if they're 4 levels above me. Keep in mind also that the guy in the video was maximum level and probably had some of the best gear in the game. And in WoW, enemies 4 levels below you are generally easy to slaughter anyway, though certainly not to the extent he was doing.

WeReWoLf
01-17-05, 06:07 PM
It takes me the entire length of that video to kill a mob the same lvl as me now. I am glad for that fact, but i wish Blizzard would improve the Dueling/PvP of warriors.

ChrisRay
01-17-05, 07:27 PM
This video so would make me quit, Blizzard can be kings of RTS games but this shows how poorly they went into the MMORPG field. I mean WTF? He's slaughtering enemies only 4 levels below him... thats just stupid balancing...


Eh it's nothing like that anymore. You can still kill quickly without downtime. But battles last alot longer and its nothing like what you see there. Theres a reason they had a closed beta.

Just wish they wouldnt have added Hunter/Paladin talents so near end game and then never tested them. Paladins had a sweeping change when open beta occurred and they were not the same class they were during release that they were in beta.


don't think anyone disagrees with this, but marqmajere made a very good point. He wasn't saying we should let Blizzard off the hook just because they're Blizzard, but because it hasn't been long enough to really call it one way or the other. I agree with him, it seems like a lot of peoples' complaints are things that will be worked out in time. The fact is, World of Warcraft is a fun game despite its issues and it's getting a bum rap from a lot of people, I think, because it's a Blizzard game. It's the same reasoning that drives people to hate Microsoft or nVidia. I enjoy the game very much, I know thousands of other people do as well, and none of us are "retarded" as you so kindly put it.


I disagree. WoW in alot of cases is getting a bum rep because it deserves it. From server instability to idiotic dev decisions. These are company issues regarding the game. Yes they can be fixed. But will they if people accept this kind of service and say its ok? No they wont. It's not because they are Blizzard. Actually Thats one reason people are disapointed. Blizzard is held so highly in regard that alot of people are extremely disapointed in the company right now. They see(paticularly me) a company that they love and have held in such high regard releasing a product that has many poor factors too it.

Dont think my criticism is selective of Blizzard alone. We have a sticky thread here by me that shows EQ 2 is anything but an angels paradise of MMORPGs. People need to see these things. These companies need to be brought out? Know why? Because in this business reputation is everything. These companies dont want to be embarrassed. When they are they are more likely to fix things.