Firefox SUCKS....right?

[oldsk00l]

Unbelievably enough, a Jupiter analyst, Michael Gertenberg, has written an opinion piece which ComputerWorld, unbelievably enough, has printed, cautioning businesses that they might want to think twice about switching from IE to Firefox because "Firefox lacks the ability to run Microsoft ActiveX code."

[Groklaw jaws drop all over the world in unison]

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20050127222737475

............BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHH HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH HAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA HAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA HAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA HAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA AAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA HABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA AHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAH AHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABW AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAH HAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHA HAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHA HAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHA HAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHA HHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHH HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH HAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA HAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA HAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA HAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA AAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA HABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA AHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAH AHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABW AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAH HAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHA HAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHA HAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHA HAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHA HHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHHAHAHAHAHABWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAHH HHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!

[SH64]

My eyes !! :eek:

[Riptide]

I love my Firefox. :)

It is true that there are pages out there that won't load correctly with it that work fine in IE. I had similar problems with Opera, though Firefox is noticeably better in that regard.

[NoWayDude]

oldsk00l, you missed a AHA on line 30 :)

[Vagrant Zero]

Why can't we go back to the good ol' days when having an opinion would get you dead.

[superklye]

Why can't we go back to the good ol' days when having an opinion would get you dead.
Vagrant Zero for President!

[saturnotaku]

I had similar problems with Opera, though Firefox is noticeably better in that regard.

It's about damn time you saw the light. :p

[Daneel Olivaw]

Oh dear god, someone is actually backing activeX, outside of MS? BS!

[bknblk]

So, basically this guy is complaining because firefox adheres to the current standards, whereas IE id jury-rigged to render pages that adhere to the MS standard? Um, OK.

[monly]

i wanna know wtf is wrong with IE.....you open the website, you look at the porn, you close the website, how is firefox better at doing that than IE? :confused:

[Rakeesh]

i wanna know wtf is wrong with IE.....you open the website, you look at the porn, you close the website, how is firefox better at doing that than IE? :confused:

You are looking at it in the wrong way. What you described is what you do with firefox, with IE theres a huge potential for a much different process.

You open the website, pick up a peice of spyware that stays with you no matter where else you go, look at the pron, realize that the images are loading slowly, download a spyware program to clean out the mess, close a few popup windows, in the process find out that something is now broken, try to fix it, then close the website.

With firefox I can rest easy knowing that I don't need anti-spyware software, anti-virus software, and firewall software hogging up system resources. With IE all bets are off, because when you are around whoring other websites, you never know what you are going to get.

[Zelda_fan]

You are looking at it in the wrong way. What you described is what you do with firefox, with IE theres a huge potential for a much different process.

You open the website, pick up a peice of spyware that stays with you no matter where else you go, look at the pron, realize that the images are loading slowly, download a spyware program to clean out the mess, close a few popup windows, in the process find out that something is now broken, try to fix it, then close the website.

With firefox I can rest easy knowing that I don't need anti-spyware software, anti-virus software, and firewall software hogging up system resources. With IE all bets are off, because when you are around whoring other websites, you never know what you are going to get.

Anyone who understands half a damn about IE secutiry settings can make it so IE dosen't get a bit of spyware. The whole "firefox is more secure than IE" is a load of crap IMHO. Before FireFox came out, I never got a single bit of spyware and never had to download any of that "spyware-removal" stuff. The problem is, the average user doesn't understand that when a "would you like to download this activeX control...." box pops up, you don't always click yes....

The point is, an idiot will screw up his computer regardless of his web browser, and a smart person won't screw up his computer regardless of his web browser.

Now, I DO use firefox, but not becasue it's more secure. I use it becasue I love the tabbed browsing, and it seems to load pages a little bit faster than IE. Also, I like the selection of themes you have to use with Firefox.



--this is not directed to anyone at this board, but to people in general:
To be honest (and this is comming from a programmer), I find it funny when people from non-programming backgrounds try and talk about IE's security holes, becasue some of the stuff they say is rediculous, and they really have no idea what they are saying.

[Zelda_fan]

Oh dear god, someone is actually backing activeX, outside of MS? BS!

Most webpages (other than the Macromedia Flash component - and Macromedia has made a standalone so it doesn't really matter) don't use ActiveX controls, BUT a lot of applications make very heavy use of IE's embedded objects and ability to use ActiveX. ActiveX is here to stay, and while I doubt we will see heavy use of it in web sites (which allows FireFox to get away without it), if FireFox wants to rise to more than a web browser, they will eventually have to write in ActiveX support.

[nVidi0t]

I love my Firefox. :)

It is true that there are pages out there that won't load correctly with it that work fine in IE. I had similar problems with Opera, though Firefox is noticeably better in that regard.

Gamespot.com is still a slide show for me...

It's still the best browser though.

[oldsk00l]

Most webpages (other than the Macromedia Flash component - and Macromedia has made a standalone so it doesn't really matter) don't use ActiveX controls, BUT a lot of applications make very heavy use of IE's embedded objects and ability to use ActiveX. ActiveX is here to stay, and while I doubt we will see heavy use of it in web sites (which allows FireFox to get away without it), if FireFox wants to rise to more than a web browser, they will eventually have to write in ActiveX support.

Screw ActiveX, I sure as hell don't need it, and if a web developer wants me viewing their site they had better not use it.

That goes for the rest of us too, roughly 20 million downloads of 1.0?

That's enough clout to tell quite a few sites to stick it.

[Clay]

Anyone who understands half a damn about IE secutiry settings can make it so IE dosen't get a bit of spyware. The whole "firefox is more secure than IE" is a load of crap IMHO.That's only true for informed/capable users. In other words, you're completely ignoring "Joe User" in your statement there. The whole "Firefox is more secure than IE" is not a load of crap if you consider "Joe User" (of which outnumber "informed guy" about 10,000 to 1).

Before FireFox came out, I never got a single bit of spyware and never had to download any of that "spyware-removal" stuff. The problem is, the average user doesn't understand that when a "would you like to download this activeX control...." box pops up, you don't always click yes....Clearly, yes. Again though, you cannot ignore the majority of the user base out there.

The point is, an idiot will screw up his computer regardless of his web browser, and a smart person won't screw up his computer regardless of his web browser.That is true to an extent but it's a very broad brush kind of statement. IE (since it is the big dog) naturally attracts the overwhelming majority of efforts to compromise its integrity. It is not up for debate that, as a result, IE is the most dangerous browser in the hands of a poorly informed user (an institution such as Penn State doesn't make mandates like this everyday (http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=55301109)). This is not directly the fault of IE as it is a by-product of all the concerted efforts to mess with it in the first place. In other words, if the tables were turned and Firefox had 95% percent of the browser usage share for close to a decade and a Microsoft browser (IE) started making noise...I think you get the idea.

Now, I DO use firefox, but not becasue it's more secure. I use it becasue I love the tabbed browsing, and it seems to load pages a little bit faster than IE. Also, I like the selection of themes you have to use with Firefox.Yep, same here.

--this is not directed to anyone at this board, but to people in general:
To be honest (and this is comming from a programmer), I find it funny when people from non-programming backgrounds try and talk about IE's security holes, becasue some of the stuff they say is rediculous, and they really have no idea what they are saying.I'm a software engineer as well (we're a dime-a-dozen nowadays so not sure why that was even worth mentioning in the first place *shrugs*) but that doesn't mean squat to non-programming folks. Whether they are 100% accurate or not isn't important (of course what they say can be picked apart) as much as the fact that they're actually correct in principle for the most part.

[Clay]

Just spotted a link to this really good read over at W2S:

http://poptech.blogspot.com/
Is Firefox a bad web browser? No. Is it the next coming of the Almighty? According to some it would seem that way. It is one thing recommending a program, it is entirely another to preach about something as if you were part of a religious cult. That pretty much sums it up. As with most anything in this life, you need to have some balance and exercise common sense.

[Rakeesh]

Anyone who understands half a damn about IE secutiry settings can make it so IE dosen't get a bit of spyware.

Right, and when you do that, you get activex nags (telling you about site content not being displayed blah blah click ok) with half of the websites you visit, which is even more annoying.

The whole "firefox is more secure than IE" is a load of crap IMHO.

Well its a fact, it is not an oppinion in any respect. Since the release of firefox, IE has already had more exploits than firefox will probably see within the next 5 years at the current rate. And that is major exploits as well, the worst firefox exploits are usually something small like URL spoofing. The average IE exploit that you hear about gives the remote website complete control over your computer.

Before FireFox came out, I never got a single bit of spyware and never had to download any of that "spyware-removal" stuff. The problem is, the average user doesn't understand that when a "would you like to download this activeX control...." box pops up, you don't always click yes....

And in the case of a few websites, clicking no will ask you again about eight times.

The point is, an idiot will screw up his computer regardless of his web browser, and a smart person won't screw up his computer regardless of his web browser.

I don't think you understand what is going on here. You don't necessarily have to click yes on an activex cert to get spyware. There have been many flaws in activex that allow websites to get around this, and many spyware companies have taken advantage of them. Whether you are smart or dumb doesn't make a whole lot of difference anymore with IE.

[Daneel Olivaw]

Screw ActiveX, I sure as hell don't need it, and if a web developer wants me viewing their site they had better not use it.

That goes for the rest of us too, roughly 20 million downloads of 1.0?

That's enough clout to tell quite a few sites to stick it.
Oldskool, I vote you add that retarded ActiveX to your middle finger list in your sig! :afro:

[oldsk00l]

Oldskool, I vote you add that retarded ActiveX to your middle finger list in your sig! :afro:

I would, but Microsoft is a very hardcore capitalist right-wing type of organization...their browser just licks balls...can't flip em off for that :D

[edit]
and when I say "licks balls" I mean sweaty old goat testicles

[CaptNKILL]

Well, I used IE exclusively up until a few weeks ago. It always worked great for me and I never had any severe spyware problems. I switched to Firefox just to see what its like and I do like it better in general, its slower (as in page viewing... some page skip like im using a standard VGA driver, but in IE they run perfectly smooth), and has more compatibility problems (some pages just dont work, some multimedia plugins just dont work) but I like the features more. Tabbed viewing is great. And I cant believe I ever went without that little search box. Its so amazing! I always have to look words up on dictionary.com. Now it takes like 3 seconds to do :)

As for the whole spyware thing. I have no more or no less spyware now than I did when I used IE every day for everything. Actually, the other day I did my first virus scan in months and found 2 little (harmless) viruses. Guess where they were though. In my Java cache folder. If theres any problem with security holes its in Java.

[ricercar]

Fuxorz IE. Tabbed br0ws3rz rulez!

[Clay]

Fuxorz IE. Tabbed br0ws3rz rulez!
:) Yeah the funny thing is; IE tabbed browsing has been possible with a number of third party utils for years. Sure, native support is always nice but Opera has had that too for years. Regardless, I still prefer Firefox for most of my browsing.

[Vagrant Zero]

Netscape introduced me to the concept of tabbed browsing. I never went back.

[MustangSVT]

Everything has an end including Firefox. Right now it's better than IE because less people use it so there's less exploits and spyware. If everyone would use Firefox, more people would go back to IE because there'd be less spyware.

While I like Firefox (I use it), it's similar to saying Linux is safer than Windows. It's just safer than Windows because the userbase of Windows is a million times bigger. Nothing is perfect.

BTW, Firefox's download of files is still slower than IE, I get about 600kb/s with IE in some cases, with Firefox, it only goes to around 250-300. That's my only complain about it. But then again, that's why I use DAP to get like 800KB/s+ every time.