9500 Pro reviews

[jbirney]

With both Anandtechs and B3D reviews out now its nice to see ATI pushing the level of compettion. The reviews show the the 9500Pro to be close the gf4ti4600 at most settings. Once these things show up in volume the on line price should fall to make it a better deal to the consumers.

[PreservedSwine]

Very impressive.

Basically, without AF and FSAA, it's in between the Ti4400 and Ti4600,.

Enable aniso and FSAA, then it smokes the Ti cards, by a considerable margin.

Awesome card!


In the tech reports conclusion:
It's no contest. NVIDIA's product line is a generation behind, and with the debut of the Radeon 9500 Pro, there's little reason left to buy a GeForce4. I would take a Radeon 9500 Pro over a GeForce4 Ti 4200, easy, but don't stop there. I'd rather have a 9500 Pro than a GeForce4 Ti 4600, too.

In hothardware's cocnlusion after the UT2K3 tests:
With like AA and Aniso Filtering settings, the Radeon 9500 Pro is 44 - 57% faster than even the GeForce 4 Ti 4600, in these two tests. We're not sure how else we could slice or dice this for you. It's fairly easy to digest in any scenario. The Radeon 9500 Pro wins hands down by a huge margin, in this fantastic new First Person Shooter from Epic. We'll sound that GeForce FX bell again. Time to get a substitute into the ring NVIDIA, ATi is dealing a knock-out here.


http://www.hothardware.com/hh_files...n_9500pro.shtml

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=1756

http://www.tech-report.com/

[druga runda]

http://firingsquad.gamers.com/hardware/9500pro/default.asp



As of today, ATI's GeForce4 Ti 4200 killer (the RADEON 9500 PRO) is ready for public consumption. However, not only is the RADEON 9500 PRO more than a match for the Ti 4200, it's also capable of outperforming NVIDIA's flagship GeForce4 Ti 4600 in some situations! If you're in the market for a new video card, you'll definitely want to check out today's review!


is there anything more to say?

[thcdru2k]

how much and where can i get one ? :D

[Joe DeFuria]

Wow....

Basically, there is no reason to buy ANY nVidia card once the 9500 Pro becomes available... ATI has them beat everywhere.

For sure, this will force the prices of the GeForce4 ti down even further in hopes to compete.

[jbirney]

Basically, there is no reason to buy ANY nVidia card once the 9500 Pro becomes available... ATI has them beat everywhere.

Well I agree with the numbers and based of numbers and features there is no contest any more. However you still have brand loyality and some pople wont care based off that. And thats fine. Also the driver thing, personally I have never had any serrious driver problem on ANY video card i have every owend. I have never had an issue that was bad enough to even warrent swapping out cards. I have had lots of minor issues with some things not working right or glictch with every card. But nothing that ever ruined my game play. But ATI still has a bad driver rap and I could see people staying away just cuze the think/hear/feel that their drivers are still bad. Personally I dont think they are bad at all but that is just my experince and every one is different...

[druga runda]

I hope they don't delay NV34 and NV 31 for too long, as we will start praying that Nvidia stays competitive... :D

All these delays/ NV30/ Nforce2/ Nforce... are almost to be concerned about.

And that Tech-Report article stated that many Nvidia engineers went back to SGI :eek: Why would that be? Too many 3DFX ones?

[thcdru2k]

now hopefully this makes nvidia realize they shouldn't limit the performance of the nv34 or nv30 mx counterpart.

[Megatron]

For a sub 200 dollar card the 9500 Pro looks great.
Competitive to a Ti4600 and under 200 bucks.:eek:

"Here the Radeon 9500 Pro is slightly faster than a Ti 4600; you can thank the newdrivers for the 18% increase in performance over the original card we tested."
~AnandTech Review~


ATI and Driver performance INCREASES??? There must be snow in Hades.:eek: :D


Nvidia really has its work cut out for them.

[thcdru2k]

the 9500pro has all the ti's beat because of aa and af. i'm sure the performance part for nv30 should be very competitive.

[FastM]

All i have to say is wow. ATI have really pulled it together with their 9xxx product line. I hate to admit it but i think i want a 9500 first, wait until the next GeforceFX revision comes along before i go back.

[Nv40]

Originally posted by Joe DeFuria
Wow....

Basically, there is no reason to buy ANY nVidia card once the 9500 Pro becomes available... ATI has them beat everywhere.

For sure, this will force the prices of the GeForce4 ti down even further in hopes to compete.

there was no reason to Buy the first radeon8500 , because
Nvidia GeForce3,Geforce3ti500,and Geforce4 were much faster ,
with much better drivers .

only months later of the Geforce4 release ,
the radeon8500 were good enough to compete with the Geforce3ti500 .

thanks to lower prices and for unknown reasons ,
people owned a radeon8500 .
ATi survived for a Full year!! without releasing any other competitive product. :)

So i think its safe to say ,Nvidia will be able to survive
for half the time ATI survived ..that is 6 months!! ,
until GeforceFX hits retails ...
with the already sucessfull Geforce4 ti200 ( $130 in pricewatch ) which overclocks VERY! easily with default heatsink/fan to GF4 ti4600 levels.. ;)

so in my opinion from $100-$150 the geforce4 ti200 IS
the card to get period. because is much faster than the radeon9500 at default speed ,and competitive and sometimes
faster than the (PRO version) when overcloked .


by the time DirectX9 titles are available ,the Nv30 and r300
will be the minimun required for all games.
Directx9 games is not in the horizon in 2-3 years .
lets cross fingers for Directx 8 games first! :)

[Smokey]

I think its safe to say from eveyone, that ATI have done a great job thus far. But one important thing people seem to forgetting, is that Nvidia hasnt released a new chipset in what? almost a year! So, once Nvidia releases thier next chipset, and releases thier next range of cards high, mid and low end based on the GeforceFX chipset, then we will see just how far in front or behind ATI really are.

[Bigus Dickus]

Originally posted by Nv40
there was no reason to Buy the first radeon8500 , because
Nvidia GeForce3,Geforce3ti500,and Geforce4 were much faster ,
with much better drivers .

only months later of the Geforce4 release ,
the radeon8500 were good enough to compete with the Geforce3ti500 .

thanks to lower prices and for unknown reasons ,
people owned a radeon8500 .
ATi survived for a Full year!! without releasing any other competitive product. :)

I purchased the 8500 when it was released because it was nearly $100 cheaper (for me) than the GF3 it was in competition with. Even at release, it was as fast as a GF3 in most cases. By the time the GF3 Ti500 hit the shelves (for even a larger price difference) the 8500 had improved to be very close on its heels. By January it was beating the Ti500, and had saved me a large amount of money, and I had a better performing card.

There's your "unknown" reasons. ;) Price matters.

[jbirney]

So i think its safe to say ,Nvidia will be able to survive
for half the time ATI survived ..that is 6 months!! ,
until GeforceFX hits retails ...
with the already sucessfull Geforce4 ti200 ( $130 in pricewatch ) which overclocks VERY! easily with default heatsink/fan to GF4 ti4600 levels..

Many issues with that:

1) Not evey card over clocks that well. My GF4 ti4200 only got 5 mhz more before I had artifacts in 3dmarks.

2) If you read the FiringSquad review they hinted that the 9500Pros are monster overclockers as well. Think about it. Anandtech showed that the R300 could clock to 400mhz. The 9500pro is simular IC clocked at 275mhz. Knowing that the core can hit 125mhz more i would say there is OC'ing room.

3) again when comparing prices either compare MSRP to MSRP or on-line to on-line. Given that the 9500 has an MSRP of $199 and you can find it for $159 (or $150 w/o shipping) then you will have a nice drop when the 9500pro hits the streets in another week or so. And last time i checked MSRP for the GF4 Ti4200 was $199 which makes it only $20 cheaper than the 9500Pro.


so in my opinion from $100-$150 the geforce4 ti200 IS
the card to get period. because is much faster than the radeon9500 at default speed ,and competitive and sometimes
faster than the (PRO version) when overcloked .

Note sure which reviews you read but the 9500pro in no aa and af benchmarks was close to the ti4600 (it won some. mainly the DX titiles and lost others, mainly the opengl games). Then factor in AF and AA and you have the 9500 pro faster at x6 AA and x16 AF than the GF4 ti4600 is at only at x4 AA and x8 AF. When they are set to the same settings the 9500 pro was almost twice as fast as the GF4 ti4600! Think about that for a second. And realize for the money its a dam good buy.

Now if you comparing to the 9500 then yea I think that card is not very good for any medium to hard core IQ junky.


by the time DirectX9 titles are available ,the Nv30 and r300
will be the minimun required for all games.
Directx9 games is not in the horizon in 2-3 years .
lets cross fingers for Directx 8 games first!

The thing is the more cards that have dx9 in them the sooner we could see DX9 games. I agree its a long ways off. But to put DX9 at the main stream (200 dollar range) BEFORE the API is out is amazing!

I think its safe to say from eveyone, that ATI have done a great job thus far. But one important thing people seem to forgetting, is that Nvidia hasnt released a new chipset in what? almost a year! So, once Nvidia releases thier next chipset, and releases thier next range of cards high, mid and low end based on the GeforceFX chipset, then we will see just how far in front or behind ATI really are.

The moment the 9700 shipped we knew nV was behind. the fact that in a .plan update from JonhyC early this year where he stated ATI was a full 1/2 cycle ahead of NV we knew taht they were behind. When ATI released the 8500 that still had more features than the GF4 we knew that they were behind. Each day that the NV30 does not ship they get even further behind. In no way is the spelling doom or the end for nV. The will probably loose some market share but I am sure they will rebound. Also we only have had the high end annoucements of the nV30 no firm annoucements on their mid stream parts where as ATI is shipping theirs today....

[StealthHawk]

Originally posted by Smokey
I think its safe to say from eveyone, that ATI have done a great job thus far. But one important thing people seem to forgetting, is that Nvidia hasnt released a new chipset in what? almost a year! So, once Nvidia releases thier next chipset, and releases thier next range of cards high, mid and low end based on the GeforceFX chipset, then we will see just how far in front or behind ATI really are.

not exactly. by the time we can buy gfFX, then there will have been 1 year difference from announcement of the gf4 to the availability of the gfFX. and of course that does nothing for the midrange or lowend sectors. it will still be a few more months until nvidia does anything there.

[Nv40]

Not evey card over clocks that well. My GF4 ti4200 only got 5 mhz more before I had artifacts in 3dmarks

today Geforce4 ti 200's are much better overclokers than
the original ones.. i mean look at any review today of this card!
Any! and you will see that Manufacturers are adding
the "highly overcloakeable " tag ,as a feature..

Gainward,Abit,leadtek and a couple of more i dont remember their names.. overclocks beyond Geforce4ti 4600 default speed.
and that without special cooling.. playing even the most demanding titles like Ut2003 at high quality settings 1600x1200.
with AA+af off.

today Gf4's ships with more overcloeable DDr memory..

and there is no way ATi can compete with the Geforce4 ti200
in price/performance category.. at least not for along time
no way.. unless ATi wants
to lose money in the radeon9500 pro wich cost $199+ .
ATI can release discounts coupons for a very limited number of radeon9500pro for much less money ,loosing money ..just for marketing.. to benefit a couple of lucky guys ...
but dont think that standar price will be as low as $150
anytime soon. thats ridiculous..

in computer stores like EBX ,Gamesdepot and others
where the majority of people buy their video cards
the Radeon9700pro is still $399 :(
and people keep posting numbers like $329 here
and there ,without posting the $30+ additional it can cost for shipping/handling and income taxes :rolleyes:

ask to Canadians or Europeans and other countries
about how competitives are the prices of video cards there.. lol!

so Dont expect the radeon9500pro a $200-$220 (new card)
to be at $150 .. even more when its not even available in the shelves :rolleyes:

in the other hand Nvidia have more room to play with
lower prices than ATi .with their Geforce4's (one generation old )

if you have the money ,there is no doubt that the Radeon9500pro is the best card overall for $200-$220 ..
but for the ones that dont have the money
the ti 200 for $130-$150 is no question ..

just look at Biggus. he bough and radeon8500 because it was $100 cheaper .

in fact i was very impressed with ATI . how they managed to sell their clearly defeated radeon8500.
even with all the negative internet stuff about their drivers/cheats
and hardware stability.

looks at ANands benchmarks.. only in last summer (june) ATi was able to compete with the Gf3ti500.

the Geforce4ti200 is the Nvidia best selling card for one reason
dont you think?, much cheapier than its biggest brother ti4600 , with the same performance when overcloked . and i dont see ATi 9500pro or even more the 9500, better than Geforce4ti200
in price/performance competition.

Remember that ATI has a radeon9500 (non-pro) to sell..
the most cheapier ATi card to design .
and they cannot kill the sales of of its own products releasing
a radeon9500pro at $150.

[gokickrocks]

Originally posted by Nv40
today Geforce4 ti 200's are much better overclokers than
the original ones.. i mean look at any review today of this card!
Any! and you will see that Manufacturers are adding
the "highly overcloakeable " tag ,as a feature..

Gainward,Abit,leadtek and a couple of more i dont remember their names.. overclocks beyond Geforce4ti 4600 default speed.
and that without special cooling.. playing even the most demanding titles like Ut2003 at high quality settings 1600x1200.
with AA+af off.

today Gf4's ships with more overcloeable DDr memory..

and there is no way ATi can compete with the Geforce4 ti200
in price/performance category.. at least not for along time
no way.. unless ATi wants
to lose money in the radeon9500 pro wich cost $199+ .
ATI can release discounts coupons for a very limited number of radeon9500pro for much less money ,loosing money ..just for marketing.. to benefit a couple of lucky guys ...
but dont think that standar price will be as low as $150
anytime soon. thats ridiculous..

in computer stores like EBX ,Gamesdepot and others
where the majority of people buy their video cards
the Radeon9700pro is still $399 :(
and people keep posting numbers like $329 here
and there ,without posting the $30+ additional it can cost for shipping/handling and income taxes :rolleyes:

ask to Canadians or Europeans and other countries
about how competitives are the prices of video cards there.. lol!

so Dont expect the radeon9500pro a $200-$220 (new card)
to be at $150 .. even more when its not even available in the shelves :rolleyes:

in the other hand Nvidia have more room to play with
lower prices than ATi .with their Geforce4's (one generation old )

if you have the money ,there is no doubt that the Radeon9500pro is the best card overall for $200-$220 ..
but for the ones that dont have the money
the ti 200 for $130-$150 is no question ..

just look at Biggus. he bough and radeon8500 because it was $100 cheaper .

in fact i was very impressed with ATI . how they managed to sell their clearly defeated radeon8500.
even with all the negative internet stuff about their drivers/cheats
and hardware stability.

looks at ANands benchmarks.. only in last summer (june) ATi was able to compete with the Gf3ti500.

the Geforce4ti200 is the Nvidia best selling card for one reason
dont you think?, much cheapier than its biggest brother ti4600 , with the same performance when overcloked . and i dont see ATi 9500pro or even more the 9500, better than Geforce4ti200
in price/performance competition.

Remember that ATI has a radeon9500 (non-pro) to sell..
the most cheapier ATi card to design .
and they cannot kill the sales of of its own products releasing
a radeon9500pro at $150.

a truely fanboy post...
brand loyalty is one thing, but trying to justify every single thing is ridiculous...

why are you comparing an overclocked g4 ti4200 to a non-overclocked 9500 pro?

you also assume ATI is losing lots of money in releasing products at a cheaper price...why do you care? are you their CFO? hey, i got an idea, lets start COMPLAINING about products that sell for a LOW price

and i do believe the 9500 pro has the g4 ti4200 beat in the price/performance category, as i am one of those that likes to play with AA and AF on

[SocketAzzWipe]

Originally posted by gokickrocks
a truely fanboy post...
brand loyalty is one thing, but trying to justify every single thing is ridiculous...

why are you comparing an overclocked g4 ti4200 to a non-overclocked 9500 pro?

you also assume ATI is losing lots of money in releasing products at a cheaper price...why do you care? are you their CFO? hey, i got an idea, lets start COMPLAINING about products that sell for a LOW price

and i do believe the 9500 pro has the g4 ti4200 beat in the price/performance category, as i am one of those that likes to play with AA and AF on


I agree...I like to see him/her crank the aniso at max and hit 4 x aa and see how fun it is to play on a TI4200...what a loser.

[jbirney]

Originally posted by Nv40

in computer stores like EBX ,Gamesdepot and others
where the majority of people buy their video cards
the Radeon9700pro is still $399 :(
and people keep posting numbers like $329 here
and there ,without posting the $30+ additional it can cost for shipping/handling and income taxes :rolleyes:

7 days after the 9700pro showed up on on-line stores I found one at ENPC for $338.00 with free shipping at that time. Since I live in another state there was no sales tax. My final price for the 9700pro again 7 days after it showed up was $338.00. Sales tax only applies to states where that store/vendor/company has a taxable presense. Agreed shipping does add cost. But it adds cost to the final price of the GF4 cards that you buy on-line. And yes every now and then you can find a free shipping deal. but that applies to both cards...



ask to Canadians or Europeans and other countries
about how competitives are the prices of video cards there.. lol!

yea but that door swings both ways. Depending on the country one can be much cheaper than the other...



so Dont expect the radeon9500pro a $200-$220 (new card)
to be at $150 .. even more when its not even available in the shelves :rolleyes:

yea 150 would be a steal but I doubt you will see it there at first. I am thinking $170-ish is where it will show up on-line at first.


if you have the money ,there is no doubt that the Radeon9500pro is the best card overall for $200-$220 ..
but for the ones that dont have the money
the ti 200 for $130-$150 is no question

Again please dont quote MSRP prices against on-line prices. Its not valid. I have shown you that with in once week the R9700 pro prices fell by $70 bucks on-line. The 9500s have fallen by $50 on-line since their launch about a week ago. So if your going compare on-line please realise this fact and I am sure you will see the 9500pro on-line for less than $200 with in one week that it actually shows up....wanna bet?



the Geforce4ti200 is the Nvidia best selling card for one reason
dont you think?, much cheapier than its biggest brother ti4600 , with the same performance when overcloked . and i dont see ATi 9500pro or even more the 9500, better than Geforce4ti200
in price/performance competition.

First of all the ti4200 is not the best seller. That belongs to either the GF2mx or the GF4 Mx. Sorry but the bulk of the volume is the value (sub $100) market.

Price/Proformance ratio? well if you consider AA or AF then its easly best the ti4200. Even if you can compare MSRP to the absolute lowest price you can find a GF4 ti4200. In AA/AF benchies the 9500pro is more than TWICE as fast as the GF4 ti4600 thus giving it the edge in price/performace ratios. Now non-aa and af benchis then thats not the case.

[pelly]

Actually, the best-selling card is the very old TNT series......believe it...or not....

:D

[sebazve]

the r9500 pro rocks period:D . I hope Nvidia dont **** again their next MX line

[Bigus Dickus]

GF4 Ti4200 better price/performance ration than the 9500 Pro?

Um... right. With just a bit of AA/AF (not max settings by any means) the 9500 pro is 100% faster for 40% more money. Looks like a no brainer, if you are willing to spend the extra ~$50. Only a fanboy could think otherwise.

[Nv40]

Originally posted by Bigus Dickus
GF4 Ti4200 better price/performance ration than the 9500 Pro?

Um... right. With just a bit of AA/AF (not max settings by any means) the 9500 pro is 100% faster for 40% more money. Looks like a no brainer, if you are willing to spend the extra ~$50. Only a fanboy could think otherwise.

i think so! as i have said ATi cannot compete in price/performace
with Nvidia. because their cards are new ,more expensive to develop (more transistors) .

can ATI match this.. a Geforce4ti200 for $89 ?

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=40&threadid=917720

wow! the power of a Geforce4ti4600 for $89.. !!!
i bet the Geforce4 ti4600 will be soon as low as $130...

its only FAnboism and ignorance what makes people
believe the "poor" performance of Geforce4 cards..

i play Doom3 in high quality in my Geforce4 with only 30%
slower performance than my friends Radeon 9700pro in same setttings..

just tell me ,i would like a new video card for my second machine!


will you pay an extra $100 for a radeon9500pro to raise aniso/aa a bit more ?

ATi has done a good Job with their radeons 95xx/(97xx) series ,
but only FAnboys will claim that Nvidia cannot compete with
ATi ,even without its Nv30... if Ati have been competitive
in the past in price/performance , Why makes you all think
that Nvidia cant do it too ?

but as others have said .. "i see know reason to buy Nvidia products" :rolleyes:

[Kruno]

Some of us don't buy Ati cards for pure gaming features. :)

I will buy a Radeon 9500 Pro for the fact it has superior 2d, DVD speed with the performance of AA and AF to blow the Ti4600 away.

It's the package deal I am concerned about. The Nv20-Nv25 do not currently offer a package deal I want. So in that case Nvidia are not going to get my money.