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oldsk00l
05-23-05, 12:03 PM
It IS VAPORWARE. IT DOESN'T EXIST YET. Something that cannot be purchased and taken home RIGHT NOW is not "mainstream". OMFG man why do you think I am a hardcore gamer? I preordered my 360 with 50$ down at Gamestop already.

DUKE NUKEM FOREVER IS A ROXX0RZ GAME w00t!!!
IT IS TEH MIANSTRAEM GAEM TOO!!!!

|MaguS|
05-23-05, 12:09 PM
I've started to ignore steeda, he doesn't understand the definition of Vaporware... the systems do exist, in prototype form or even in a single unit. I saw many Xbox 360s RUNNING at the show and I saw the PS3 at the show aswell, it didn't look like a shell to me but who knows other then sony but they do exist...

Vagrant Zero
05-23-05, 12:12 PM
Thats IF it was pre-rendered. I still don't believe it was.

It's Pre-Rendered. I can't believe you guys can't tell just by looking at it. The FFVII demo was also pre-rendered.

|MaguS|
05-23-05, 12:29 PM
Um, The FFVII video wasn't pre-rendered it was 100% stated at the press conference that it is a real-time tech demo.

evilchris
05-23-05, 12:29 PM
lol @ egbtmagus

oldsk00l
05-23-05, 01:09 PM
I've started to ignore steeda, he doesn't understand the definition of Vaporware... the systems do exist, in prototype form or even in a single unit. I saw many Xbox 360s RUNNING at the show and I saw the PS3 at the show aswell, it didn't look like a shell to me but who knows other then sony but they do exist...

Then you're saying DNF isn't vaporware either.

oldsk00l
05-23-05, 01:11 PM
question for egbtmagus

what was this all about then??

http://amdzone.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=133&page=1

intercede007
05-23-05, 01:11 PM
I've started to ignore steeda, he doesn't understand the definition of Vaporware... the systems do exist, in prototype form or even in a single unit. I saw many Xbox 360s RUNNING at the show and I saw the PS3 at the show aswell, it didn't look like a shell to me but who knows other then sony but they do exist...

Sure..vaporware is probably being loosely applied to the XBOX 360 and the PS3.

But lets be very clear. The XBOX 360 kits are all pre-alpha and so are the PS3's. For all intents and purposes, for what you and I are expecting to buy in a couple months, the consoles don't yet exist.

evilchris
05-23-05, 01:14 PM
question for egbtmagus

what was this all about then??

http://amdzone.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=133&page=1

But the ps3 was real! So was killzone 2!!!!

oldsk00l
05-23-05, 01:25 PM
The first picture I've ever seen of the emotion engine was way before the PS2 was announced. It consisted of a shelf with 4 racks, filled to the brim with equipment and the best it could muster was about 1/4 of their performance target.

The PS2 may have existed in the inventor's brain but that doesn't count. It existed when it hit the shelves en-masse. Same for PS3/xbox360.

It doesn't exist because someone showed a demo, in fact the demo doesn't really exist because it's just a demo that you don't have access too. All of it, vaporware.

For sheer bright lights, glitz, and badass imagery Sony is pummeling Microsoft like the guy in fight club beating the blonde dude unrecognizeable.

However, let's see what happens when they ship. The 360 will hit the shelves and it will be the other way around.

Gah, we're all such finkle fans that this discussion is about as relevant as my "Star Trek vs Starwars" thread.

|MaguS|
05-23-05, 03:07 PM
question for egbtmagus

what was this all about then??

http://amdzone.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=133&page=1

Thats the same thing that was posted on anad, literally identical... look at the booth they are showing off, its the same one anad took pics of. None have pictures of COD2 and other titles.

rohit
05-24-05, 01:01 PM
But the ps3 was real! So was killzone 2!!!!
PS3 wasnt running. it was the DAMN 6800U sli'd up..
according to this.http://www.penstarsys.com/editor/company/nvidia/g70_spec/g70_spec_2.htm
this proves, jus like the xbox360 was runing on some kind of an ATi card and not the xbox 360 in real, similarly sony's PS3 was running on 6800U Sli'd.

|MaguS|
05-24-05, 01:05 PM
That has nothing to do with the PS3 at all, Nvidia has gone on the record and stated that the RSX is NOT the G70.

oldsk00l
05-24-05, 01:17 PM
Thanks magus, I was about to ask :D

havox
05-25-05, 12:37 AM
I only choose PS3 because that's where my favorite games are;)
I doubt Sony would empress me at all with PS3 power, maybe if we only compared it to PS2 it will sure be 3X better but that's it! The hype is all crap since they hyped PS2 with the PS2 = supercomputer!! total crap!

PS3 performs 2TFlop As they claim, a super Computer reaches 90TF WTF with the comparison lol!
Don't expect much guys even next gen wont be something amazing, look at doom3 it was hyped so damn much & now look how much bashing going on after people had it within their hands. Seems false advertisement is a norm nowadays
:\
Real SUPER COMPUTERS! (http://www.top500.org/lists/plists.php?TB=1&M=11&Y=2004)

|MaguS|
05-25-05, 06:04 AM
If PS3 preforms 2Tflop max (not peak) it would be in the top 200 of super computers so yeah... its a good comparison. All those Super Computers cost thousands of dollars, the PS3 is not even 1/3 thier cost so if it can produce 2TFlops then its a very powerful system for its price.

(Xbox 360 aswell, only mentioned PS3 since havox decided to pick it out of the two)

kev13dd
05-28-05, 07:26 PM
Oh, Also... Please explain these flaws that do not happen in CGI

Lighting and Shadowing flaw
users.coditel.net/COD11731/kill.wmv

Soldier poping/clipping into the vehicle
users.coditel.net/COD11731/teleport.wmv

Any competent CGI artist wouldn't make such flaws since CGI is done frame by frame and all flaws can easily be seen prior to rendering.

Who said a simple trailer? Plus they needed to write the engine and create the new art... that can take months alone. Look at Unreal, how long do you think it took them just to create the small amount of content they have shown so far? They have been working on the engine alone for over 2 years now...

Just by that comment, I can honestly see that you don't know jack crap about programming or game design... Not every developer is EA who rehashes the same Engine and art, year after year...

Because they finished the demo 3 days before it had to go on display perhaps?

K

Kain
06-03-05, 12:23 AM
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/617/617951p1.html

EvilEye
06-03-05, 09:12 AM
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/617/617951p1.html

Does IGN even know what they are talking about??

|MaguS|
06-03-05, 09:15 AM
Funny thing that article comes from Microsoft, Its 100% MS documentation. It's not IGN's POV, You can see it was basically written for people with no real hardware knowledge.

EvilEye
06-03-05, 09:20 AM
Funny thing that article comes from Microsoft, Its 100% MS documentation. It's not IGN's POV, You can see it was basically written for people with no real hardware knowledge.
Yeah, saw that now... Well that figures....in other words IGN bought the propaganda ;)

Ruined
06-03-05, 09:51 AM
Yeah, saw that now... Well that figures....in other words IGN bought the propaganda

Funnily enough the MS PR is actually correct in some areas.

For instance, the XBOX360 CPU apparently will be faster than PS3 Cell CPU in AI, Physics and other non-graphics general calculations.

Link:
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/xbox360-2.ars/7

"At any rate, Playstation 3 fanboys shouldn't get all flush over the idea that the Xenon will struggle on non-graphics code. However bad off Xenon will be in that department, the PS3's Cell will probably be worse. The Cell has only one PPE to the Xenon's three, which means that developers will have to cram all their game control, AI, and physics code into at most two threads that are sharing a very narrow execution core with no instruction window. (Don't bother suggesting that the PS3 can use its SPEs for branch-intensive code, because the SPEs lack branch prediction entirely.) Furthermore, the PS3's L2 is only 512K, which is half the size of the Xenon's L2. So the PS3 doesn't get much help with branches in the cache department. In short, the PS3 may fare a bit worse than the Xenon on non-graphics code, but on the upside it will probably fare a bit better on graphics code because of the seven SPEs."

Physics/AI/non-graphics calculations are arguably more important than graphics calculations, as both the XBOX360 and PS3 have powerful GPUs. Therefore in the end, it is very possible that the XBOX360 CPU will fare better than the PS3 Cell CPU for gaming since both consoles already have powerful GPUs for graphics but will be reliant on the CPU for AI, Physics, and other general calculations - and this is where the PS3 Cell CPU falls short of the XBOX360 CPU. I know that Sony's original Cell design had 2 fully functional CPU cores instead of 1, which would have put the CPU more on par with the XBOX360 CPU, but that never came to be. I'd also imagine that originally the Cell CPU did a significant part of the graphics calculations to help the Graphics Synthesizer 3, however now with Nvidia's RSX it seems wholly unnecessary. In other words, I think the current cell design might be inferior to the XBOX360 CPU considering the strength of the GPUs in both consoles and the PS3's larger weakness at non-graphics calculations/ai/physics.