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Bad_Boy
05-25-05, 08:45 PM
not sure on the credibility of this site but...
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9165

David Zucker, CEO of resurgent publisher Midway Games, has revealed that the company's next-gen strategy includes releasing titles to support the launch of PlayStation 3, but not Microsoft's Xbox 360.

Speaking to TheStreet.com, Zucker said that Midway's intention for the moment is to balance current generation and next generation development - but that while "we're certainly going to have games for the launch of the PS3, we don't have any games for the launch of the Xbox 360."

Pressed on his reasoning, Zucker explained that it's a "pretty small install base... To really maximise, to get the performance out of some of the games, it's going to take some time to do that. And we want to make sure we're launching high-quality titles."

At no point did Zucker rule out providing support for Xbox 360 further down the line - and indeed, Midway has been largely platform-agnostic in the current generation, generally keeping the bulk of its product multi-platform."

plot thickens...

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:02 PM
um, no. Read the report.

Midway is a multiplatform dev, who generally releases titles across all platforms at once. They simply won't have any games ready for X360 launch because it would be most profitable to develop games concurrently so they can come out with both x360/ps3 at the same time.

EDIT: midway has now confirmed 7 games in dev for xbox360 :)

Bad_Boy
05-25-05, 09:05 PM
so wait, they work on ps3 games and not xbox360 games because xbox360 is coming out first? makes sense to me :/

im just saying "Midway to support PS3 at launch, but not Xbox 360" why not work on xbox360 first, then ps3? and release the games at the same time? what the article is saying is that there are no games in development for the 360 at all or atleast coming at launch for xbox360.

i know they will probally make games for the xbox360 in the future. i did read it.
At no point did Zucker rule out providing support for Xbox 360 further down the line - and indeed, Midway has been largely platform-agnostic in the current generation, generally keeping the bulk of its product multi-platform."

maybe my topic was misleading..

edit: changed it for you :)

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:22 PM
so wait, they work on ps3 games and not xbox360 games because xbox360 is coming out first? makes sense to me :/

im just saying "Midway to support PS3 at launch, but not Xbox 360" why not work on xbox360 first, then ps3? and release the games at the same time? what the article is saying is that there are no games in development for the 360 at all or atleast coming at launch for xbox360.

i know they will probally make games for the xbox360 in the future. i did read it.


maybe my topic was misleading..

edit: changed it for you :)

But see, the thing is that the XBOX360 launch is in 6 months, that is why Midway cited time as a constraint. The PS3 launch is in over a year. 6 months is a lot less time to get a game ready than a year. It is likely whatever games they have ready for PS3 launch will come out concurrently on XBOX360. In that case, they will deliver games that are complete and work well, while maximizing profit by having a larger installed base on XBOX360 by the time PS3 comes out. When XBOX1 first came out, Midway rushed to develop for it and the games they came out with (Spyhunter, Gauntlet: Dark Legacy) had bugs, crashes, and looked inferior to the PS2 versions that had come out far earlier. If the two consoles launched on the same date, this story would be more newsworthy.

|MaguS|
05-25-05, 09:24 PM
Dam, I wanted to play Gears of War. Game looked good, was one of the few 360 titles that really interested me.

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:25 PM
Dam, I wanted to play Gears of War. Game looked good, was one of the few 360 titles that really interested me.

Gears of War is a Microsoft title, not Midway. Irrelevant to this story.

|MaguS|
05-25-05, 09:26 PM
No, Its an Epic title... which is owned by Midway.

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:27 PM
No, Its an Epic title... which is owned by Midway.

Nope, its a Microsoft title. :) Epic is the dev, Microsoft is the publisher that is paying them to make the game for them. Microsoft controls when it will be released, etc, Midway has nothing to do with it - Microsoft owns the game. This article refers to Midway not having any games ready to publish for XBOX360 launch, it says nothing about the Epic dev studio.

That being said, I wouldn't count on Gears of War being ready at launch anyway as it would steal the thunder from Perfect Dark Zero, another MS title - though you never know. A lot of the Unreal Engine 3 screens that have been given to the press over the past year or so (such as during NV40 launch) have actually been from Gears of War, which I didnt realize (I thought the monsters they showcased would be from Unreal 3). So obviously GoW has been in dev for quite some time.

Bad_Boy
05-25-05, 09:35 PM
But see, the thing is that the XBOX360 launch is in 6 months, that is why Midway cited time as a constraint. The PS3 launch is in over a year. 6 months is a lot less time to get a game ready than a year. It is likely whatever games they have ready for PS3 launch will come out concurrently on XBOX360. In that case, they will deliver games that are complete and work well, while maximizing profit by having a larger installed base on XBOX360 by the time PS3 comes out. When XBOX1 first came out, Midway rushed to develop for it and the games they came out with (Spyhunter, Gauntlet: Dark Legacy) had bugs, crashes, and looked inferior to the PS2 versions that had come out far earlier. If the two consoles launched on the same date, this story would be more newsworthy.
makes it sound like the xbox360 versions might be ports :(

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:36 PM
makes it sound like the xbox360 versions might be ports :(

Midway probably will use middleware to develop for X360/PS3 like most multiplatform developers, making all versions optimized "ports." It is the most cost-effective way to develop multiplatform games, and was the way it worked last generation, too. Midway titles across all platforms were nearly identical.

Bad_Boy
05-25-05, 09:45 PM
Midway probably will use middleware to develop for X360/PS3 like most multiplatform developers, making all versions optimized "ports." It is the most cost-effective way to develop multiplatform games, and was the way it worked last generation, too. Midway titles across all platforms were nearly identical.
but ports are not neccessarly good when one console is blu-ray (with like 20 gigs of space to use) and the other is dvd (with a max of 9). lots of content will either be cut from one version of the game, or cut from both versions of the game. :(

Ruined
05-25-05, 09:52 PM
but ports are not neccessarly good when one console is blu-ray (with like 20 gigs of space to use) and the other is dvd (with a max of 9). lots of content will either be cut from one version of the game, or cut from both versions of the game. :(

Now this is being fanboyish :)

I don't even know any PC game that has used 8.5GB of space, nevermind console game. Half Life 2, CS:Source, and HL:Source combined took up less than 4gb, Doom3 took up less than 2gb - and that is the latest and greatest PC tech that needs to store multiple resolutions of textures, etc, taking up more space. XBOX supported DVD-9 for their games from the get go (every game is required to be pressed on an 8.5GB DVD-9), and there was like 1 game out of all the XBOX games that came out which used more than 4.5gb of space (MGS2) and it uses 5.5. Most only used a single layer. The only way a game is going to take up 20GB of space is if they encode hours of FMVs in 1080p. I doubt any multiplatform game is going to do that, and even if a game uses lots of FMVs, it will probably still fit no prob on a DVD-9. Worse comes to worse they can simply encode the movies in 480p or 720p. Hopefully with the level of realism we will be seeing in this gen of games we will get AWAY from lots of non-interactive prerendered FMVs and see cutscenes done in realtime like HL2/Doom3.

Bad_Boy
05-25-05, 09:59 PM
Now this is being fanboyish :)

I don't even know any PC game that has used 8.5GB of space, nevermind console game. XBOX supported DVD-9 for their games, and there was like 1 game out of all the XBOX games that used more than 4.5gb of space (MGS2) and it uses 5.5. The only way a game is going to take up 20GB of space is if they encode hours of FMVs in 1080p. I doubt any multiplatform game is going to do that, and even if a game uses lots of FMVs, it will probably still fit no prob on a DVD-9. Worse comes to worse they can simply encode the movies in 480p or 720p.
i dont see how it was a fanboyish comment.

its next gen, who knows how much content they will put in games now. few years ago we probally didnt have many games that could fill up a cdr, now we got games on dvd's/multiple discs. games for years have been around the same lengths to finish/beat for a while, but the size of them keep getting bigger.

epic and midway are just the types of companies to give us extra content other games dont have. (example: midway movies and info on the making of the game in mortal kombat, epic's extra discs that came with ut2k4) who knows what else they will put in next gen stuff.

Ruined
05-25-05, 10:03 PM
i dont see how it was a fanboyish comment.

its next gen, who knows how much content they will put in games now. few years ago we probally didnt have many games that could fill up a cdr, now we got games on dvd's/multiple discs. games for years have been around the same lengths to finish/beat for a while, but the size of them keep getting bigger.

It's fanboyish because 8.5GB is a crapload of space, even for next-gen games. Nothing has even approached that yet, even with games like Half Life 2 using massive textures.

epic and midway are just the types of companies to give us extra content other games dont have. (example: midway movies and info on the making of the game in mortal kombat, epic's extra discs that came with ut2k4) who knows what else they will put in next gen stuff.

And? Half Life 2, CS: Source, HL: Source, and 2 hours of extra DVD-video content with DD5.1 can fit on a DVD-9. Doom3, Ressurection of Evil, and 3 hours of extra DVD-video content with DD5.1 can fit on a DVD-9. Or if you like, Half Life 2, Doom3, and nearly 2 hours of DVD-video content with DD5.1 can fit on a DVD-9. That's not enough space for you? Come on, you are reaching now :) If a company has so many hours of video content they can't fit on a DVD-9 at 720p, they will likely just encode it at 480p. In fact, I'd bet that MS devkits are setup to encode video at DVD-quality, simply because it would serve the DVD-format best. Or even more likely, they will include it as a bonus-disc as has been done for most titles this generation, because an extra disc is a bigger incentive for someone to buy.

The only reason Sony is including Blu-Ray is to help out their movie branch. Has nothing to do with game space requirements, which are easily served by a DVD-9 (or DVD-5 even for most games).

evilchris
05-25-05, 10:23 PM
pEE eSS tHREE == teH l33t, BLU RAY!!! no blUE Ray == SUCK LOZL1!!


...rofl

Blu Ray is useful for movies, not games. For movies, I'll buy a high end Denon Player, not use a game console.

Ruined
05-25-05, 10:44 PM
pEE eSS tHREE == teH l33t, BLU RAY!!! no blUE Ray == SUCK LOZL1!!


...rofl

Blu Ray is useful for movies, not games. For movies, I'll buy a high end Denon Player, not use a game console.

And the funniest part is, 99.9% of people who use a PS3 won't even benefit from watching movies Blu-Ray because they will only have a regular TV. (As opposed to $1500+ HDTVs). It's primarily marketing to help Sony defeat HD-DVD. Not to mention there are no Blu Ray movies out at all currently. Even if there were, I'm not sure buying any amount of movies in a hi-def DVD format that may be beaten out by a competing Hi-Def format would be intelligent. Or likely just stagnate like SACD/DVD-Audio are doing because regular DVD is good enough for the public.

Bad_Boy
05-26-05, 12:15 AM
im just saying, its going to be interesting to see what developers do with so much extra space available. you act like more space is a bad thing? but ofcourse you and steeda support anything that has to do with ps3 so ill shutup. :rolleyes: to think, i thought he was 29.


but what if, even if highly doubtful by yourself, what if they can fill alot of the extra space they are given from blu-ray, would midway cut content from both versions of a game, or just one?

And the funniest part is, 99.9% of people who use a PS3 won't even benefit from watching movies Blu-Ray because they will only have a regular TV. (As opposed to $1500+ HDTVs).
whats funnier is that this sounds even more fanboyish when you act like this is just a ps3 problem. the 360 supports hd also, so wont 99.9% of the people who use SD tv's not benefit from the xbox360's high resolutions according to your numbers? :p

this argument really wont get anywhere until they both come out.

kev13dd
05-26-05, 12:29 AM
whats funnier is that this sounds even more fanboyish when you act like this is just a ps3 problem. the 360 supports hd also, so wont 99.9% of the people who use SD tv's not benefit from the xbox360's high resolutions according to your numbers? :p

DIFFERENCE: The Xbox 360 doesn't come out and say "we aren't shooting for a game console"

The Xbox360 comes out and says "we aim to be the most powerful gaming console and multimedia console out there"

So the fact that PS3 is now claiming such great claim to fame with their HD crap (like "aging" or whatever the hell it is) makes his argument a lot less fanboyish. And yours a lot more stupid

K

Bad_Boy
05-26-05, 12:37 AM
please spare me,
so if the guys at microsoft say they are not focusing on graphics, does it automatically mean the graphics on the xbox360 are going to be garbage. no.


http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9097

Ruined
05-26-05, 12:52 AM
im just saying, its going to be interesting to see what developers do with so much extra space available. you act like more space is a bad thing? but ofcourse you and steeda support anything that has to do with ps3 so ill shutup. :rolleyes: to think, i thought he was 29.

I'm buying both XBOX360 and PS3. I am just being logical. This whole thread is filled with illogical assumptions.


but what if, even if highly doubtful by yourself, what if they can fill alot of the extra space they are given from blu-ray, would midway cut content from both versions of a game, or just one?

Content would never need to be cut, that is silly. The only way they could fill the extra space is with 720p/1080p video content. If they managed to do that, they could simply encode the same content in 480p/DVD Quality to save space, which would be dynamically upscaled to 720p on playback.

Let me ask you a question. How come XBOX this generation had double the space of PS2 and quadruple the space of Gamecube yet no devs had to "cut content" when porting to either console. Answer: DVD-5 was more than enough, plus you can always go multi-disc if necessary. DVD-9 is more than enough for this upcoming gen. You can fit the top 3 most graphically intensive PC games available (FarCry, Doom3, Half Life 2) all together on a single DVD-9.


whats funnier is that this sounds even more fanboyish when you act like this is just a ps3 problem. the 360 supports hd also, so wont 99.9% of the people who use SD tv's not benefit from the xbox360's high resolutions according to your numbers? :p

Because that's not entirely true. If set up right, with realtime rendered graphics even SD users will get a benefit from HD-rendering consoles because it means they could essentially get free SSAA on top of the 4x MSAA that next-gen consoles use since the console renders at 1280x720 by default with all games (at least XBOX360 does - required 720p support on every game). On the other hand, Blu-Ray movies will not look any better than regular DVD on an SD set, in fact they would probably look worse based on downscaling performance of past DVD players, as it is strictly a video source and quality video downscalers are very expensive to implement.

just in terms of resolution, last gen for XBOX SD users it was 720x480 with no AA or 2xQ AA at best. This gen it for XBOX360 SD users it will likely be 720x480 with SSAA and 4xMSAA. In terms of jaggies that's a massive difference. Of course those who have an HDTV will benefit from HD-gaming the most since they will have 1280x720 with 4xMSAA, but even SD users will experience less jaggies because of it.

If I were *only* buying a PS3, I'd be much more concerned with basic things like Sony still not having any decent online service in place, and the fact that the PS3 controller looks like a Batarang. Hopefully they will at least add triggers to it, that is the one thing that annoys me the most about the PS2 controller, especially when playing racing games. These type of things are far more important than Blu-Ray.

Bad_Boy
05-26-05, 01:08 AM
I'm just being concerned. Im buying both also, so i agree with your comment on illogical comments. I'm just not as impressed with what ive seen going on with microsoft on the next gen, as i am with ps3, killzone comments aside.


this argument really wont get anywhere until they both come out.
:p


triggers on the ps3 controller? im pretty sure i saw them. im just hoping mouse and keyboards will be compatible w/ the usb.

edit:
http://gearmedia.ign.com/gear/image/article/615/615976/playstation-3-controller-20050518112950902.jpg
its a concept anyways, i hope they change it to look more like the traditional controller which was my favorite console controller.

evilchris
05-26-05, 01:12 AM
I'm just being concerned. Im buying both also, so i agree with your comment on illogical comments. I'm just not as impressed with what ive seen going on with microsoft on the next gen, as i am with ps3, killzone comments aside.


:p


triggers on the ps3 controller? im pretty sure i saw them. im just hoping mouse and keyboards will be compatible w/ the usb.

There is no way your allowance will be able to get you both.

You're "impressed" with what you've "seen" on the PS3? That's hilarious considering there are no PS3's in the world!

Ruined
05-26-05, 01:13 AM
I'm just being concerned. Im buying both also, so i agree with your comment on illogical comments. I'm just not as impressed with what ive seen going on with microsoft on the next gen, as i am with ps3, killzone comments aside.

Call me skeptical, but Sony's E3 show with the PS2 was a farce compared to the final product. We saw the same prerendered crap, the same ridiculous PR, and we got crap in comparison. The Emotion Engine was a joke. Hopefully Cell would be better, though I could see XBOX360's tri-core CPU being far more easy to take full advantage of than the Cell. But I see the same patterns and hype as I did with PS2 launch with the PS3 launch. Most of the "good stuff" we saw on PS3 was prerenders. On XBOX360 it wasn't as impressive because everything was realtime, and realtime on a devkit that was 1/3 as powerful as the final console.



:p


triggers on the ps3 controller? im pretty sure i saw them. im just hoping mouse and keyboards will be compatible w/ the usb.

Hopefully NOT :) Mouse and keyboard is a bad idea for console. Most people like to play on their couch with a controller. Games have to be programmed differently for controller and m/k (enemy speed, hitboxes, targetting, etc). If a console supported both, likely one or the other would get the shaft in most FPS games (meaning games would be too easy with m/k or too hard with a controller).

But worse yet, online would give m/k users a MASSIVE advantage, meaning everyone would be forced to use a m/k to compete, and I sure as hell don't want to be using an m/k on my couch, thats what my PC is for.

evilchris
05-26-05, 01:14 AM
Mouse and keyboard is an absolute idiotic idea for a console. It's a video game system, not a word processor.

Ruined
05-26-05, 01:17 AM
from that pic, it looks like the PS3 still doesn't have triggers. L2/R2 look like analog shoulder pads with more range than L1/R1. Which is better than PS2, but still not nearly as good as triggers.