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msxyz
06-08-05, 02:17 AM
Dunno, but some posts over at B3D from Dave Baumann hinted that the initial R520 may be a 16 pipeline only design. If it still manages to hit 10K at 3DMark 2005 with "only" 16 peipelines it may be a hell of deisgn.
AngelGraves13
06-08-05, 02:26 AM
I wouldn't worry about something that isn't released yet, and from the score it got in 3DMark (if it's true that is) it'll do fine.
NoWayDude
06-08-05, 03:26 AM
Dunno, but some posts over at B3D from Dave Baumann hinted that the initial R520 may be a 16 pipeline only design. If it still manages to hit 10K at 3DMark 2005 with "only" 16 peipelines it may be a hell of deisgn.
Macci got 9xxx with a X850XPTE, so i would think that the same person can and
will get 10xxx with a R520.
I'm curious to the lack of leaks from G70
This time last year we had a pretty good idea what NV40 was all about
Did Nvidia "killed" the source from this leaks?
That possible explains why there was rumours saying that preferntial partners will get G70 first and the ones that do dealings with both companies would have to wait for later dates.
sandeep
06-08-05, 03:43 AM
Yea well, this is starting to sound similar to what happened with the 5800 Ultra... except the other way around... heh

So Sweeney was correct!! There goes one vote to Sweeney. G70 ofcourse.
NoWayDude
06-08-05, 04:04 AM
Just saw this at B3D

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23736&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40


Quote:
FarCry Patch 1.32 change log:
# Fixed a Shader Model 3.0 issue that caused graphics corruption on new ATI hardware.


So the plot thickens.....
tertsi
06-08-05, 10:21 AM
Dunno, but some posts over at B3D from Dave Baumann hinted that the initial R520 may be a 16 pipeline only design. If it still manages to hit 10K at 3DMark 2005 with "only" 16 peipelines it may be a hell of deisgn.

Actually even single X850XT PE can hit 10K with 16 pipes and insane clocks... wait and see :)
jAkUp
06-08-05, 10:28 AM
Yea but they managed to do it on air cooling ;)
MUYA
06-08-05, 10:31 AM
850 XT PE hitting 10K on air?? really???
tertsi
06-08-05, 10:32 AM
Yea but they managed to do it on air cooling ;)

yeah, "macci's cooling solution" is pretty much needed :)
gsgrunt
06-08-05, 10:35 AM
Yea but they managed to do it on air cooling ;)

Who is "they"?
AthlonXP1800
06-08-05, 11:27 AM
Yea but they managed to do it on air cooling ;)

NO way it air cooling, Macci did it with a single X850 XT PE overclocked it to over 900MHz with liquid nitrogen cooling scored 9591 3DMarks 05.
OWA
06-08-05, 11:35 AM
I think he meant that they got the 10k with the R520 on air cooling instead of having to use something like Macci's cooling solution on a X850 XT PE to break 10k.
AthlonXP1800
06-08-05, 11:54 AM
I think he meant that they got the 10k with the R520 on air cooling instead of having to use something like Macci's cooling solution on a X850 XT PE to break 10k.

Ah right I was a bit confused, thank for clear it up. :p
JoshMST
06-08-05, 12:51 PM
Well, if this info is in fact true, it will not "kill off" ATI. They still have a lot of good products, and being late to market with R5x0 series of cards is far from being the death knell for the company. Will it affect their bottom line though? Of course. Will it affect shareholder confidence? Definitely. If shareholders don't see ATI as a company that can deliver on a new product, the stock price will tank as people dump shares. It happens. It happened to NVIDIA with the FX series of cards. ATI has the X-Box 360 royalties and payments to help tide them over any product bumps, and I believe they will have a competitive product with NVIDIA once this all blows over. Hell, if the R520 is a more radical design than many are expecting, then perhaps a few months late won't be a big deal if it can outperform the top of the line G70 by 20%.

The main gist of the matter is that ATI is having issues with yields, and what good dice they are getting out may not be fully functional. As for Dave's hints about it being a 16 pipeline design... while he didn't say it directly, I think very few of us have a good idea what the R520 is really about. I think it is going to be a fascinating product, but I just wonder when it will be released.
zakelwe
06-09-05, 02:55 AM
The main gist of the matter is that ATI is having issues with yields, and what good dice they are getting out may not be fully functional. As for Dave's hints about it being a 16 pipeline design... while he didn't say it directly, I think very few of us have a good idea what the R520 is really about. I think it is going to be a fascinating product, but I just wonder when it will be released.

Do you think Dave actualyl knows Josh ?

Regards

Andy
MUYA
06-09-05, 06:56 AM
Do you think Dave actualyl knows Josh ?

Regards

Andy
He will have been given certain hints
JoshMST
06-09-05, 10:17 AM
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that Dave knows quite a bit about it, far more than nearly anyone else not working at ATI.
Banko
06-09-05, 12:30 PM
So what I'm hearing is the R520 may just be a 16x2 design?
JoshMST
06-09-05, 12:50 PM
Oh geeze, not a 16 x 2! I think that it will be like nothing we have really seen before. 16 ROPS with 16 functional units, each unit contains multiple ALU's and a texturing unit. That is my latest best guess!
AthlonXP1800
06-09-05, 05:07 PM
Yes XbitLabs (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20050609093014.html) confirmed ATI having problems with R520. It seem ATI are not very happy with first R520 version, the first version much like NV30, it has very poor yields that ATI cant mass produce R520 chips and also cant ramp up higher core clocks, if ATI want that then they will need to install dustbuster on it. ATI now are in the processing to respin R520 and hope it will improve the yield they require to mass produce R520 chips, but I dont think that will be working with the silicon leaks.

If things go well so ATI probably will launch R520 in August and the cards go retail near Xmas. If things not go well and ATI will canned R520 and take R580 back in drawing board and redesign it to adding SOI need to prevent silicon leaking.
Riptide
06-09-05, 05:10 PM
Well then... Looks like NVidia has it all to themselves this round. It'll likely be Christmas before we see something worth buying out of ATI. :(
JoshMST
06-10-05, 12:58 PM
Unfortunately ATI does not have the ability to utilize a process that has SOI. Currently only IBM and AMD have fabs capable of producing parts that have SOI, and neither of those companies are selling that particular process to 3rd party semis.

If there is leakage, it will have to be addressed by the overall design rather than relying on a new insulator substrate. Low-K does a pretty good job with cutting down leakage, but we honestly don't know if ATI is in fact suffering from excessive leakage, or if it is just a rumor.