Intel to unveil "next-generation architecture" for Desktops!!!

[Superfly]

I new something good was coming from the Intel boys - Pentium M tech to used as basis for new architecture!!

You all know "or should know" how fast the Pentium M is clock for clock, it has shorter execution pipelines than the FX & P4EE

Anyway - here is the quote and link so read on:

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=technologyNews&storyID=2005-08-12T065412Z_01_EIC224763_RTRIDST_0_TECH-INTEL-DC.XML

Intel Corp. is preparing to unveil a significant change in the underlying technology of its computer chips, one that emphasizes power efficiency and multitasking as much as raw speed.

The change, which Intel has billed as its "next-generation architecture," involves alterations to the circuit design of its microprocessors, the central chips in personal computers, which it sells today under the Pentium brand name. The Santa Clara, California-based company said on Thursday it will provide details of the shift at a gathering of technology developers in San Francisco later this month.

In materials released ahead of the gathering, the company said the new technology will allow for energy-efficient chips that can be used in sleeker boxes than today's often clunky desktop machines. Though the new chips will be structurally different, the changes are likely to be transparent to PC users, who would continue to be able to run similar software packages, including Microsoft Windows.

Already, analysts are predicting Intel will borrow heavily from its notebook computer chip line, known as Pentium M, in its designs for next-generation personal computer products. "When they did the Pentium M, they were under tight constraints on power," said Nathan Brookwood, an independent technology analyst and consultant. "Now, desktop and server are facing similar kinds of constraints. It's not so much battery life as it is noise, just the physics of cooling a really hot, small chip," he said.

Pentium M, released in 2003, is best known as the microprocessor component of Intel's Centrino brand of notebook computer chips. Centrino also includes a wireless networking chip and an auxiliary chip for graphics, memory and other functions. The Pentium M processor has won plaudits from technology reviewers for its efficiency, and analysts have long predicted that it would become the successor to the current line of Pentium 4 desktop chips, which some PC makers have criticized as power hogs.

At the show, called the Intel Developer Forum, Intel will also shed light on its new Digital Health group, a start-up venture within the technology bellwether that is aiming to develop products and services to address the rising cost of healthcare for an aging population. The company's Digital Home and Mobility groups will discuss devices, content and services for entertainment, as well as technology to link cellular phones to personal computers.

Much of the discussion throughout the event will focus on multi-core chips, which contain two or more processing cores in a single silicon chip. Multi-core, which allows for more efficient multitasking, is a feature that new Chief Executive Officer Paul Otellini has called one of the keys to the company's future.

here is some info on the Pentium M as a gaming chip, Quote:

a top of the line 2.0 GHz Pentium-M processor trouncing on similar territory as the P4EE and Athlon64 FX processors. Understandably, this was hard for many readers to believe. How could this little mobile chip perform up to par these high end chips which were designed for gamers specifically? Many simply find it hard to comprehend. When we first saw the benchmarks, we felt the same way.

link to some good benchies: http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=dothangaming&page=1

pay careful attention to the overclocking results!!! - imagine this architecture clocked at 2.6-2.8 Ghz - at 2.3 it leaves the FX55 behind

[Pandora's Box]

hmm interesting. im all for intel picking up the ball again and driving down the cost of powerfull gaming cpu's

[Superfly]

its been a long time coming TBH - Pentium 4 is VERY old tech now.

Guess we'll get some more info after the end of the month.

"secretly hope I can buy one in 12 months time" but doubt the new chip will be ready by then :-(

oh well.

[Redeemed]

Now why didn't they OC the A64 chips? I know that the Pentium M IS fast, but I don't find that review to be entirely accurate. I wanna' see it go against the FX-57 and X2 series. And however much they OC the Pentium M, do the same to the A64. I wanna' see which has the greater OC potential: Pentium M or A64. But they never ever cover any of that. Also, I wanna' see how well it does under 64bit apps (once a 64bit version is available). Multi-tasking is also never covered.

It lacks the ability to compete in the 64bit and multi tasking arena. I've never seen a comparison between oc'ing the Pentium M and A64 to see which chip offers the greatest OC potential. When I see a review covering these topics, then I'll be interested.

[superklye]

So let me guess…new motherboards required to upgrade right? And it’s NOT going to be multi-core? So then…6 months after this chip is released, a brand new multi-core version will come that—wait for it—requires the purchase of another motherboard to work.

How is this company still in business? I hate them so much. If ever there was a less consumer-oriented company, I don’t know what it is.

[Redeemed]

Well, I don't HATE Intel, I just HATE how they are currently operating. Right now, I am an AMD Fanboy. But if Intel releases an A64 equivalent or better without costing me both my arms and legs, then I'll probably go neutral. I'd venture out on a branch and try the new Intel chip myself. And if they kept the great product and only made it even better over time WITHOUT requiring a new mobo then I'd probably start swaying towards Intel Fanboy. But...wait...what company does that description remind you of???

A-M-D. :D :D :D

I guess I like the OLD Intel, not the CURRENT Intel.

[Superfly]

Ok but I think your missing my point - and that of the benchmarks - no one is trying to say the pentium M is faster than the FX55 - OC or not. Whats being said is that the underlying architecture of the pentium M is VERY fast - @ 2Ghz its more than a match for the FX55 and P4EE @ 2.3 its faster and @ 2.6 (same as the FX55) it would be well away on its own.

The new architecture wont be just a pentium M for the desktop it will take the great features of the pentium M (short pipes for very good clock/performance ratio) low power requirements and then add dual core/EMT64/SSE3 etc etc.

[Superfly]

Well, I don't HATE Intel, I just HATE how they are currently operating. Right now, I am an AMD Fanboy. But if Intel releases an A64 equivalent or better without costing me both my arms and legs, then I'll probably go neutral. I'd venture out on a branch and try the new Intel chip myself. And if they kept the great product and only made it even better over time WITHOUT requiring a new mobo then I'd probably start swaying towards Intel Fanboy. But...wait...what company does that description remind you of???

A-M-D. :D :D :D

I guess I like the OLD Intel, not the CURRENT Intel.

I know a lot of people have issues with intels business practice - all fair points as well TBH.

im not trying to say lets all go buy Intel next year - but keep an open mind guys - if after all is said and done the chip is FAST - I dont care who makes it, ill buy 2!!!!!

hehe

food for thought chaps........lots going to happen in 2006 (Vista, new Intel architecture, G80)

[Redeemed]

But... by adding all those DESKTOP FEATURES, the power requirements WILL BE INCREASED. Add a second core, approximate DOUBLE POWER CONSUMPTION. Add TRUE 64bit, SSE3, etc- I'm personally expecting the power consuption to JUST be lower than that of the A64.

Yes, I admit that the Pentium M HAS potential, I'll even say that it IS potential. But these reviews aren't fair. It is like ATI boasting how their X850XT PE that was cooled by NitroGlycerin and OC'd beyond belief could outperform dual 6800Ultras. Uh...DUH!!!

Show me which chip has the greater OC headroom. Honestly, I don't know. The Pentium M can OC pretty high, but is it higher than the A64, the same, less? Which one is it? And how will it do with 64bit computing??? What about dual cores? Will a dual core Pentium M be capable of competing with an X2? These are the things that interest me. Currently, I've seen no review cover these topics.

Just rehashing how the Pentium M has potential is getting old in my opinion. I want results, not hype. Show my the MAX OC (air cooling) for the Pentium M, then show me the max OC for the X2 4800 and FX-57. I want to see which chip has the higher OC potential. Then, compare the chips against each other while at their peak OC. I want to see THOSE results.

Untill I see such a review, I remain un-interested. It is already obvious the Pentium M has potential, this is NOTHING NEW. I've been aware of it's potential since the beginning of all this "Pentium M Hype". I want to see EVEN COMPARISONS. Not just repeats of ATI's stunt when nVidia unveiled SLi with the 6800Ultras.

[Superfly]

I know what your after - and with good reason but its rather early for those kind of benchies.

Im glad to see your open to the idea though - it IS a very fast chip and with some tweaking and a full feature set for the desktop of tommorrow who knows ...

[tristancarton]

about time intel grabbed ahold of their killer p3/p-m architecture and dumped netburst. can't wait to see what merom is capable of in late 06. i expect intel to strike back at the desktop market with a vengeance. a revised and souped up 65nm p-m should be able to do that.

[JoKeRr]

I smell CONROE

[DSC]

Conroe, the desktop equivalent of the Merom mobile processor. Merom is the successor to Yonah, which will be the successor to the current Pentium-M Dothan cpu.

[superklye]

They also need to get rid of the damned FSB.

[Superfly]

imagine yonah or merom with an on die memory controller - holly s**t.

one can dream

[Subtestube]

Conroe, the desktop equivalent of the Merom mobile processor. Merom is the successor to Yonah, which will be the successor to the current Pentium-M Dothan cpu.

Yep. My guess is that this 'new tech' will be Conroe, which is slated for release in 2H 2k6, according to the current intel roadmap:

http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050808_190135.html

[shabby]

Sweet a new pentium 3, i better get all the dust of my bh6 mobo :D

[Red_Shift]

Yup it's conroe:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/08/12/intel_next-gen_architecture/

Redeemed I think you're missing the point, how can you expect a mobile cpu to have a great OC potential? Conroe is just based on pentium M architecture, not a copy of it. Obviously not only the OC potential will be higher in Conroe cpu's but also the stock clocks will be higher than pentium M's. Maybe 2ghz or more will just be the lower end part of Conroe.
Also 65nm manufacturing process and new power saving techniques will definitely lower the power consumption and thus heat.

Hummmm Xmas 2006 will definitely be the right time for me to buy a new system (we should also have desktop Blu-Rays by then).

[Alaa]

Intel's Architecture Shift Could Be a Shaky Platform click here (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1847924,00.asp) :thumbdwn:

[Zelda_fan]

Hopefully it's based off of the Pentium M architecture. I remember Tomshardware managed to put a Pentium M in a desktop board via a converter, and thanks to the faster bus speeds it PWND the Athlon FX. If they can get it together an apply that to a desktop processor, they will unleash a new generation of performance on us.

[Superfly]

Intel's Architecture Shift Could Be a Shaky Platform click here (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1847924,00.asp) :thumbdwn:


nope - not likely.

the basis of the chip is already proven, thats just wild techy speculation based on no facts.

[msxyz]

The Pentium M is just a tweaked P6 architecture.

So -basically- it will be P3 vs Athlon all over again. Those of you who remeber those days maybe also remember that the Coppermine and the Thunderbird were head to head in many tests. The Athlon won clearly only in FPU intensive tasks. Plus the Athlon scaled better while the 0.18u Coppermine reached only 1 GHz. That's why Intel panicked and introduced the Pentium IV, although in its first incarnation it was hardly a good CPU. When I picked up my Tualatin at 1.33 GHz in many tests it beated a 1.8GHz PIV and so did a similary clocked Athlon

Now fast forward to today. A big part in Pentium M performance is played by the huge, low latecy L2 cache. But the core is essentially still a P6. It's not wrong to say that Intel still follows a brute force approach. Yesterday it was speed now it's cache. With their 12" wafers they're less penalized by yields and die space than AMD with its 8-10" fabs

[Redeemed]

I don't doubt the Pentium M, I doubt this new chip based off of the Pentium M. EM64T is not full 64bit, is it? I heard that all Intel did was increase the registers from 32 to 48. Not full on 64. I'm no engineer and know little about the design and architecture involved with CPUs, but if that is true won't even this new chip lag in 64bit apps? Currently the P4s do and I doubt it'd due entirely to the P4 design as the P4 was never intended for 64bit computing. Nor was it intended for Multi-core computing.

The A64 was designed with both of these in mind. I just wonder if the Pentium M will be able to compete with the A64 upon its first release. Or will it take several revisions before we see a truly competitive part? This kind of reminds me of the whole nVidia/SLi/SM3.0/HDR thing with ATI/CrossFire/R520/SM3.0/HDR. Are people going to be willing (in the masses) to shell out money for a new product using (for Intel) new technology when there is another company that has had a product out utilizing that technology for several years now and has had the time to "perfect" it? Probably. One word: marketing. Something AMD doesn't do enough of in my opinion.

[Alaa]

i dont think intel will outperform Amd...but everything is possible..lets wait and see and stop tht FAN talk..comparing pentium M to AMD now has alot of variables..it will be fair when DDR2 comes to AMD in 2Q'2006

[coldpower27]

Conroe from what I heard is new architecture, what kind of architecture remians to be seen, but from what rumors point to, it follow the same philosophies as the Pentium M has, high performance per watt, high performance per clock.

It will also incorporate the lessons learned from the Pentium 4 architecture, such as Extended Memory 64 Technology, which is almost a given.

These however are guesses:

Good branch prediction, micro-ops fusion, pipeline stages between P4 and Pentium M, good thermals, Dual Channel DDR2-667 minimum, with later intorudction of CSI or whatever it is, lower latency cache then Prescott Pentium 4, enhanced floating point units.

Conroe also looks to be Dual Core from the start, as is Merom.

64 Bit helps Intel sometimes, a bit less then it helps AMD I would say, but still helps.

Pentium M core has been pretty small since it's introduction compared to AMD Athlon 64's, most of the die surface area on Dothan is dedicated to cache. Yonah will also have a small die due to being manufactured on 65nm node. I would expect Merom/Conroe to have small die sizes as well.

It will be fair when AMD adopts DDR2 in Q2 2006??? I Don't get that, I mean if AMD wants to wait quite awhile to implement DDR2 technology, that it's own damn fault, it's quite accpetable for the Pentium M and Pentium 4 to utilize DDR2 and whatever advantages/disadvanages it brings due to Intel putting the R&D to impelment it early and compare it to Athlon 64 with it's DDR1 tech, I mean we don't complain how it's unfair that AMD has the internal memory controller advantage or anything.

Also I don't expect Intel to implement an internal memory controller as they seem to like the flexibility of implementing new memory technologies earlier on.