Catholic Church no longer swears Bible to be all true

[Slyder]

Never mind this.. posted in error, now cant delete. :eek:

[DiscipleDOC]

Nope...i guess you did not take up american history in School.

I guess you were too busy praying in school or did you actually learn something of value?


What the point of me providing links, i provided a link about feds going after pornography and everyone avoided it, so I wont bother. Do the research yourself.

You are a total, and complete :ass:, you piece of crap.

I'm getting kinda tired of you making these little childish remarks at people that do not agree with you. This is about the third time you've entered a debate, and instead of debating, you've debased the person that caught you on your little non-proven statement. If you can't provide facts, why don't you stay in the hardware/software forum, where you can start rumors of stuff that you don't have to prove?

You thumb your nose up at people because you sit behind the comfort of your keyboard, and instead of having a complete thought, you lash our at people that actually debate things in this forum. You say things you would not DARE say to a person if you were face to face. If you seen me, you would not make those statements, because if you did, I would quickly make you swallow a few of your teeth.

Thanks for showing that you have no balls, :ass: hole.

[Ghosthunter]

You are a total, and complete :ass:, you piece of crap.

I'm getting kinda tired of you making these little childish remarks at people that do not agree with you. This is about the third time you've entered a debate, and instead of debating, you've debased the person that caught you on your little non-proven statement. If you can't provide facts, why don't you stay in the hardware/software forum, where you can start rumors of stuff that you don't have to prove?

You thumb your nose up at people because you sit behind the comfort of your keyboard, and instead of having a complete thought, you lash our at people that actually debate things in this forum. You say things you would not DARE say to a person if you were face to face. If you seen me, you would not make those statements, because if you did, I would quickly make you swallow a few of your teeth.

Thanks for showing that you have no balls, :ass: hole.


And this is a post from someone who believe in Jesus? LMAO


I think I proven my point.

[DiscipleDOC]

And this is a post from someone who believe in Jesus? LMAO


I think I proven my point.

Heh, actually, you've only proven how stupid and ignorant you are. Jesus never let anyone walk over Him, and guess what? You will not walk over me. You can hide behind your keyboard and insult me, and you think I'm going to let you do that? Think again.

As I said, you're only doing this because you are sitting behind your keyboard. You would never say those things in my face. And that's a fact.

[saturnotaku]

I think I proven my point.

That you failed fifth grade English?

[Slyder]

Come on you 2...

http://www.johnnypeaceseed.com/buttons/Jeasus-Says-Peace-Now.jpg

:angel:

[UDawg]

Nope...i guess you did not take up american history in School.

I guess you were too busy praying in school or did you actually learn something of value?


What is the point of me providing links, i provided a link about feds going after pornography and everyone avoided it, so I wont bother. Do the research yourself.
We took US history and even in college. What I am trying to figure out is where you learned the none-sense you keep posting.

So you showed where the feds went after pornography, big deal. My point was that the government does legislate morality all the time.

You have dodged my point and then turned this personal. You would have only done this if you can't back up your claims. You still cannot discredit the fact that Thomas Jefferson who was one of the least religious founding fathers funded with government money Catholic priest to convert indians and he held church services in the capitol building. This Flies DIRECTLY in the fact the notion you and the other atheists have been trying to lie about for the last 40 years.

I say this is a Christian country with a secular government and cite other countries like Mexico and Iraq are Catholic and Muslim countries and no one disagrees with that. Yet when I call the US a Christian country you deny it. Well your logic is not there.

[UDawg]

And this is a post from someone who believe in Jesus? LMAO
So you provoke someone and then are surprised when they do get mad? You lost the argument a long time ago. You cannot back up your claims. You then run away from the term atheist but scoff at Christians every chance you get. You are intellectually dishonest.

You expect perfection from Christians but refuse to see your own flaws. That is called a hypocrit. A person such as your self that revels in his hypocracy is called a arrogant hypocrit.

Stop posting none sense and back up your claims.

I think I proven my point.
You don't have a point. If you want to say that all people are flawed then welcome to the obvious club. If your point is you don't like Christians, who cares. We didn't ask you.

[Ghosthunter]

So you provoke someone and then are surprised when they do get mad? You lost the argument a long time ago. You cannot back up your claims. You then run away from the term atheist but scoff at Christians every chance you get. You are intellectually dishonest.

You expect perfection from Christians but refuse to see your own flaws. That is called a hypocrit. A person such as your self that revels in his hypocracy is called a arrogant hypocrit.

Stop posting none sense and back up your claims.

You don't have a point. If you want to say that all people are flawed then welcome to the obvious club. If your point is you don't like Christians, who cares. We didn't ask you.


You make so many judgements about myself, but know very little. talk about being a hypocrite

You have insulted me many times in this thread, but it does not bother me.

Ignorance is bliss.

[UDawg]

You make so many judgements about myself, but know very little. talk about being a hypocrite

You have insulted me many times in this thread, but it does not bother me.

Ignorance is bliss.
So you are going to ignore my challenges. Ok I will venture down this road with you a bit.

I made the judgement that you don't like Christians at least on the scale that you think we are silly for believing in what we do. Since most atheists fall into this catagory it is a safe assumption.

Since you argue that this isn't a Christians country and deny its Christians roots you are either a secular liberal which is a atheist or a member of another smaller religion. This is also a safe assumption. Now since you won't say what you believe in I will continue to assume the fore mentioned until proven wrong. This has nothing to do with hypocracy and everything to do with guessing what your core beliefs are. One last thing, it is almost a exclusive liberal trait to not want to say what you really believe. There is another safe assumption on what you believe. I find striking is your unwillingness to address anything and be bothered by my assumptions on your ideaology.


Now I have a challenge for you. Show me where I insulted you. Show me. I have made fun of your claims about Jesus never existing but that is not a insult. Being instulted is something you choose to be. Maybe you are just too think skinned for the argument.

[Ringthane]

That you failed fifth grade English?

Him fail English? Unpossible.

[netviper13]

What really gets me that Atheism is a minority...and they are trying to control the majority. Whatever happened to that tolorence, that you preach? Oh, that's right, that's only when YOU'RE being discriminated against.....:rolleyes:

FWIW, the fastest growing religious affiliation in the US is no religious affiliation at all, AKA atheism.

America was a nation designed to have predominantly majority rule, but also protect the minority at the same time. Of course the minority is going to cramp on the wants of the majority, that is exactly what the Founders intended.

[Sazar]

What really gets me that Atheism is a minority...and they are trying to control the majority. Whatever happened to that tolorence, that you preach? Oh, that's right, that's only when YOU'RE being discriminated against.....:rolleyes:

I don't hear anyone complain when various things are changed around to include the word "GOD" on the basis of a minority group pushing its agenda. And yet when the same thing happens afterwards for the opposite reason somehow it becomes a whole different argument.

Does your last sentence include this? Or is it only when perceived anti-christian actions are occuring?

Let me include an obligatory :rolleyes: to emphasize the point.

[Sazar]

Him fail English? Unpossible.

Oh noes :eek:

/me waits for Saturn to say Ring failed second grade English.

[sytaylor]

I don't hear anyone complain when various things are changed around to include the word "GOD" on the basis of a minority group pushing its agenda. And yet when the same thing happens afterwards for the opposite reason somehow it becomes a whole different argument.

Does your last sentence include this? Or is it only when perceived anti-christian actions are occuring?

Let me include an obligatory :rolleyes: to emphasize the point.

Its the victim mentality. I just don't see it (and Udawg will swear to the hilt I'm incapeable of doing so from bias or something). Yet, being as honest as I can be, I cannot see how on earth christianity is being pushed out of life in the USA. Sure people are trying to prevent it from steam rolling their own beliefs, and right they should too, but that doesn't mean they in turn are trying to denounce any form of christianity in the entire nation.

[Peoples-Agent]

Oh drats, the book about everyone's favourite imaginery friend has been put under the spotlight again.

The Bible was written by humans, and not on a scientific basis therefore it is questionable enough to be devoid, but not ignored is it has many uses.
Such as good morals in which to base our ethics upon, i.e why the US is a Christian nation beyond doubt.

One day in the future, like when kids eventually learn Santa Claus wasn't real, and everyone acknowledges their imaginary friend doesn't actually exist as a whole and people don't feel the need to mock others beliefs for the hell of doing it, ala Atheist, then perhaps we can find something more interesting to fight and war about.

If there is a true Christian speaking on these boards, please answer me this.
If someone lives well, perhaps within the conditions of small print set out within the pages, does no harm to others and at all times tries to help those less fortunate whenever they can, but at the same time has no room for a faith or God as they feel it would stand in their way and ability to be a better human being, are they refused the joys God has to offer in Heaven on these grounds?

[Ringthane]

If there is a true Christian speaking on these boards, please answer me this. If someone lives well, perhaps within the conditions of small print set out within the pages, does no harm to others and at all times tries to help those less fortunate whenever they can, but at the same time has no room for a faith or God as they feel it would stand in their way and ability to be a better human being, are they refused the joys God has to offer in Heaven on these grounds?

It all depends on if there's a God or not, doesn't it? I think the Bible says that a person needs to be saved to be accepted into Heaven. And I've heard people discuss that just as faith without works is nothing, so works without faith is also worthless.

So the answer to that question really depends on if there is a God or not, doesn't it? That's something every human has to answer for him or herself. If you believe in God, and do what the Bible says, and there is a God, then you go to Heaven. If you don't believe in God, and there is a God, you go to Hell. But nobody knows 100% for sure what's waiting for us, so it's up to each of us to decide our beliefs and what we should/shouldn't do.

[UDawg]

I don't hear anyone complain when various things are changed around to include the word "GOD" on the basis of a minority group pushing its agenda. And yet when the same thing happens afterwards for the opposite reason somehow it becomes a whole different argument.

Does your last sentence include this? Or is it only when perceived anti-christian actions are occuring?

Let me include an obligatory :rolleyes: to emphasize the point.
You have no point as usual. It is atheist groups that are suing to get crosses removed from the side of the road where people have died. It is atheist groups that are suing to try and get churchs taken of tax exemption. It is atheist groups that are suing to take under God out of the pledge. These atheist groups are a tiny minority and they NEVER use the voting booth for their agenda. if they did I would not have one problem with it. If the people don't want this to be a Christian nation then let them vote for that. Instead what we have is a small faction trying to FORCE their belief on the rest of the country via a tyranical court.

[UDawg]

Its the victim mentality. I just don't see it (and Udawg will swear to the hilt I'm incapeable of doing so from bias or something). Yet, being as honest as I can be, I cannot see how on earth christianity is being pushed out of life in the USA. Sure people are trying to prevent it from steam rolling their own beliefs, and right they should too, but that doesn't mean they in turn are trying to denounce any form of christianity in the entire nation.
1. You don't even live here. 2. You are not a Christian. 3. You don't know what you are talking about. I don't venture into areas of your country's business because I don't have a clue of what it going on over there. Why you presume you do know about my country is funny.

Further more I am not a victim. I do not feel persecuted in any way. I am only pointing out what I see going on in my country a place which YOU DON"T LIVE IN.

You then come back with a smart ass remark such as "Sure people are trying to prevent it from steam rolling their own beliefs" as if they are freedom fighters. I have showed how they have NO standing according to the constitution. These atheist groups are wanting to change America to something which has never been. We want to preserve what has always been in America.

[Peoples-Agent]

I have to agree with UDawg there, for crying out loud if they are not inflicting upon your life and what you want to do that is within reason and not harming anyone else, they never stop it as such, they simply speak out against it where as in your face Atheist groups add to reason why I guess I am more Agnostic these days.

If I am at a funeral of a loved one, i'm not going to yell out in disolve at the ceremony in use of prayer nor God, I want them to be equipped best as possible for an afterlife (If there is one!), writhe with self importance to deprive the dead any mark of respect, be it religous or otherwise... even the devil himself would want to whoop your ass.

Christianity in the western world, albeit a religion derived upon alot of guilt trips (Sin this, sin that!), has evolved far quicker than most other religions and our societies reflect upon this. If it helps to create a more stable balance then just leave it be. A World without religion may or may not have been a more peaceful,liberal and more eutopian one but there is no point going over that, ....just leave people be if they aren't harming anybody.

[UDawg]

Oh drats, the book about everyone's favourite imaginery friend has been put under the spotlight again.

The Bible was written by humans, and not on a scientific basis therefore it is questionable enough to be devoid, but not ignored is it has many uses.
Such as good morals in which to base our ethics upon, i.e why the US is a Christian nation beyond doubt.

One day in the future, like when kids eventually learn Santa Claus wasn't real, and everyone acknowledges their imaginary friend doesn't actually exist as a whole and people don't feel the need to mock others beliefs for the hell of doing it, ala Atheist, then perhaps we can find something more interesting to fight and war about.

If there is a true Christian speaking on these boards, please answer me this.
If someone lives well, perhaps within the conditions of small print set out within the pages, does no harm to others and at all times tries to help those less fortunate whenever they can, but at the same time has no room for a faith or God as they feel it would stand in their way and ability to be a better human being, are they refused the joys God has to offer in Heaven on these grounds?
I am willing to bet you won't accept any answer from any of us Christians because of the bold part. Your view of what a Christian is, is dervived from ignorance. You expect Christians to be perfectly pure as the driven snow and if any is not they are not a true Christian.

The answer to your question is no. They will not be with God. They will be cast down. The goal is not to "get to heaven" it is to reunite our selves with God our creator. Most think that the goal is to get to heaven, well God tells us if we do things for our own glory this will not please him and you will not be reunited with Him. We the good things we do because we want to have a realtionship with our God.

Now you can say how terrible God is and other like things but I have explained why they will not be with God in heaven. The goal is the relationship with God, not to do good deeds to get into heaven. It is not a ladder system. It is a relationship. A reuniting of the creator with the created.

[Peoples-Agent]

No, I just hope your Imaginary friend guides you better and to not snap down people who are apparently "ignorant" and instead share values and your opinion with less hostile means and ways. I am more than willing to listen to your beliefs and values, infact, I embrace them to get some understanding.

Thank you for clearing that up, and I hope it works out for you up there (wherever that is) with the big man himself.

My judgement from what a Christian is derived from the a**holes who keep knocking on my door telling me I am going to hell if I do not conform to their beliefs. That is all ....not the over view of Christianity, just my personal experiences of it and how it has had a big part in much of my misery in life to date, but I remain open minded about the greater good at hand here, although I feel that even "God" himself isn't responsible for that, just perhaps had a half decent say in it with a pretty good publicist to boot.

[Ringthane]

No, I just hope your Imaginary friend guides you better and to not snap down people who are apparently "ignorant" and instead share values and your opinion with less hostile means and ways. I am more than willing to listen to your beliefs and values, infact, I embrace them to get some understanding.

Thank you for clearing that up, and I hope it works out for you up there (wherever that is) with the big man himself.

My judgement from what a Christian is derived from the a**holes who keep knocking on my door telling me I am going to hell if I do not conform to their beliefs. That is all ....not the over view of Christianity, just my personal experiences of it and how it has had a big part in much of my misery in life to date, but I remain open minded about the greater good at hand here, although I feel that even "God" himself isn't responsible for that, just perhaps had a half decent say in it with a pretty good publicist to boot.

Well, if you're judging Christianity by the behavior of some of the people who've come to your door, then I don't know what anyone could say to make you think any differently. That's like never eating meat again because you got a couple burned hamburgers in your life.

[UDawg]

No, I just hope your Imaginary friend guides you better and to not snap down people who are apparently "ignorant" and instead share values and your opinion with less hostile means and ways. I am more than willing to listen to your beliefs and values, infact, I embrace them to get some understanding.

Thank you for clearing that up, and I hope it works out for you up there (wherever that is) with the big man himself.

My judgement from what a Christian is derived from the a**holes who keep knocking on my door telling me I am going to hell if I do not conform to their beliefs. That is all ....not the over view of Christianity, just my personal experiences of it and how it has had a big part in much of my misery in life to date, but I remain open minded about the greater good at hand here, although I feel that even "God" himself isn't responsible for that, just perhaps had a half decent say in it with a pretty good publicist to boot.
My point about ignorance comes not from a place of my percieve elevated status nor was it a put down as a judgement of some intellectual inability on your part. I comes from many on this forum who think they know scripture but do not have the slightest clue. If I offended you I am sorry. It was not my intent but my intent is irrelavent since the outcome resulted in a offence.

Now WRT to those who knock on your door telling you that you are going to hell, they are wrong. I can show them where in the bible they are wrong in talking to people this way. Jesus did not go around saying "you are going to hell" He talked about forgiveness and repentance. He talked about adherance to the law.

The bible tells us when we witness to be kind and understanding. It gives us direct instructions on how to witness. You cannot attract bees to a flower with vinager, so how can you attract anyone to your message with fire and brimstone. As an example, after the pharsees went away from Jesus he stood before Mary and said where are your accusors woman? They do not condem you and neither do I. Go and sin no more. He did not tell here stop being a **** or you will go to hell. He showed her grace even though she had lived a terrible life up to that point. Jesus was worried with the condition of her heart and repentance and not how terrible she had been.

[Peoples-Agent]

Well, if you're judging Christianity by the behavior of some of the people who've come to your door, then I don't know what anyone could say to make you think any differently. That's like never eating meat again because you got a couple burned hamburgers in your life.

There is alot more to the story than that, was just a swift typed example.
I went to a Church of England primary school in an area which was 75% Asian / Muslim during the first Gulf war, so as you can imagine conflict was there, and many experiences involving Christians as a whole have been negative ones at that, i.e getting my ass whooped for refusing to beat up on muslim children by Christians, then having it covered up by the blasted Christian Council thing they had in the area, and then having to face repucussions from the Muslim community also. As far as I am concerned , religion itself bares less importance than chuckled toilet humour to me and is responsible for more conflict than good.

But hey, that is just my personal experience with it, alot more to it than that, and if people live good lives with their God at their side, I am all for it.
But when it fails and sides are drawn, people seperate it becomes nothing more than common "Soccer hooliganism" about which side you are supporting.
Be it a violent confrontation or a debate which devides people rather than unite them, but hey, seeing as our imaginary friend is here to guide us to the light and to "All be together" none of that matters does it.